"Fall in and the Host" Topic

Once we have assessed what we see – and discussed the implications with the Convention Director (Poniatowski) and his team – we will update our members and guests.

Depending on what we see, we will probably have one or two more site visits between now and Fall In! If you are an HMGS member who lives locally to the Host, and are willing to participate in site visits, please contact us – communications@hmgs.org.

John,

I suspect the plan to review the site an additional time or two is adversely impacted by the delayed review [from 10/13-14 to 10-20-21].

BUT.

If you do, I suggest you get someone with mobility issues to "walk" the facility [even a healthy person with crutches, if a wheelchair is not available]. It might demonstrate issues of access that are not well understood [and thus lacking a planned response].

It may be too late for this event, but might demonstrate what issues should be in the mind of the Society team negotiating with any future Host/Wyndham contracts.

IF Cold Wars 2019 is to be held here, it might also provide some insight on what improvements need to be addressed/prioritized from HMGS's perspective with the Host.

Just some thoughts offered in the spirit of providing a pleasant and enjoyable experience for all of our attendees.

rick caras

The "Nightmare On Lincoln Highway" continues to the next chapter!!!!

Thanks for the update, HMGS.

Like I said above, "Keep Calm and Carry On."

Hope to see everyone at Fall In.

The "Nightmare On Lincoln Highway" continues to the next chapter!!!!

Yep. Certainly does! We'll be at the Host, rolling dice with our friends, eating at one of the fantastic restaurants in the area, having an amazing time.

What will you be doing?

I'll leave the hand wringing and panty twisting to others. I'm with TheKing30 and 47Ronin. I'll be there, and having a good time. Thanks for the update.

What's next? Fret about the weather?

The "Nightmare On Lincoln Highway" continues to the next chapter!!!!

Schadenfreude rears it's petulant head again. And from someone who stated he would never go to another HMGS convention again.

And from someone who stated he would never go to another HMGS convention again.

We should never say never. You never know when vagamer63 will have a change of heart and join us for the festivities. He might even try to roll dice with ::: gasp:::

THE USUAL SUSPECTS

I appreciate the update. Better to know up front than be surprised. I think many people were surprised when the new owners chose to renovate instead of starting new. Still, I'm looking forward to the con.

The following is my personal opinion and viewpoint and does not necessarily reflect the opinion of the HMGS Inc. Board of Directors.

Rick (rmcaras),
The hotel contracts are signed 12 to 24 months in advance and have sliding cancellation fees that kick in usually 12-24 months in advance and reach 100% of expected revenue around 3 months before the event. Which is why after we saw what the state of the Host was (is) after Cold Wars and Historicon, we had no choice but to proceed with Fall In! and Cold Wars 2019 at the Host, because the contracts were already signed and we wished to avoid the cancellation fees (not to mention that we probably couldn't have found another available site on short notice, so the convention(s) would have been cancelled if we broke the hotel contracts).

Yes, we have been a victim of a management team which has consistently over promised, under delivered, not offered any recompense, or been willing to really work with us to offset the problems that their construction project has caused.

Although the Host now says that everything should be finished "by the end of the year", there is no reason to believe them. For Cold Wars 2019 the question will be, how much of it is still unfinished.

As a new member of the Board, I have no interest in "rewarding" the Host with new contracts; but I am also cognizant of the fact that there are very few alternative facilities that meet our needs. The Lancaster Convention Center and Valley Forge will offer their own challenges for Historicon 2019 and Fall In! 2019 (if the Valley Forge contract is approved).

As a show volunteer, I will be staying in the Host, but I intend to bring my own food and drink with me and keep it in the room. I intend to minimize the amount of money the Host gets from me. In addition to the restaurants that others have mentioned, there is a new coffee place just past the TRU hotel, and an Aldi supermarket (reasonable prices, good products) in that first mall (just past the TRU).

