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"US Invasion of France?" Topic

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Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian12 Nov 2018 4:20 p.m. PST

Inspired by some recent events, I started wondering about that…

So, imagine a French president who suddenly converts to Islam (!) and is supported by French Islamist gangs in the streets.

And, imagine a supernationalist US president who is willing to "save the French republic" with a strike at Paris, using US NATO forces.

To make this at all possible, Germany would have to be at least willing to allow the US to use NATO bases, and protect them using its forces.

Would the US-based forces have any chance of reaching Paris against the French army? What about the air war? Would there be a naval component to this war?

I imagine the campaign could be balanced by adjusting a 'loyalty' factor – do the individual French units fight, remain in their barracks, or even go over to the US side?

Would any NATO countries participate with the U.S.?

Of course, this is wildly far-fetched, but crazy ideas sometimes make the best scenarios.

Thresher0112 Nov 2018 4:31 p.m. PST


Of course, they might have many, many, other sympathizers in adjoining countries to make enforcing an effective siege very difficult.

Winston Smith12 Nov 2018 5:10 p.m. PST

Germany and Europe in general have their fill of "ultranationalist" American presidents. Naming no names.
I see absolutely no cooperation on their part.
Nor should we expect any for such a flimsy excuse to invade a sovereign nation.

Scum123412 Nov 2018 5:23 p.m. PST

Surely we only need to send in one guy to accept their surrender?

Isn't that the "official" American view of the French?

Thresher0112 Nov 2018 5:46 p.m. PST

Why waste his time?

Just send a letter, thru that postal service some in the EU are threatening to shut down.

BrianW12 Nov 2018 6:09 p.m. PST

To slightly rework a quote from Fred Thompson in Hunt for Red October: "This thread will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to not be Dawghaused by it."

15mm and 28mm Fanatik12 Nov 2018 6:27 p.m. PST

Anything is possible. If a radical Islamist becomes president France will likely be wracked by civil war between Muslim and Christian factions so its military will likewise be divided and lack unity.

The key is to make sure that French nukes are secured so they cannot be employed against the invasion force.

ZULUPAUL Supporting Member of TMP12 Nov 2018 6:31 p.m. PST

We wouldn't bother with France, they seem to have been imploding as a nation recently IMHO.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian12 Nov 2018 8:37 p.m. PST

Seems like a great excuse to get my modern French onto the tabletop!

Cyrus the Great12 Nov 2018 9:05 p.m. PST

Inspired by some recent events, I started wondering about that…

What events would those be, Bill?

repaint13 Nov 2018 12:46 a.m. PST

political commentators have been discussing for a few years already the possibility of a war between the Muslims and local "locals".

The army has been preparing for scenarios where "unknown" groups of people from the projects lead by elements trained in foreign countries take over XXXX locations and spread violence.

But hey, Europe has had ex-Yugoslavia as a direct example of what can happen between too heterogeneous populations.

In regard of the US, maybe a scenario in the middle east or Sea of South China is more likely…

Andoreth13 Nov 2018 2:32 a.m. PST

Are we not setting this the wrong way round? Given the growing polarisation of opinions in the USA, a more playable scenario would be the deployment of NATO forces through Canada to support the beleaguered government there when civil unrest becomes endemic. And of course to secure the nukes to make sure rogue groups do not try to start World War 3.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian13 Nov 2018 6:28 a.m. PST

There are lots of possibilities for modern what-if campaigns, if you keep it "fun" and don't worry too much about the real world.

Canadian Civil War has been the topic of several boardgames, I believe.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian13 Nov 2018 6:29 a.m. PST

What events would those be, Bill?

Not going there, don't want to have to Dawghouse myself. grin

mad monkey 113 Nov 2018 8:03 a.m. PST

Just use the premise for Invasion: America or Fortress America if you want to put your French on de table. You can have French German and Russian armor vs US. Skirmish games can have French troops(or Europeans of your favorite flavor) vs redneck partisans or Marines. Go wild and have fun.

Earl of the North13 Nov 2018 9:43 a.m. PST

Or US civil war, with NATO forces supporting one side perhaps…or NATO operating out of Canada to protect the border. One thing that used to come up a lot for US civil wars was Western Special Forces being used to seize nuclear weapons, nuclear material etc. Lots of options for French regular troops to be used to fight their way to a location and then withdraw with hazardous material.

foxweasel13 Nov 2018 9:44 a.m. PST

If people have a moral objection to gaming the scenario, just play it as an exercise with the troops using TES kit instead of live rounds. It will play exactly the same, instead of dead you have sleeping.

14Bore13 Nov 2018 1:05 p.m. PST

So a scenario of a invading force but would think it would be joining a civil war no matter how lop sided it could be.

Personal logo aegiscg47 Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2018 3:14 p.m. PST

I find it amusing that all of the articles about NATO, possible Russian invasion of Europe, and even this far fetched scenario act as if it's still WW2 and there's millions of men, thousands of aircraft on both sides, etc., which simply isn't the case anymore.

France doesn't even have 20 combat vessels and it would be interesting to see how many of their combat aircraft are even operational. When they had to intervene in Mali the U.S. had to fly most of the transport missions. Most European armies have no projection power anymore and the only thing standing in the way of the Russians rolling to the Atlantic (well, two things; the U.S. in NATO) is that the Russian armed forces aren't capable of that kind of operation anymore either.

Dn Jackson Supporting Member of TMP14 Nov 2018 12:15 a.m. PST

Odd, I posted a reply yesterday and its gone…

The gist of reply was along the lines of aegiscg47. The French have so gutted their military I don't see much of a game.

15mm and 28mm Fanatik14 Nov 2018 3:05 p.m. PST

Now Germany has joined France in calling for a joint Euro Army.

Anyone besides myself who have read Larry Bond's strangely prescient 1993 techno-thriller 'Cauldron'?

It's funny that not so long ago we were lauding the Frogs for being our only ally to do anything substantive, like sending their aircraft carrier to help bomb ISIS in Iraq/Syria and confronting Islamic extremists in Mali. I'm sure in a couple more years we'll be buddy-buddy again.

Personal logo aegiscg47 Supporting Member of TMP14 Nov 2018 3:47 p.m. PST

Cauldron was written at at time when the French and German armed forces had not been budgetarily reduced from the Cold War days, so they were still pretty substantial. Not so much today and if you've been keeping up on the various German issues, i.e., aircraft at 40% readiness, at one point not one of their 6 subs was operational, reduction in frigates, etc., we are talking minor military powers now.

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