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"When will the Myths Die" Topic

19 Posts

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1,460 hits since 6 Dec 2018
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UshCha06 Dec 2018 3:50 a.m. PST

We were out at Recon on Saturday. To a man everybody was impressed by the FDM prints. Even the one or two 1/72 axe wielding Warriors were praised and the surprise when they saw them that they expected lots of lines, that they could not see on the actual model. When will the 3D print haters Myths die?

Personal logo PzGeneral Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 5:10 a.m. PST

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are the lines in the 3D models dependent on the quality of the printer?

Dynaman878906 Dec 2018 5:31 a.m. PST

> Correct me if I'm wrong, but are the lines in the 3D models dependent on the quality of the printer?

correct – and it will get less noticeable over time as printers improve.

Tommy2006 Dec 2018 6:58 a.m. PST

Myth? TMP link

Vigilant06 Dec 2018 7:10 a.m. PST

Agree with Tommy20. The "myth" will only die when the quality improves all round on all scales. Some of the models advertised on TMP are very rough and not all that cheaper than the much better resin or plastic versions. I also saw the models at Recon. The models were pretty good for the size, but were very small. For those of us who game in 28mm the lines are a much greater problem because they are more obvious.

Winston Smith06 Dec 2018 8:18 a.m. PST

I just ignore the lines. I just spray painted black prime as if it were resin or metal. Then spray painted the base coat.
On the table they look fine, mainly because my eyes ain't what they used to be.

The lines are not a Myth. It all depends on what you are willing to tolerate.

On the other hand, the Mini-Me from Minuteman was perfect, no lines. This was a 3D scan of me done at Historicon. "I" was mounted heroically on a horse as an AWI General. However, there was a heck of a lot of "scaffolding" around the mini to support undercuts. It took a long time to clean, and at one point I cut off a horse's leg.
But all done, it looks terrific.

lloydthegamer Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 9:14 a.m. PST

Quality also depends on the plastic used, doesn't it?

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 9:43 a.m. PST

I have some very nice prints that cost a premium price from Shapeways.

I'm cleaning up some really lumpy-lined ones now from a friend who has an older model affordable printer, and whatever plastic he uses prints out like a thickly coiled fishing line.

I've got some semi-decent prints from another friend with a more recent model affordable printer.

There is no myth. There is a great range of quality available.

Personal logo Patrick R Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 9:50 a.m. PST

The rendering software can also make a difference, the exact same CAD model printed on the same printer can look very different with different software.

Newer generations are getting increasingly finer and are basically suitable to print minis if you are not worried about every little detail.

The new resin printers crank out models that are as smooth as a baby's bottom and can do multiples in one single run, but they smell like Satan's stool and need curing with infrared light.

Shagnasty Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 10:27 a.m. PST

Y'all are welcome to them, lines or no.

Personal logo Bashytubits Supporting Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 11:48 a.m. PST

The type of 3D printer matters the most. The 3D scan mini me was probably done on an SLA printer, the quality cannot be beat. Any FDM printer will have lines no matter what. There are very simple methods to help with this, such as brushing on a coat of PVA Elmers glue allowing to dry then primering. You can also reduce the layer sizes and slow the print speed to increase the quality. Once painted and on the table you will not see the lines.

Personal logo Extra Crispy Sponsoring Member of TMP06 Dec 2018 11:50 a.m. PST

My issue with the lines is they act like little capillaries and wick paint all over. Very, very hard to paint. I tried it once and decide to wait until the technology improved before buying anything else.

But that Elmer's trick is new so I'll keep that in mind.

machinehead06 Dec 2018 12:41 p.m. PST

This is a printed model from Shapeways, it had minimal lines that can't be seen after painting. link Got it from here. link

Personal logo Patrick R Supporting Member of TMP07 Dec 2018 3:54 a.m. PST

Most household printers are of the "melt plastic wire through a hot nozzle" type system. They way they build up layers results in tiny lines because the mechanical arms have a tiny amount of wobble in them. Better quality printers are much more solid and have greater control over the nozzle and it's exact position on the XYZ axis.

Shapeways uses all kinds of sophisticated printers to produce models, they work through different methods, which depending on how much you spend, will progressively get better.

If you want perfect models you can take your CAD design to a specialist who has access to machinery that can print models to extremely tiny tolerances (think electronics, medical tools, jet engine parts etc) but the price vastly exceeds our hobby budgets unless you really want a single perfect model at any cost.

UshCha07 Dec 2018 8:13 a.m. PST

I think Machine head has it, what lines? In our test exhibit NOBODY noticed the impact on even our FDM printer sample on the sample painted figure or the painted vehicles and we are to lazy to do any surface prep. I am told that it is just about visible if the angle is around 5 degrees but few vehicles have any significant surfaces at that angle.

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP08 Dec 2018 8:56 p.m. PST

Exhibit B: the myth lives: TMP link

It is nice to see models with finer lines; so yes, you had properly happy viewers at your your Recon booth.

UshCha09 Dec 2018 4:05 a.m. PST

AHH but does it in reality disperse the myth? I counted about 28 lines on the Glasis. At 0.1mm layer that's about 2.8mm So you are looking at a model at vastly the wrong size the photo is massively over real sixze. Stand some yards back so its the size of a 1/144 model like ours that use 0,1mm layer hight and then look for the lines. The myth should die QED. ;-).

Who asked this joker09 Dec 2018 7:33 a.m. PST

I just ignore the lines. I just spray painted black prime as if it were resin or metal. Then spray painted the base coat.
On the table they look fine, mainly because my eyes ain't what they used to be.

The lines are not a Myth. It all depends on what you are willing to tolerate.

The mantra for painting traditional miniatures is to do a light undercoat so as not to take away the fine detail. Whe it comes to FDM, priming should be heavy so as to fill the lines somewhat. The detail will still remain.

Winston Smiths idea of priming and then top coating accomplishes this nicely. Having eyes that are more than 50 years old does help as well. wink

UshCha09 Dec 2018 12:06 p.m. PST

On a more serious note I am working on new Markers for Maneouvere Group that I hope can be marketed ready printaed from AOTRS Shipyards. I ran them out on the Low resolution mode so they really do have slight lines as the layers are 0.3mm thick. I painted them with White PVA I think its similar to Elemers white Glue in the US. It does seem to reduce heavy lining so may be an option, so the markers can be sold at minimum cost.

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