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"Suvorov's 1799 Campaign in Italy" Topic


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Chad4708 Aug 2018 3:32 a.m. PST

Can anyone help with the artillery at any of the actions during the above campaign? I have Nafziger OOBs, Eagles Over the Alps and Digby Smith's Data book, but can find little or nothing.

I have details of the basic information on organisation for Russia, Austria and France, but nothing regarding artillery present during the campaign. Maybe nothing is available, but any help would be appreciated.

Chad

Dave Jackson Supporting Member of TMP08 Aug 2018 4:16 a.m. PST

Probably find something here, there are bits & pieces:

link

Stoppage08 Aug 2018 4:44 a.m. PST

@dj – thanks for link

this page – Austria, Russia, Sardinia – Piedmont, and the Polish Legion – says:

With regard to regimental artillery, on March 12, 1798, all grenadier and musketeer regiments were ordered each to have one 12-pdr unicorn and four 6-pounder cannons, except for the Leib-Grenadier Regiment, which was equipped with eight 12-pdr unicorns.

Totally interesting – six-pounders are large for infantry guns, and – perhaps – the 12-pound gun-howitzer was utilised for it's grenade-throwing ability.

von Winterfeldt08 Aug 2018 4:59 a.m. PST

6 pdrs are not too large for regimental gus, already in the 7YW they were used for battalion guns, Prussians also used the 7pdr howitzer for grenadier battalions

Personal logo jeffreyw3 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member08 Aug 2018 10:31 a.m. PST

Zhmodikovs' "Tactics of the Russian Army… v.1" notes that each Grenadier or Musketeer regiment had four 6# guns and one 1/4 pud (12#) unicorn (licorne). The latter was detached with the grenadier companies to form grenadier battalions, so musketeer battalions had two 6# each, and grenadier battalions, two 1/4 pud unicorns).

In battle, the guns went to the right flank of each battalion.

Stoppage08 Aug 2018 1:12 p.m. PST

@vw

I was comparing to the three or four pounders other armies used for infantry guns.

Prussian grenadier battalions had howitzers!

Were these used to fire-in the assaulting grenadiers – say using shells against point positions such as villages, woods, bridges, small fortifications, etc?


@jw3

Russian grenadier battalions had gun-howitzers!

Another thread discussed tactical usage of these.


Thanks both – learned something today!

HappyHussar08 Aug 2018 7:30 p.m. PST

This is the OB for the Russian forces that I used for the Battle of Novi – 1799 – Order of Battle for Campaign Marengo:

Russian Forces (Army, 12 764 infantry, 1 940 cavalry, 36 guns)

FM Suvorov (C A)
Derfelden's Corps (Corps, 12 764 infantry, 1 940 cavalry, 36 guns)

GM Derfelden (C C)
AdvGd/DC (Division, 2 917 infantry, 1 940 cavalry)

GM Bagratian (D C)
Inf/AG/DC (Brigade, 2 917 infantry)

Col Phantom (E C)
7 Jäger (Infantry, 571 men, C)
8 Jäger (Infantry, 618 men, C)
Sanajev Gren (Infantry, 430 men, B)
Dendrjugyn Gren (Infantry, 405 men, B)
Lomonsov Gren (Infantry, 409 men, B)
Kalemin Gren (Infantry, 484 men, B)

Cav/AG/DC (Brigade, 1 940 cavalry)

Col Dennisov (E C)
1/Grekov DCR8 (Cavalry, 95 men, C)
2/Grekov DCR8 (Cavalry, 94 men, C)
3/Grekov DCR8 (Cavalry, 96 men, C)
4/Grekov DCR8 (Cavalry, 95 men, C)
5/Grekov DCR8 (Cavalry, 94 men, C)
1/Denisov DCR5 (Cavalry, 95 men, C)
2/Denisov DCR5 (Cavalry, 97 men, C)
3/Denisov DCR5 (Cavalry, 93 men, C)
4/Denisov DCR5 (Cavalry, 96 men, C)
5/Denisov DCR5 (Cavalry, 92 men, C)
1/Sujchev DCR2 (Cavalry, 99 men, C)
2/Sujchev DCR2 (Cavalry, 98 men, C)
3/Sujchev DCR2 (Cavalry, 101 men, C)
4/Sujchev DCR2 (Cavalry, 97 men, C)
5/Sujchev DCR2 (Cavalry, 99 men, C)
1/Semernikov DCR (Cavalry, 101 men, C)
2/Semernikov DCR (Cavalry, 100 men, C)
3/Semernikov DCR (Cavalry, 101 men, C)
4/Semernikov DCR (Cavalry, 99 men, C)
5/Semernikov DCR (Cavalry, 98 men, C)