As for another visit to the Host between now and Fall In!, it would be great if a local member volunteered to go take a look. I drove out from Philly (hour and a half each way) with my wife the other Sunday – she was willing to do that because she wanted to go to some of the outlets. I'd rather not have to do it again, but I will if no-one else steps up.

I hope to see you all at Fall In!

John Hollier

One correction to my post above.

The 2019 Fall In! contract with Valley Forge has already been signed (as was announced at Historicon).

I got confused because we've been looking at 2020 contracts recently – senior moment!!

Thanks for the detail LH.

Yes, we have been a victim of a management team which has consistently over promised, under delivered, not offered any recompense, or been willing to really work with us to offset the problems that their construction project has caused.

And I think this is what annoys people the most. The Host can get away with this without penalty. Certain standards need to be in the contract they have to live up to.

On the bright side, think of the true nightmare scenario. Four Seasons takes over the hotel and spares no expense to make it the showcase of the chain finishing in record time for the next HMGS convention.

Now, 90% of attendees lose the one thing they enjoy more than anything else in the world. Whining incessantly.

Though, I guess in Four Seasons world, people could complain that the hotel won't let you drag beer coolers around the meeting rooms or keep cold cuts on ice in the bathroom sinks.

Still, I find it amazing after all this time, after the colossal screwups like Baltimore, after repeated lessons in just how few suitable venues there are at prices that work for us, all anyone wants to do is complain about the Host. So, the work is preceding slowly. It's past the point of no return in that no one would put the amount of money in that they did unless they planned to finish. So, after 25+ years of riding the Host down, after throwing tens of thousands (if not a hundred thousand) into the toilet in Baltimore, after dropping half of Historicon's attendance in Virginia…it's really the end of the world if it takes an extra year before the Host is completely fixed up? FYI, this will be an interesting topic to revisit if the Lancaster Convention Center doesn't work well.

It will also be interesting to hear the thoughts of those who got shut out by the one day sellout of the grossly inadequate number of rooms at the downtown Marriott. I wonder if they will miss the wide selection of rooms within walking distance (or a one minute drive) of the Host.

When you're driving back and forth and going in and out of a garage five times a day, keeping thinking, "the carpet in the meeting rooms is newer than in the Host." Though, that will probably not be the case by July.

How did this last Historicon do on attendance?

"The Lancaster Convention Center and Valley Forge will offer their own challenges for Historicon 2019 and Fall In! 2019."

Which may be why it is time for HMGS to start looking at the big picture instead of only focusing on the here and now by trying to provide the same thing over and over, especially when the venues available at the prices we can afford are so limited.

How did this last Historicon do on attendance?

Quite curious about this myself.

historygamer,
Any time you move a large convention to a new facility there are going to be differences that create challenges for the event managers and the facilities to overcome.

Unfortunately some of our membership focus on those issues to the exclusion of everything else.

If you have an idea behind your "big picture" comment, I suggest you flesh it out into a real proposal, with pros, cons, costs, benefits, etc., and present it to the board.

Ask not what your society can do for you; ask what you can do for your society!

John Hollier

Actually, I've done a lot for HMGS over the years, John. :-)

My volunteer work goes back to the Penn Harris working the registration desk there. I could go on, but you get the idea.

HMGS has put itself into a box trying offer the same product three times a year, while basically running out of viable venues. HMGS has had to lurch from crisis to crisis (some of its own making) to find same-sized/same-costs facilities. Attendance has been flat to falling. Yet somehow HMGS offers record numbers of games (a significant of which get cancelled), tournaments, and dealer space (for less dealers providing true wargaming materials, I might add) than ever before.

So you tell me where a good step-back assessment might be in order. :-)

That is the "big picture" of what is going on now.

And yes, VFCC is no prize, never was. I know as I worked those cons too, and did a significant amount of game judging at each of the cons held there. I can't even imagine the hurdles for a con at the Lancaster Convention Center (well, okay, I have).

