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"Should Members Be Allowed To Attack Others Vía PM?" Topic


43 Posts

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17 Apr 2018 8:24 p.m. PST
by Editor in Chief Bill

  • Removed from TMP Bugs and Features board


1,297 hits since 17 Apr 2018
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 2:32 p.m. PST

Here's a really simple one …

POLL QUESTION:
Should supporting members be allowed to attack or harass other members via Private Messages (PMs) and then be able to hide behind the protection of the TMP Privacy Rules*?

A) Yes, cowardly hit and runs via PMs should be allowed to continue with impunity.

B) No, the privacy rules must be amended to make an exception in these cases, and allow the outing of such cowardly attacks, and appropriate disciplinary action.
link

C) What's a PM? I don't have those.

Dan
* Etotheipi did a great job spelling out the current PM privacy rules here, at the bottom of this other thread:
TMP link

Mick the Metalsmith Inactive Member17 Apr 2018 2:39 p.m. PST

PM cannot be construed as an attack. They are easily ignored. Just don't open the PM.

MajorB17 Apr 2018 2:39 p.m. PST

No

Personal logo etotheipi Sponsoring Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 3:01 p.m. PST

I'll send you a PM with my opinion …

Daithi the Black17 Apr 2018 3:13 p.m. PST

Really? *This* community is *that* bad?

deephorse17 Apr 2018 3:19 p.m. PST

As flawed a poll as I have ever seen. Thankfully, when it eventually runs, in four or five years, no-one will remember this, let alone care. Anyway, aren't cowardly personal attacks the very thing that keeps the internet going? Or am I confusing that with Twitter?

princeman17 Apr 2018 3:23 p.m. PST

B

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 3:25 p.m. PST

Dan. Just delete and ignore the offending PMs. You aren't doing yourself any favors with this. Quite the opposite.
At the risk of a stint in the DH, I will just say one more thing. Stop sniveling.

Not to mention that the choices in the poll are insulting. Either I agree with you 100%, or I'm a crude barbarian.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 3:26 p.m. PST

Deephorse: "As flawed a poll as I have ever seen"
Well, this is my first one. So, how could I have worded it better, if at all?

Winston, "sniveling", "insulting". How so? A simple "yes" or "no" would work too. Or even an "I don't care" or "not interested" or whatever option you feel like providing.

Besides, this TMP Poll wasn't even my idea. I was instructed to do it by the Editor. So tell me how to adjust the wording to address the main point (amendment of PM rules) but be clear that I never wanted to start a darn poll about this. He's the entire TMP legislative body but he said any amendment must come as a result of a Poll. Whatever. I tried.

Dan

Personal logo 20thmaine Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 3:29 p.m. PST

No – harassment via PMs isn't acceptable use of PMs – IMHO.

I'd hope this is a hypothetical question rather than provoked by some unnamed jerk(s). But then again, this is the internet.

Mick the Metalsmith Inactive Member17 Apr 2018 3:48 p.m. PST

Dan, get a grip.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 3:55 p.m. PST

Mick: "PM cannot be construed as an attack. They are easily ignored. Just don't open the PM."

Really? Well I guess one could say the same about regular forum posts. You can disregard them, not read them, hit "Stifle", "Ignore", so on and so on.

As I mentioned on the thread, this isn't just about PMs that have been sent to me.

Anyway, whatever. I did as he said. I'm done now.

Dan

Earl of the North17 Apr 2018 4:10 p.m. PST

D) Its a PM you don't have to read any message sent to you by another member, just delete anything this guy sends you unread and get on with your day.

You apparently have a long running thing going with this guy, so block him and remove him from your TMP experience entirely and deny him the satisfaction of getting under your skin.

Tango0117 Apr 2018 4:33 p.m. PST

Mi queridísimo amigazo… tal vez es hora que patees afuera la pelota y hagas una pausa… déjalo ir…


Amicalement
Armand

Personal logo Grelber Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 4:35 p.m. PST

I've had PM capability, off and on, and rarely used it, so pardon me if my response isn't particularly deep or profound.

Earl of the North's answer D is a good suggestion if this is the 12th PM you've received from the person, and they've all been attacks of one sort or another. You don't owe it to the jerk to open his PM, read it, and get your knickers in a knot over the thing.

