Help support TMP


"28mm bateaux? Gundollas? Etc?" Topic


42 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the French and Indian Wars Message Board

Back to the Age of Sail Message Board

Back to the 18th Century Product Reviews Message Board

Back to the American Revolution Message Board



Areas of Interest

Renaissance
18th Century
Napoleonic
19th Century

1,499 hits since 2 Nov 2018
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Winston Smith02 Nov 2018 5:57 p.m. PST

Well, does anyone make them?
FIW and AWI accounts are full of them to make interesting battles.

Does anyone make "small boats" that will not shame me if I want to play with them and my toy soldiers in public?

I'm open to resin, laser cut mdf, cheap 3D printed, a gift from Michael Anthony…

nnascati Supporting Member of TMP02 Nov 2018 6:40 p.m. PST

I've always made mine from poster board and thick card for the base. Not pretty, but they served their purpose.

Dennis02 Nov 2018 9:50 p.m. PST

John, wasn't the gift from John Beresford Tipton, with Michael Anthony acting as the delivery man? That should confuse the youngsters and our foreign friends.

nevinsrip02 Nov 2018 9:59 p.m. PST

Oh! Good Lord, John.

Buy some balsa and bass wood and get to it.

Michaels sells bags of each.

Winston Smith02 Nov 2018 10:48 p.m. PST

I don't know what they look like. grin'
Or what the difference is!

Razor78 Supporting Member of TMP03 Nov 2018 5:31 a.m. PST

Redoubt has some and rangers to man them, as well as large Indian war canoes

IronDuke596 Supporting Member of TMP03 Nov 2018 9:16 a.m. PST

large bateaux link

medium bateaux link

They are kits that you assemble…not too difficult but very nice bateaux.

axabrax03 Nov 2018 9:28 a.m. PST

I'd like to see these too. Not everyone likes to convert and build things from scratch as much nevins, apparently much to his chagrin.

Personal logo PaulCollins Supporting Member of TMP03 Nov 2018 3:31 p.m. PST

Winston, I would take a look at these Playmobil rowboats

auction

nevinsrip03 Nov 2018 8:48 p.m. PST

Axabrax, Actually, John and I go back a bit and I'm just busting his…………onions?

Whatever works for you, or anyone else, is fine with me.

Winston Smith04 Nov 2018 3:42 a.m. PST

Nevinsrip is just being nevinsrip. grin

22ndFoot05 Nov 2018 8:46 a.m. PST

Try Games of War (gamesofwar.co.uk). They make some very nice boats (a long boat for GBP 10 and and a jolly boat for GBP 5) and small ships at very reasonable prices. Their range is a bit "a-ha, Jim lad" but their models are very good. I started on two of their sloops this weekend.

Rawdon05 Nov 2018 10:32 a.m. PST

I was just about to post about Games Of War when 22nd Foot chimed in. The longboat and jolly boat are both good castings and very decent pricing (for out of EU there is a 17.5% discount because no VAT). They have no seating molded in. I find this a plus for gaming uses, but you can easily add it if you desire.

Sancho Panzer08 Nov 2018 11:56 a.m. PST

Earlier this year I sent Alan at Games of War detailed drawings and plenty of pictures of 'batteaux'. I was impressed with his other models of boats and hoped he would make this one, as there is nothing on the market that looks right. Alas, despite a couple of reminders, nothing has been forthcoming. If the reason is that he thought there wasn't enough demand it would help if everyone asked!

Sancho Panzer08 Nov 2018 12:19 p.m. PST

This is what it should look like:
link
Does anyone know how to turn a line drawing (as on the link) into a file for 3D printing? That or learning how to make boats from wood strip (laser cut?) are the other options. Neither is easy.

Winston Smith08 Nov 2018 2:39 p.m. PST

I got some of these from thingsfromthebasement.
link

I'm trying to talk him into putting pointy ends on them.
Add your voice!

epturner Supporting Member of TMP18 Nov 2018 5:52 p.m. PST

Batteaux don't have pointy end, Winston.

Just saying…

Eric

Winston Smith18 Nov 2018 6:05 p.m. PST

Sancho Panzer's link above seems to think so.
As does Iron Duke's.

epturner Supporting Member of TMP18 Nov 2018 7:03 p.m. PST

Nope. They don't.

Pointy ends are for things like surfboats, whaleboats, and things like that. Batteaux did not have pointy ends.

Lots of references for that.

Believe me. I went to a school for that stuff. The Cape Cod College for Nautical Knowledge spent a LOT of time my Fourth Class Year (read Freshman) teaching us about things like that. Words have Meaning…

Eric

Personal logo War Artisan Sponsoring Member of TMP18 Nov 2018 7:48 p.m. PST

There is no single design for batteaux. This was a generic term for any double-ended, keel-less, flat bottomed boat. They came in a wide variety of sizes, some with pointy ends and some without.

42flanker Supporting Member of TMP18 Nov 2018 11:35 p.m. PST

Is 'gundolla' a thing or a typo?

Winston Smith19 Nov 2018 6:57 a.m. PST

It's one way of spelling it from the period. It looked exotic so I used it.

42flanker Supporting Member of TMP19 Nov 2018 3:03 p.m. PST

I like it

epturner Supporting Member of TMP19 Nov 2018 4:05 p.m. PST

Ummm… No.

That's like saying Pinks, Snows, Topsail Schooners, Yawls (not y'alls… that's a Southern th'aing…) are all pretty boats with rigging and saily bit.