After the repeated debacles at the Host, I'd suggest any future contracts have stipulations as to basic services that will be provided or the venue has to reduce the venue fee. Right now the Host has ZERO incentive to get these sorts of things working. The fact that the main elevator won't be working would be a clear example of something that should be stipulated. So would basic food services.

historygamer,
I don't believe I mentioned or questioned what you may or may not have done for HMGS, Inc. in the past. Thank you for being part of making past conventions happen.

I thought you had an idea on how to change things going forward, but I see from your follow on comment that you're only talking about what's wrong and not about any well thought through ideas on how to improve things.

Thank you for your input.

That's your job as part of the BoD. Without changes we just seem to be caught in the same loop of problems. Hopefully, as a board member, this has occurred to you. :-)

historygamer,
While a part of the job of a Board member is generating and evaluating new ideas, the generation of ideas and the work to flesh those ideas out into workable proposals can not and should not be exclusively the work of the Board.

Being a member of a society is different than being a customer of a business. As a customer of a company often your only option is to whine about what's wrong and why don't they fix things. As a member of a society, I believe that if you think something is wrong, you should be prepared to participate in fixing it.

Hence "Ask not what your society can do for you; ask what you can do for your society!".

Of course, it is your prerogative to sit there and complain about anything. But without the corresponding "how do we fix it", don't expect me to listen to it.

John Hollier

Stop trying to make things more complicated than they have to be. Neither the convention center five miles from the Host, nor the casino complex in Valley Forge offer any real difference in general market area. It's a feel good way to say "we've got the conventions in different places," and nothing more.

The conventions all had their best long term attendance at Lancaster, didn't they? Yes, the Host almost sank into a black pit, and yes, it has taken frustratingly long for the renovations to be done. But, there is little reasonable doubt that a legitimate, full scale renovation is underway. So, why not just stop running around like chickens with their heads cut off, gut it out another year while the reno is finished, and just stay in the one place the things have actually worked for decades?

Okay, begin with a torrent of whining about the Host. Killer mold is my personal favorite.

So, why not just stop running around like chickens with their heads cut off, gut it out another year while the reno is finished, and just stay in the one place the things have actually worked for decades?

It would be foolish to put all your eggs in one basket again, with no way of knowing what price the Host is going to charge once renovations are complete. What if the BOD cannot negotiate a contract at a price that works next year?

They already know that room rates at the Host will exceed those of the Convention center for 2019.

Civil has it right, again. Having all your "eggs in one basket" is bad in case something happens to the basket. However, splitting the cons over two close locations is hardly spreading out the hobby. In the meantime, I think the BOD have made a good compromise.

I've never been to the Host while it hasn't been run down or under renovations; I'm pretty much used to it. We are staying for the first time this year; the rooms are affordable enough to not have to drive 2.5 hours home.

Think of it as an adventure, have fun and get your game on. There is always something negative you can find no matter where you are or what you are doing. Look for the good and go from there.

See ya,

Skip

Lord Hollier:

Given your rather passive/aggressive posts, forgive me if I don't engage with you. Good luck getting people to work with such an approach.

And yes, I've done plenty for HMGS over the years. I look forward to your ideas and fulfillment of them.

I stopped in at the Host this past Sunday the 28th. From a Vendor's point of view it is a mess. There is no parking other than the grass on the right hand side. I also walked around the hotel and the lobby is vacant with the entire right wall, where the bar was located, sheet rock.
Many parking spaces are filled with large dumpsters and equipment. All we get for our $119 USD-139 room rate is a room. I don't know how they intend to serve their $15.00 USD breakfast.

HMGS should have negotiated a $59 USD-69 rate.

Dennis(On Military Matters)

@Lord Hollier, you state in response to a critic…

"Being a member of a society is different than being a customer of a business. As a customer of a company often your only option is to whine about what's wrong and why don't they fix things. As a member of a society, I believe that if you think something is wrong, you should be prepared to participate in fixing it. "

"If you have an idea behind your "big picture" comment, I suggest you flesh it out into a real proposal, with pros, cons, costs, benefits, etc., and present it to the board.

