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"Vehicle scale vs infantry scale" Topic


23 Posts

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746 hits since 12 Apr 2018
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Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 8:08 a.m. PST

So i hadn't noticed it as clearly with my tank. But when I put my warlord plastic figure next to a Rubicon jeep they scale goes to hell. The warlord figure is at least 240cm and 200kg.
Basically grisly bear size. He wouldn't fit in the tank as his head is bigger then the hatches.

This looks to be problem with most 28mm figures.

20mm would look better in relation to the seats and hatches. But would make the tank at least 1 meter to tall.

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 8:42 a.m. PST

It's either a glitch or a feature, depending on how you look at it. I mostly do WWII in microscale, and I'm happy to use Adler infantry which are a little overscale next to Irregular tanks. I'm picking up on visibility with the infantry, and the Irregular armor is inexpensive, with nice variety, and quite large enough to make types obvious. A larger scale might mean different tradeoffs.

LeonAdler Sponsoring Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 8:43 a.m. PST

I'm saying nothing……..:)
L

picture

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 9:57 a.m. PST

The cartoonish proportions of 28mm figures means they are way bulkier than any appropriate scale with body height. Height of troops next to tanks looks right, bulk of troops in jeeps looks bad.

My primary scale for WW2 is 1/87 vehicles and 1/76 foot infantry, but 1/87 for vehicle crew.

For 28's, going down to a less scale-creepier brand of figures for your jeep and vehicle crew would be the way to go.

I believe Rubicon makes plastic crew? Those I presume would fit well.

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 10:05 a.m. PST

Exhibit A, if your troops aren't scale proportioned like actual soldiers, they will look somehow wrong next to any scale vehicle:

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 10:15 a.m. PST

Exhibit B, if you view your games as depicting re-enactors, then the figures (and whatever rules you're using) make much better visual sense; 4 or 5 re-enactors would have trouble all fitting in a jeep at once too:

Fred Cartwright12 Apr 2018 10:45 a.m. PST

Nice try Leon, but I remember when I did 20mm my plastic tank commanders were tiny when compared to my Britannia infantry. It is a problem with all scales. I'd be interested to see how your tank commander compared to a Britannia or Valiant miniature.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 11:27 a.m. PST

The problem isn't the crew the problem is the infantry. When my warlord infantry figure stands next to my rubicon jeep it looks like a bear in uniform is attacking the jeep.

LeonAdler Sponsoring Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 11:49 a.m. PST

Fred Cartwright, the figures I make are not designed to fit in with Valiant, which as I remember are nothing close to the nominal 20mm scale. Britania are decidely on the chunky side ( and paint up quite nicely)so mine will not match either terribly well. Might be better to compare my Tank crews to my infantry?
Infantry are always going to 'look' bigger than crews. Vehicle crews tend to wear tighter fitting uniforms and dont have lots of kit slung around them. Infantry have all sorts kit hanging off them so going to look a lot bulkier.
As for the Warlord stuff well they are what they are and decidely not to my tastes.
L

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 11:50 a.m. PST

If that re-enactor got out of the seat, it would look about the same as a Warlord figure next to a model.

Lucius12 Apr 2018 4:26 p.m. PST

Our hobby got off track decades ago, when we went with size, i.e. 25mm, 15mm, instead of scale, like 1/72, or 1/48.

Plastic modellers and model railroaders just don't have this problem, because kits and figures that aren't to scale don't sell.

Fred Cartwright12 Apr 2018 4:57 p.m. PST

Fred Cartwright, the figures I make are not designed to fit in with Valiant, which as I remember are nothing close to the nominal 20mm scale. Britania are decidely on the chunky side ( and paint up quite nicely)so mine will not match either terribly well.

Quite so Leon. That was my experience in 20mm and it applies in 28mm as well. Mixing across ranges can be a problem.

Might be better to compare my Tank crews to my infantry?

I'm sure they match very well, but then so do the Perry and Offensive vehicle crews and infantry. In fact you could replicate your picture in 28mm with a Perry Panzer commander and Blitzkrieg Panzer III.

As for the Warlord stuff well they are what they are and decidely not to my tastes.

Warlord are generally at the heroic end of 28mm sculpting. A deliberate policy, I am sure, to attract the GW players to their ranges. Vehicles scale out pretty well though.

28mm Fanatik12 Apr 2018 5:42 p.m. PST

The "problem" lies in the so-called Foundry sculpting style, which is inherently disproportionate and caricature-like. The artistic style is popular in tabletop gaming and aesthetically pleasing to most miniature gamers, but looks out of whack with properly scaled tanks and vehicles.

This is why I and like-minded people prefer using 1/48 and 1/50, but the figures have to be raised on taller bases or they'll look too short and squat. I don't mind using the raised bases since my entry into the hobby was WH40K back in the early '90s.

If they proportion the vehicles to match the figures, I reckon they'll look like those Japanese egg planes.

TMP link

BrockLanders Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 7:28 p.m. PST

I use 1/48 scale vehicles with 28mm on raised bases as well. The 1/56 vehicles just don't look right

Bunkermeister Supporting Member of TMP12 Apr 2018 10:26 p.m. PST

I started using Roco Minitanks in HO 1/87 scale in about 1963 and Airfix figures in 1/76 and later 1/72nd scale and don't have a problem.

picture

Mike Bunkermeister Creek
https://bunkermeister.blogspot.com

UshCha13 Apr 2018 2:32 a.m. PST

I have long been appaled by the utter incompetence of most maufactures to stick even vaguely to scale, worse still figure size creep is inexcusible. It had gotten so bad that now I will only use actual scale 1/144 vehicles and am now having to do my own Infantry. They have to be a bit chunky due to manufacturing issues but at least they are the correct height. To be fair N gauge railway figures are close to real thicknesses but are too fragile for wargaming even if you could get sufficent types.

Trajanus13 Apr 2018 5:34 a.m. PST

The cartoonish proportions of 28mm figures means they are way bulkier than any appropriate scale with body height

I find Warlord Games 28mm particularly cartoonish, period!

The faces on some of their figures are just plain odd!

Fred Cartwright13 Apr 2018 6:19 a.m. PST

I have long been appaled by the utter incompetence of most maufactures to stick even vaguely to scale, worse still figure size creep is inexcusible.

Sadly like the poor and taxes I think figure creep will always be with us. It was ever thus, even back in the hallowed days of Airfix their figures grew in size as the range expanded.

Warlord13 Apr 2018 8:23 a.m. PST

I also use 1/48 1/50th scale vehicles and my miniatures on raised slotted-bases. I was done also when a friend of mine brought over a jeep and it was so small.

Article on scale:
link

Trajanus13 Apr 2018 8:30 a.m. PST

even back in the hallowed days of Airfix their figures grew in size as the range expanded.

God, I'd forgotten that! Yes they did !

4th Cuirassier13 Apr 2018 8:56 a.m. PST

@ minimo

If that re-enactor got out of the seat, it would look about the same as a Warlord figure next to a model.

Nah, his hands are too small. They'd need to be like shovels.

4th Cuirassier13 Apr 2018 8:58 a.m. PST

@ lucius

Plastic modellers and model railroaders just don't have this problem

You say that, but there are lots of complaints of the lack of observance of 1/72 versus 1/76 and of 1/32 versus 1/35. Meanwhile, one of the commoner gauges of model railway is 1/87 in two axes and 1/76 in the third.

Lucius13 Apr 2018 8:17 p.m. PST

Having been a plastic modeller, I'd say that the standards for plastic modelling scale are so much higher, that their complaints about scale are in a different dimension.

They have micrometer calipers. We have base-to-eyes.

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