Batteaux did not have pointy ends for that very reason.

Nautical bits spoken by non-nautical people.

Might as well all call them a "dory" for that matter.

Forsooth.

Eric

Personal logo War Artisan Sponsoring Member of TMP20 Nov 2018 5:32 a.m. PST

The people who built these would be very surprised to hear that they were not building batteaux:

link

Sancho Panzer22 Nov 2018 7:04 a.m. PST

Here's another reference on those small craft used by the military in 18th c. N.America which I'd like to get models of, whatever people choose to call them:

picture

Personal logo War Artisan Sponsoring Member of TMP22 Nov 2018 11:13 a.m. PST

And, if you really want all of the nitty-gritty details, check out this masters thesis by Nathan Gallagher:

link

Which says, in part . . .

Presumably, the French term of "bateau plat," was simply shortened to "bateau" in the British vocabulary. It is obvious that using the word for "boat" was not specific enough for French speakers, but to British colonials the word came to represent this particular type of craft. The name reflects the French origin of the boats, but British phonetic spellings such as "battoe" or "batoe" are commonly seen in English historical sources. When applied to this unique version of the craft built in the English colonies, "bateau" became a word for something sui generis. As Peter Kalm described them:

"Battoes are another kind of boats that are much in use in Albany: they are made of boards of white pine; the bottom is flat, that they may row the better in shallow water. They are sharp at both ends, and somewhat higher towards the end than in the middle. They have seats in them, and are rowed as common boats. They are long, yet not all alike. Usually they are three and sometimes four fathoms [24 feet or 7.32 meters] long."

epturner Supporting Member of TMP22 Nov 2018 12:27 p.m. PST

War Artisan;
Like I said, things get lost in translation.

Batteaux were not set to a pattern except being flat in the bottom and bow and stern.

Kalm was a Swede who could have seem things like Durham Boats being made and would have called them Batteaux because of local slang.

I'd recommend something based on building in Montreal or somewhere else in New France, since Les Anglais have a terrible record of calling something a word different than what it meant.

Just because someone makes a miniature of something, it doesn't make them an expert. Like the people who call the M901 ITV a "Hammerhead". Never heard it called that during its service.

My two shillings.

Eric

Personal logo War Artisan Sponsoring Member of TMP22 Nov 2018 8:40 p.m. PST

I'd recommend something based on building in Montreal

Like this reconstruction of a "French Bateau" in the Stewart Museum, Montreal, Quebec?

picture

Winston Smith22 Nov 2018 11:37 p.m. PST

I see I've brought a Bricole Incident into the AWI board. AND the FIW board too!
Another B-word…..

I'll just get my hat, and call them there models "boats". grin
Floaty things.

Personal logo War Artisan Sponsoring Member of TMP23 Nov 2018 12:12 a.m. PST

Good plan, Winston. Let's go with that.

epturner Supporting Member of TMP24 Nov 2018 12:46 p.m. PST

You and your Bricoles, Winston.

Eric

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP24 Nov 2018 1:43 p.m. PST

I'll add my two-bricoles worth.

The Museum of Underwater Archaeology, connected to the University of Rhode Island, goes with pointy-ended bateau. link

I've been hoping somebody would make a kit based on this plan:

Laser Dream Works makes lovely kits labelled Bateau,but with a flat stern, which I call a skiff. link

Winston Smith28 Nov 2018 3:09 p.m. PST

Are those Laserdreamworks models resin, 3D print or laser cut wood?

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP28 Nov 2018 8:02 p.m. PST

Laser cut plywood. Because it's actual wood, not mdf, I stained mine with my old cross-country ski stain before assembly. They came out lovely, and with authentic pitch smell! ^,^

42flanker Supporting Member of TMP02 Dec 2018 4:06 p.m. PST

"Here be bateaux"

Winston Smith15 Mar 2019 8:20 a.m. PST

I'll probably be getting some of the Laser Dreamworks boats once the "Not going to Cold Wars" buying frenzy calms down.
Several of my plans "need" boats.
HMS Fly looks like a fun "larger" to start with ships run aground. Chelsea Creek, Red Bank, etc.

95th Division Supporting Member of TMP16 Mar 2019 5:06 a.m. PST

I've got the medium bateaux from laser dreamworks and really like it. I stained mine too and think it turned out nice. Since the boat is built in layers and you sand the outside to make it smooth l didn't stain the outside till it was together. The varying shades looked weathered. Just used it in an AWI scenario at Cold Wars. It is a very nice product.

Rawdon18 Mar 2019 12:57 p.m. PST

My personal opinion is that the longboat from Games Of War is the best available option – and as good a price as any other options too.

95th Division Supporting Member of TMP18 Mar 2019 5:13 p.m. PST

I just looked at the Games of War site – that is a nice looking boat. I may have to get one of these too.

Sancho Panzer01 Apr 2019 3:05 a.m. PST

I've given up on finding an accurate commercial model of a bateau and am working with basswood and styrene strip to make my own. Gondolas seem to postdate the FIW but I've just learned about radeaux (Google 'Land Tortoise radeau"), floating batteries reminiscent of the later Merrimac! They look relatively easy to scratchbuild but it would be an unusual scenario that called for them.

epturner Supporting Member of TMP08 Apr 2019 3:02 p.m. PST

Old Glory made a model of the radeau Thunderer.

Batteaux? Mine are flat ended. grin

Based on what I have read. YMMV.

At the end of the day, we are playing with toys. So build them as you wish.

Eric

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.