Ask not what your society can do for you; ask what you can do for your society!"

and… "I thought you had an idea on how to change things going forward, but I see from your follow on comment that you're only talking about what's wrong and not about any well thought through ideas on how to improve things. Thank you for your input."

Someone once confronted me with a statement along the lines of "Ask not what your society can do for you; ask what you can do for your society!" and we subsequently took over the HMGS-MW Board, kicking out the corrupt and short sighted Board members in the process, moved LW from the remote and frozen cornfields of Northern Illinois to the Lincolnshire Marriot, got Little Wars healthy again, and moved on from there. Whatever has resulted from the decisions of subsequent MW Boards is on them; good or bad.

Now, since I kept membership in both Midwest and East for a number of years, lets focus on East. At an annual meeting I brought up the idea that the East Board needed to do some real honest-to-goodness strategic planning, was met with stiff resistance from a number of attendees, but was actively engaged in discussion by one Board member after the meeting. As a result, I subsequently provided East with some Strategic Planning materials and offered to be available if someone wanted to call and discuss the topic of strategic planning (BTW I drove to someone to deliver those materials for the Board's use) and never heard anything further; oh, and nobody ever bothered to return the strategic planning materials.

A couple years ago I also engaged the current Fall In con director (I think he remains the same) in conversation about possible options for East's cons. He was all over the ideas as we talked in the hallway of the FCC, wanted to talk more, but he had to run. I subsequently emailed him. After one, possibly two, emails I never heard another word.

Going back somewhat further, I was asked by a group of East members to talk with them about their potential move of one or more conventions; hoping to glean something of value from Little Wars move to the Lincolnshire Marriot. I did meet and talk with these 7 or 8 folks… and the point I emphasized the most "make sure you have your attorney read over and sign-off on any agreements" clearly fell on deaf ears – as illustrated by the Baltimore debacle.

My point being, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

v/r
Bill

" I also walked around the hotel and the lobby is vacant with the entire right wall, where the bar was located, sheet rock."

So the service at the bar will be about the same as it always is then.

"There is no parking other than the grass on the right hand side."

That's unbelievable, so the lot down on the corner is now gone/unusable? Where are all the trucks/vans/trailers supposed to go, it will be a rugby scrum trying to park along the grass on the right hand side of the access road, the load in should be a real tire fire. Imagine this scenario playing out at CW with a foot of snow on the ground, there will be zero parking in that instance.

To say the renovations are moving along at a snails pace is insulting to snails.

This is unreal, it really is.

Bill (wargamingUSA),
Wow!! Just wow!! Where did that come from?

I've been on the board of HMGS, Inc. almost 15 weeks, so I'm not aware of some of the history you shared. I know that being a member of the Board of HMGS, Inc. immediately opens me up personally for all kinds of criticism, but I find it disrespectful when that criticism is for things I was not around for and from a person that I don't think I've ever spoken to.

When faced with corruption and short-sightedness on the Mid-West board you did the right thing – you stepped up and fixed things. I would hope that our members would do the same thing – and if I prove to be corrupt and short-sighted then no-one should vote for me IF I decide to run again.

I ran for the board on a "platform" of process improvement, inclusion & growth. A big part of my "inclusion" is getting more of the membership actively involved in the business of their society – which is why I tried to engage historygamer in a conversation about his idea/concept.

I looked beyond any implied criticism in historygamer's original comment -
"Which may be why it is time for HMGS to start looking at the big picture instead of only focusing on the here and now by trying to provide the same thing over and over"
because I was hoping that he had a "fresh idea" behind that comment.

It turned out he didn't. Given that his comment – "That's your job as part of the BoD" – is counter to my idea of inclusion, I may have got too passive/aggressive with him in trying to get him to step up. If so, I apologize to him for that.

However, when I see people making comments that I think point towards possible new ideas, I am going to ask them to step forward and flesh those ideas out – for the good of the society. If you think that is throwing stones at OUR glass house, I'm going to need more bricks!!

