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"Gyllenstierna dragoons. Standard?" Topic


10 Posts

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222 hits since 6 Jul 2018
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP06 Jul 2018 2:53 a.m. PST

So my post disappeared so I'll try for a 3rd time.

Does anyone know what the regiments standard lookx like?
I assume it was Nils Gyllenstierna(1670-1731) that was the regiments öveste, but can't find find any family seal to use as a stand in either.

DisasterWargamer Supporting Member of TMP06 Jul 2018 8:04 a.m. PST

The only thing I found was shown in Swedish War Museum

link – the second link is found toward the bottom left of the page
link

The fact there is no emblem on it – may suggest that it was issued around the time the Standards became regulated

BTW Looking at family crests with his last name – almost all of them include a 7 pointed star

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP06 Jul 2018 9:00 a.m. PST

Thanks!
But I think that must an earlier regiment.
From my understanding the dragoon regiment I'm looking for a standard for was raised before the invasion of Russia 1707, it was a prisoner regiment made up of Saxon/ various other POWs.

9th Maine06 Jul 2018 12:42 p.m. PST

Plain cornflower blue dragoon colour without decoration.
Source: Wennersholm, J. Bertil R. Emporterade Trofeer. Karl XII:s ryska fälttåg 1708-1709 i belysning av uppgifter om förluster av svenska fälttecken. Bohus 2000.

What is your source for your statement that it was made up of Saxon POW's?

This regiment along with Albedyhl's was created in 1707 by dividing Goertz's Dragoon Regiment in two.
Source: Tessin, Georg. Die Deutschen Regimenter der Krone Schweden. Vol.II. Köln 1967.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP06 Jul 2018 12:51 p.m. PST

Fraustadt 1706 Ett fält färgat rödt by Oskar Sjöström.

RogerC07 Jul 2018 3:01 a.m. PST

Wasnt Goertz a Saxon Dragoon regiment? That might support Truls statement about it being Saxon POW's?

9th Maine07 Jul 2018 4:40 a.m. PST

Sorry, no Saxon dragoon regiment "Goertz". There was a Saxon dragoon regiment "Goltz", probably resulting in your confusion.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP07 Jul 2018 4:53 a.m. PST

From Sjôstrøm's book.

Med på det ryska fëltslåget var även många av de generaler offficerare och knektar som slagits vid Frustadt, til exepel drgagonerna Alexander Mangnus Dahlberg och Joachim Mathiea Lyth. Med fanns även Nils Gyllenstirena, nu som överste för egent dragonregimente med utländska karlar som tilfångatagits ved Fraustadt, där bland andra schweizaren Christoph Gassmann fanns med

That bold parts basically said that Nils Gyllenstirna got his own dragoon regiment made up of prisoners from Fraustadt. And one of them was Christoph Gassmann(Gassmann would then be captured by the Russians after Poltava and would fight against the Ottoman under Russian a Russian banner, not returning to his homeland of Switzerland before 1722)

9th Maine07 Jul 2018 5:49 a.m. PST

Thanks, but I have the book and can read Swedish. I have no doubt that Swedish IR Goertz was recruited from prisoners taken at Fraustadt, but that regiment was destroyed at Kalisz in 1706. The Swedish officers were made POWs, but what happened to the surviving soldiers? Following the Treaty of Altranstädt, 31 August 1707, the officers of the regiment were released and the regiment was to be reformed. On 26 November 1707 instead of a infantry regiment, Goertz agreed to a dragoon regiment. The question is from where did the men of the regiment come? Obviously, new men were recruited and some could possibly have come from the old infantry regiment lost at Kalisz. I have no doubt that most if not all were German with a few other nationalities included. Whether or not they were prisoners from Fraustadt is the question. Gyllenstiernas berättelse provides no clue.

Travellera07 Jul 2018 7:39 a.m. PST

Another one:

link

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