But what about the first time? I mean, you have to open the first one to see whether he wants to send you all his excess figures or explain in great detail how your female ancestors stretching back to the dimmest mists of history had the morals of dingoes.

Grelber

nnascati Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 4:39 p.m. PST

Dan,
I'm going to say "A". Not because you or anyone else should be subject to personal attacks, but because by their nature, Private Messages are just that, Private. The only way to control the content would be for Bill or one of his editors to read them. Thus rendering them Public rather than Private. Just my thoughts for what they are worth.

Nick

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 4:40 p.m. PST

Tango: "déjalo ir"

Eso es precisamente lo que dije. No me importa más. No tengo nada más que decir al respecto.

Dan

Personal logo Doctor X Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 4:56 p.m. PST

Is this deja vu?
I thought I saw a similar topic a few days ago.

Personal logo etotheipi Sponsoring Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 5:01 p.m. PST

Eso es precisamente lo que dije.

Si él no quiere escucharte, no lo escuches.

FusilierDan Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 5:07 p.m. PST

Doctor X this is Dan doing what was suggested to him by the editors as a response to the first thread.

I'd say B as an ok solution but does this happen often enough to warrent the change?

E. block who can send you a PM

Personal logo Florida Tory Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 5:31 p.m. PST

Why should any part of TMP be exempt from the behavior rules? Unfortunately, we have seen enough instances of boorish behavior on TMP to realize why Bill promulgated the rule in the first place. An attack is an attack. Why reward someone who attempts to flout the rules?

Rick

Ragbones Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 5:35 p.m. PST

B, no.

Jim Selzer17 Apr 2018 5:46 p.m. PST

I must have a thick skin because I don't let anyone online get under it public or private. I sure the heck won't go hang my self from the ceiling fan over mere letters on an internet forum.

Jeigheff Inactive Member17 Apr 2018 7:02 p.m. PST

Dan has a point. A good point.

I myself have gotten occasional unwanted PMs from folks who want to keep some argument going and inflict their worldview on me.

In fact, one TMP member has made himself odious by treating both Dan and me like this in the past.

I can deal with this kind of baloney and I know that Dan can too. Just be aware that not everyone who frequents TMP is a gentleman.

Jeff

jdpintex17 Apr 2018 7:08 p.m. PST

who cares? I have a delete button

Jeigheff Inactive Member17 Apr 2018 7:32 p.m. PST

Maybe this is naive. But because I've enjoyed communicating with many people on TMP over the years, the hostile PM issue is distasteful to me.

Like I said, I can deal with it.

Jeigheff Inactive Member17 Apr 2018 7:38 p.m. PST

Yowee! I just read the second link provided by CC in his initial post. Seems like the hostile PM issue (especially accusations) isn't such a small thing after all.

Ed Mohrmann Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 8:08 p.m. PST

I don't 'do' polls, so I don't care either way.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian17 Apr 2018 8:19 p.m. PST

Dan, I have already explained to you that I will not punish someone for a single rude PM.

As the FAQ already explains, someone who sends repeated rude PMs would fall under the existing harassment rule. However, you have not presented me with evidence of repeated harassment by this individual, have you?

lloydthegamer Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 8:20 p.m. PST

No change, PMs are just that, private. If you have a jerk causing you heartburn either don't read the messages or block (stifle?) him.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian17 Apr 2018 8:23 p.m. PST

Besides, this TMP Poll wasn't even my idea. I was instructed to do it by the Editor. So tell me how to adjust the wording to address the main point (amendment of PM rules) but be clear that I never wanted to start a darn poll about this. He's the entire TMP legislative body but he said any amendment must come as a result of a Poll. Whatever. I tried.

Dan, what I told you was that if you wanted the forum rules changed, you could do what everyone else can and propose a change here on this board.

I never said this was the only way to enact a change in the rules.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 8:27 p.m. PST

Bill: "However, you have not presented me with evidence of repeated harassment by this individual, have you?"

Yes I have. To me and others. You got it long ago, but it went ignored, as I explained to you in the PMs I sent you a little while ago.

Do what you will about the rules, or not. It doesn't matter. And as I explained to you, I'm done wasting my time on this topic.

This is my last post on this thread.

Dan

Personal logo Doctor X Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 8:42 p.m. PST

Thanks for the quick summary FD.