John Hollier

It would be foolish to put all your eggs in one basket again, with no way of knowing what price the Host is going to charge once renovations are complete. What if the BOD cannot negotiate a contract at a price that works next year?

That sounds good in an information-free setting, but the history is pretty clear. Almost every bad thing that happened over the last ten years has been caused by the search for other baskets.

Yes, something could happen. The Host could decide to quadruple their prices, they could stop, having spent several million dollars and simply never finish. The killer mold from Planet X could dig in and refuse to leave. The Earth could open up and swallow the whole place.

But, such fears are not a basis for decision making, at least not on their own. Do you think there are no risks to new locations? I refer you to the last seven or eight years. Do you really think the Host is going to become such a paradise on Earth that they're going to be able to charge massively higher prices than the convention center hotel or the casino complex in Valley Forge? If so, that runs counter to everyone's seeming assumption the Host will always be a pile of junk.

Will the convention center work? Maybe. I have my doubts certainly. But, even if parking and ingress/egress and rules and everything else works GREAT, there are still not enough hotel rooms close. That is not going to change. So, there's a hole in that basket already.

Good planning is about comparing expected outcomes and predictable problems. I find it hard to believe anyone thinks either the convention center or Valley Forge is a lower risk option.

@John Hollier, I don't know you personally and you may be a great guy. In fact, I don't personally know many of the folks posting to this thread, including historygamer. Almost certainly some are good guys and some are surely not so great guys… but that's irrelevant. My comments above are not focused on you or anyone else as a person.

Since I've been down the road of working to reinvigorate a convention, arguably a chapter, I commend you for whatever you do to push for improvement. But you can't take the mantle and completely ignore the past or expect people to forget all that has transpired over an extended period of time… to some extent you are saddled with the actions/inactions and the performance of others; and you have to prove you are different… and by prove I mean produce results.

If you look back at your posts, in hindsight you may see how your comments can be interpreted as a reactionary challenge to someone or something representing criticism of the Board or its actions. Intended or not, if that's how your post comes across, it won't go far in terms of building a coalition of the willing, and convincing others that the new Board will be different than its predecessors and worth supporting in whatever manner they can. I'm not passing any judgment on previous Boards just stating obvious human tendencies.

It is possible your best intentions may not prevail and you come up short; I hope not. My preference is you are wildly successful in driving positive change. How great would it be to see threads with post after post talking about how HMGS-E and a convention set the standard for a gaming weekend or introduced some exciting, new something-or-other that made a convention stand out from all others. (And yes, some folks will bitch and moan no matter what, but hey, people figure them out pretty quickly.)

Just my two cents worth.

First off, +1 to CD. While I think you are right with your historical assessment, I am not sure what the Host will eventually morph into, and what the cost will be. It sounds like that the dealers have made a reasonable assessment that the old tennis barn/soon-to-be banquet hall, won't work.

I agree too that the VFCC is no prize. Like you, I remain skeptically optimistic about the Lancaster CC.

Funny, but I have to wonder how the IKE wasn't a better option than the Host has proved – at least during the construction period that is taking more time than it did to build the Hoover Dam. :-) Yes, I know the Ike is a dump, but the Host is a mess. The difference being – the Ike still has better gaming and vendor area options. Outside catering can always be brought into a facility.

To Lord Hollier:

You said:

"I looked beyond any implied criticism in historygamer's original comment -"

What criticism? None was intended nor implied- that I am aware of. I'll re-read.

"I was hoping that he had a "fresh idea" behind that comment."

I do and they are well known on these boards, though not particularly popular with some. That said, last I heard, HMGS was making rudimentary moves to start gathering data on the gaming areas – how many games show/no-shows, how many players are playing, etc. That was my oft posted idea and is a great start, but I do wonder what has become of that effort and what has been learned to date? How on earth can HMGS do event planning when they didn't even understand what was going on with their main product, or how much product was needed?

"It turned out he didn't."