Wagon/AG/DC (Supply 300)

Main/DC (Brigade, 3 720 infantry, 12 guns)

GM Miloradovich (D C)
1/Dalheim MR (Infantry, 635 men, B)
2/Dalheim MR (Infantry, 631 men, B)
1/Miloradovich MR (Infantry, 618 men, B)
2/Miloradovich MR (Infantry, 619 men, B)
1/Badensky MR (Infantry, 609 men, B)
2/Badensky MR (Infantry, 608 men, B)
Light Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Light Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Licorne Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Wagon/Main/DC (Supply 300)

Reserve/DC (Brigade, 6 127 infantry, 12 guns)

GLt Shvejkovsky (D C)
1/Moscow GR (Infantry, 568 men, A)
2/Moscow GR (Infantry, 564 men, A)
1/Baranowsky MR (Infantry, 737 men, B)
2/Baranowsky MR (Infantry, 737 men, B)
1/Förster MR (Infantry, 615 men, B)
2/Förster MR (Infantry, 614 men, B)
1/Smolensk MR (Infantry, 569 men, B)
2/Smolensk MR (Infantry, 571 men, B)
1/Tula MR (Infantry, 575 men, B)
2/Tula MR (Infantry, 577 men, B)
Light Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Light Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Licorne Section (Artillery, 4 guns, A)
Wagon/Res/DC (Supply 300)

Art/DC (Brigade, 12 guns)

Hvy Foot Section (Artillery, 4 guns, B)
Hvy Foot Section (Artillery, 4 guns, B)
Lic Section (Artillery, 4 guns, B)

Light sections are 6lb guns. Heavy sections are either the Light 12lb or Medium 12lb guns.

Chad4709 Aug 2018 12:59 a.m. PST

Hussar

Can you give more information as to where you found that OOB. I have not found one as yet that gives that artillery information..

Thanks

Chad

Prince of Essling09 Aug 2018 4:00 a.m. PST

You will find some OoBs in
"Исторія войны 1799 года между Россіей и Франціей в царствованіе" By граф Дмитрий Алексеевич Милютин, Александр Иванович Михайловский-Данилевский
link
link

[Miliutin,D. Istoriia voiny 1799 goda mezhdu Rossiei i Frantsiei vtsarstvovanie… Pavla I.]

Some of the OoBs list the type of guns/licornes, others the number of regimental guns and battery pieces plus numbers of officers/crew.

There are 9 volumes in total but the two linked to cover Italy. Have only found 1 in German but it relates solely to the campaign in Holland – see "Geschichte des Krieges Rußlands mit Frankreich unter der Regierung Kaiser Paul's I. Im Jahre 1799 Siebenter und achter Theil" by Aleksandr I. Michajlovskij-Danilevskij link

Prince of Essling09 Aug 2018 12:15 p.m. PST

German language Volumes (which combines a number of the Russian volumes to reduce the number of volumes to 5):
Volume 1: link

Volume 2: link

Volume 3: link

Volume 4: link

Volume 5: link

HappyHussar09 Aug 2018 8:34 p.m. PST

I believe I used Enrico Acerbi's OB found over at the Napoleon Forum site. I honestly cannot remember. I had to research practically every battle for the period 1795-1800 for Campaign Marengo and now its a bit of a blur.

Chad4710 Aug 2018 1:41 a.m. PST

Thanks all.

Essling – many thanks. Had downloaded your first links but wondered how I was going to be able to use them as I have no knowledge of the Russian language. I will do the same with the second set of links. I have a smattering of German from my school days and will hopefully manage to obtain useful info.

Chad

Allan F Mountford10 Aug 2018 6:03 a.m. PST

Chad

. Click on the link.
. Left click on the thumbnail title page to bring up the document.
. From the drop down menu top right select 'Plain text. The document will change from pdf to text.
. Right click on the text and select 'Translate to English'.

You're welcome.

;-)

von Winterfeldt10 Aug 2018 6:25 a.m. PST

Prinz Karl wrote also a history

see

link

amonst else nice maps to be seen at the

atlas

as to Prussian grenadiers, they did get howitzers during the 7YW when they had to fight the more and more entrenched enemy

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