If I don't want to read something I just delete it and move on without a thought.

Am I missing something? Maybe I deleted it…

Tango0117 Apr 2018 9:08 p.m. PST

"This is my last post on this thread…."

Lo mas inteligente que he leído….


Sigamos adelante….

Amicalement
Armand

Bunkermeister Supporting Member of TMP17 Apr 2018 10:09 p.m. PST

I think it's a poor use of TMP for people to bother or harass or threaten others. Just because the PM is "private" does not give anyone carte blanche to say anything, no matter how repulsive, or even threatening.

I think the PM system should be private until or unless one or both of those involved in the conversation choose to bring the conversation to the attention of the Editor or his staff.

I think there should be some general guidelines about what can be posed on a PM. Certainly criminal behavior and certain other distasteful messages should be prohibited. I agree the best choice is to contact the other party and ask that they discontinue that type of contact, and if that fails, then block them. But some messages may be so outlandish that they call for a response by some kind of authority.

Certainly Dear Editor would not want one or more individuals making evil PMs to people in large numbers and potentially driving away readers.

I always assume that my PMs may be made public at some point, as I do with everything on the Internet, so I try to keep my writings and posting within a certain limit.

Mike Bunkemeister Creek
Bunker Talk blog

korsun0 Supporting Member of TMP18 Apr 2018 6:25 a.m. PST

What's the difference between hitting the complaint button on a single offensive post or receiving a single offensive PM and complaining appropriately to the moderator? Bad behaviour needs a kicking either way. Keyboard warriors need educating….
Mind you, now I know I can gob off once for free at someone, I'll keep that one for a rainy day.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian18 Apr 2018 11:36 a.m. PST

Yes I have. To me and others. You got it long ago, but it went ignored, as I explained to you in the PMs I sent you a little while ago.

Did you expect that I would keep a file of your previous complaints? Give me a break. If you are trying to bring up someone on the charge of harassing you, then it's your burden to present the facts of the case. I don't have the time to be your detective force.

Mick the Metalsmith Inactive Member18 Apr 2018 12:07 p.m. PST

This tempest in a tea cup is very much the public result most desired by Dan's private troll. He wins with every public complaint and whing, wasting the editor's, Dan's, and every readers time. Just don't open the damn PM and get on with life. Don't feed trolls.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP18 Apr 2018 1:37 p.m. PST

Whatever happened to Ignore, or Stifle?
Or just deleting?

Personal logo StoneMtnMinis Supporting Member of TMP18 Apr 2018 4:45 p.m. PST

NO.

Legion 420 Apr 2018 7:00 a.m. PST

Of course as I have said many times before … On a site that primarily revolves around mature(?) adults(?) playing with toys. There should not be too much if any vitriol, derision, anger, etc., etc. But as we see here, albeit many of the "problem" children, trolls/frolls, etc., have been locked out and some relocated to another "site". Of their own accord …

There seems to be less of that here now. But again it appears some/we all still just can't get along … But again it's about toys just toys … peace

And no matter what someone says or believes, etc. … It's just an opinion, etc. That in the bigger picture means absolutely 0 … Yes – 0 … I've said before if anything I say or anyone else says upsets another that much. Well the stifle/ignore function should be an easy fix. However to PM someone just to start an argument is not really appropriate, IMO …

Uesugi Kenshin Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2018 8:47 a.m. PST

No, but foxy boxing competition's between TMP members should fully be encouraged.

The Angry Piper Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2018 10:53 a.m. PST

I guess I just don't see why this is a big deal.

If someone harasses you in the public areas of TMP, it should be handled according to the rules.

If someone harasses you in a PM, ignore it. Anything else just feeds into the nonsense.

Once upon a time, I posted something here on TMP that apparently got the attention of someone who decided they wanted to be contrary for the sole purpose of being contrary. I realized after the second or third time I responded to this individual that every time I gave this behavior any attention whatsoever, it made the contrarian feel all warm and fuzzy, flush with a feeling of accomplishment at having annoyed a stranger for reasons all their own.

I stopped responding. Why bother engaging with someone whose sole purpose is to annoy or harass you?

Stifle them. Ignore them. Don't give them what they want, which is that warm feeling of accomplishment at being the absolute best at being a…well, you know.

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