I've posted on TMP many times. I'll be happy to share in person, but good luck getting three other people on the BoD to agree with you on anything. HMGS is stuck in a loop of trying to provide what was needed 20 years ago, in my opinion. Happy to talk to you in person. As the second longest serving member on the FOC, yes, I know some of the history too.

And apology accepted. We all say things we regret or just come out wrong, especially on the internet. I have no ax to grind with you or the BoD – though it sounds like WARgamingUSA has made an excellent offer – though his experience is like that of many over the years. You should absolutely be aware of that. +1 to WargmaingUSA too.

Funny thing – years ago a friend, who attends the cons often and is a professional event planner – offered his services to HMGS. He never heard back. Just saying, that happens a lot with people and HMGS.

"HMGS should have negotiated a $59 USD USD-69 rate." i keep hearing things like this, yet the the Host seems to be sold out for another convention.

"Funny, but I have to wonder how the IKE wasn't a better option than the Host has proved – at least during the construction period that is taking more time than it did to build the Hoover Dam. :-) Yes, I know the Ike is a dump, but the Host is a mess. The difference being – the Ike still has better gaming and vendor area options. Outside catering can always be brought into a facility."

It's not my call, but since the Host has been basically a war zone for the last three conventions (some would argue it's always been a war zone), I'd be ok with CW at the VFCC, Historicon at the LCC and FI at the Ike.

Three conventions, three different locations, none of which are the Host.

Once this renovation is complete (I have to wonder, is ONE contractor doing this whole thing and when I say ONE, I mean literally ONE person), we'll be priced out of there anyway.

The issue I see with the LCC is there clearly are not enough rooms/hotels near the site, so attendees/dealers will have to commute back and forth to downtown from wherever they are staying, which is a an X factor first year there.

My concerns about the LCC revolve around the parking situation, and GMs who aren't staying at the attached hotels that were apparently sold out before the contract ink was dry.

The repeated in and out and having to pay each time would kill it for me any consideration to run a game there.

And of course there is also the critical failure point of HMGS coming up with volunteers to watch my stuff when I'm dropping off and picking up. Now what could go wrong with that? Funny, but these were some of the same issues killing the BCC idea. These challenges also apply to people bringing stuff to sell in the flea markets too.

Corzin – you are spot on. As long as demand exceeds supply, the Host does not need to consider dropping its room rates. I just wonder what will work in the room this time around as last time the phones and TV did not work.

The only way for staying at the Host, once the tennis barn/banquet hall is unusable, is to move the dealers back into the hotel. That means they either go into the Distlefink or Lampeter room. Some of us remember what happened the last time the Lampeter room was going to be repurposed for something other than tournament games. :-(

Double G and Historygamer, "The issue I see with the LCC is there clearly are not enough rooms/hotels near the site, so attendees/dealers will have to commute back and forth to downtown from wherever they are staying, which is a an X factor first year there".

This is actually the same problem at the Ike. There are no other hotels short of 15 minutes away, and over 1/2 of the rooms in their old section are flop house quality and personally if I never stay at a room like that again, I will be happy.

BTC:

I generally agree with you regarding hotels in the Gettysburg area, though like Lancaster, there is a mixed offering within 15 minutes or so. Also, I wasn't suggesting that Hcon should be at the Ike. I was just pointing out that FI and CW experiences would likely have been better there.

I think the base facility (gaming and vendor area) at the Ike beats the current Host. I realize this is just a discussion as the BoD has made their decision. It will be interesting to see how future locations play out. No doubt people will post on TMP. :-)

Just a post thought too– have you ever stayed in some of the "other" hotels Lancaster has to offer? Point being, they aren't exactly five start Michelin hotels either. I'm still trying to recover from past stays at the Econo Lodge North and their History of Tobacco room. :-(

"This is actually the same problem at the Ike. There are no other hotels short of 15 minutes away, and over 1/2 of the rooms in their old section are flop house quality and personally if I never stay at a room like that again, I will be happy."

True, but you're not driving into downtown and trying to find parking, you're driving from your hotel to the Ike, which is apples to hand grenades.

THe bigger issue is that the gaming is in the hotel, the dealer hall is not an easy walk, I remember that one Fall In it rained sideways for two days, what a disaster. The flea market back then was in the Ike, but since they moved it to the All Star, people would have to come down to All Stars once on Friday and twice on Saturday for all those wonderful bargains that are so important to attendees.

The fact of the matter is no matter when these conventions land, there are going to be issues, we need a large space that is economical both for HMGS and attendees, it's almost an impossible scenario in the northeast, there just aren't that many options which work.

The problem for Fall In 2019 at the VFCC is the gaming will be in the hotel, the dealer hall in the convention center bottom floor, another relatively long walk, but again like at the Ike, the flea market will be there as well across the floor from the dealers, so people will have no choice but to make the walk.

Now see. The flea market does have an upside for dealers. :-)

histyorygamer, yes I have not stayed at the Host for 18+ years choosing to stay at the Country Inn & Suites and/or the Fairfield next to it. Much better rooms with breakfast included, easy parking and actually closer to the vendor area.

I travel a lot for my day job so I am particular regarding my hotel chains/choices. I also toured more hotels as part of my day job than most have ever entered. Knowing what I know about them, I am careful on my choices.

To me the Ike was a problem for both hotels and restaurants. We seldom ever had less than a 1.5 hour wait on Friday/Saturday night at a nicer restaurant in town.

I will point out that even with Ike's room situation, staying in Gettysburg 5 minutes away is a huge plus , for me anyway.

"To me the Ike was a problem for both hotels and restaurants. We seldom ever had less than a 1.5 hour wait on Friday/Saturday night at a nicer restaurant in town."

Which is why at the Ike, or any other facility with inadequate food services, outside catering should be brought in, without question. That likely should have been done at the Host as well. I know, Monday morning quarterbacking….

The ONLY reason I go to HMG conventions is to play MINATURE WARGAMES. IDO NOT go for food or room service. It is the main time, I can play miniature war games. I do hope Lancaster gets better. I hope the Historicon hotel is good. I just enjoy various miniature war games.

I DO NOT go for food or room service

I don't go for the food either, but I do want to eat something over the weekend.

Instead of being negative, let's make the current condition of the Host into a positive.

Let's turn the Host into a hotel version of the iconic movie "Westworld"; as in the movie, as a guest, you could choose between three themes; being in the old west, being in ancient Rome or being in a medieval castle.

How about this; the dealer hall can be Stalingrad "Come join the vendors are they battle the Germans in the Tractor Factory"……….the sheet rocked restaurant and bar area can be Andersonville prison "Come and see what is was like for any unfortunate Union prisoner hold up in Andersonville with no food or water and hot and cold running dysentery"……the half finished Dillpickle room can be Mogadishu "Fight your way to the staircase in the lobby and rescue the masseuse, then try to get out of the parking lot to route 30 dodging piles of rubble, wrecked construction vehicles and dumpsters full of trash"…………….so what do you say everyone, let's make a positive out of a negative…………

Sounds more like Worstworld.

"The ONLY reason I go to HMG conventions is to play MINATURE WARGAMES. IDO NOT go for food or room service. It is the main time, I can play miniature war games."

So do you mean you literally go to the conventions just to wargame and you don't eat for three days/contribute .05 cents to the local economy, or are you speaking in general terms, ie, you eat but food is not your main concern.

Asking for a friend…………………

Personally I could care less what the hotel's food situation as I have to bring 100% of my food due to food allergies. BUT when I bring my son on Saturdays, I brown bag it for him but supplement that with some stuff from the Host. I was worried about food poisoning when my son started to eat his hot dog, it was that cold. Thankfully that didn't happen but it made me leery of buying food there again.

I'm a day tripper, so the quality of the rooms is a non-issue, but I can sympathize with those who have to put up with lousy rooms.

I would like to be able to get a room overnight on Friday and Sat, but since I have to return home Friday night to get my son and bring him Saturday… non-starter. :(