Help support TMP


"Team Yankee: The Humvee swarm?" Topic


15 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the Modern Discussion (1946 to 2007) Message Board

Back to the Flames of War Message Board

Back to the Cold War (1946-1989) Message Board



1,604 hits since 31 Dec 2017
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Tgunner31 Dec 2017 5:06 p.m. PST

Hi all and happy New Year by the way,

Anyway, I had a great Christmas Team Yankee wise. My wonderful family got me the Stripes book and two sets of Ryan's Leathernecks.

picture

After going though these boxes I realised that I have quite a swarm of Humvees! 12 to be exact. According to Stripes I can field these little guys as a Cavalry Troop with one section of 4, two sections of 3, and a command section of two. That yields 4 TOW Humvees, 5 M2HB Humvees, and 3 MK19 Humvees for a rather paltry 8 points. Unfortunately I can only field one of these troops but there is plenty of room to grow it from these rather modest beginnings. At full strength this troop can field 12 (!) TOW Humvees, 8 M2HB Humvees, and 6 MK19 Humvees. That's still a pretty modest 26 "tank" teams for 19 points.

picture

I can see this being pretty scary if it is linked up with an airborne infantry company that adds another recon section and a TOW platoon. That is 6 more TOW HUMVEES matched up with a M2HB Humvee and a MK19 Humvee.

picture

picture

picture

Also you get to toss in three platoons of very solid infantry too!

picture

picture


So what do you think? Will the 82nd Airborne Humvee swarm see a lot of use?

Personal logo The Nigerian Lead Minister Supporting Member of TMP31 Dec 2017 8:11 p.m. PST

I think it's an interesting concept, and you could try to swamp a defense with that. Depends on what the opposition has and the scenario. If they have mostly tanks and the objectives are spread out you could do well. Smack into a full company of BMP-2s and you lose.

28mm Fanatik31 Dec 2017 9:37 p.m. PST

I see the Humvees as light recon assets. The Huey mounted infantry is just the American counterpart to the Soviet Afghantsy and British Lynx airmobile company.

Uparmored01 Jan 2018 2:18 a.m. PST

They're supposed to be Marines but most Marines don't ride in on Hueys, they ride on Phrogs

82nd doesn't ride on Hueys neither, that's the 101st.

The Humvees are supposed to be Marines too, the Marines are famous for fielding a lot of Humvees in anti tank roles. I remember a recount of a battle in Iraq in 2003 where they were very effective and swept past a large Iraqi armored unit.

Dn Jackson01 Jan 2018 8:13 p.m. PST

I can attest to how nice a unit of hummers with TOWs is. My battery was about to be over run during the First Gulf War. A battalion of Iraqi armor was headed towards us and we had no support. A flight of four Cobras, two with TOWs and two with rocket pods. They turned the attack back and a short time later the hummers showed up and took over security for us.

As an aside, those are not Marine hummers. At that time, (don't know about now), every hummer in the Corps had the deep water fording kit, which those models don't have.

Eumerin01 Jan 2018 10:14 p.m. PST

82nd doesn't ride on Hueys neither, that's the 101st.

It's a bit of a kludge. What I've been told over on the BF forums is that while the 82nd wasn't an Airmobile Division (like the 101st), it still had helicopters to move the infantry around. And if shooting had started in '85, then a parachute drop probably wouldn't have been realistic. So BF featured them with the Hueys.

Plus, BF wanted an excuse to sell more of the Sheridan models that it has for the Vietnam game (which is about to get a rerelease). And only the 82nd was using them in '85.

RudyNelson01 Jan 2018 10:44 p.m. PST

A standard Armored Cavalry platoon that has hummers instead of M113 would field 5 including two tow.
Our Delta troop had all aviation, Huey's and cobras
So a Cav troop would have 15 humvees, three mortar, 4.2", and nine M1 plus M577 Command plus two humvees plus mains vehicles.

Something often forgotten is the vehicles and tracks in the Company HQ and Maintenance plus medic lus ADA humvees

Mardaddy Inactive Member01 Jan 2018 10:54 p.m. PST

CAAT teams, typically organized as 2x HMMV's per CAAT team, one w/M2, one w/TOW. Each Infantry BN has 2-3 CAAT Teams. This is flexible if the unit is deployed as part of a MEU, as the MEU will be task-organized, pluss-ing up some assets before deployment in expectation of the logical threat.

They are NOT used for recon. They are a BN CO's dedicated anti-armor assets. If you use them for recon, you cannot apply your anti-armor where you need it (because you are already using it elsewhere.) IRL, anyways. On a game table, do what you will.

seneffe02 Jan 2018 3:57 p.m. PST

Not a TY player- but is this suggesting US Marines on the NATO central Front???

PS- I think (no expert) the 1980s USMC used M60A1s with the older box mounted IR equipment above the gun. The tanks in picture in the OP look more like M60A3 TTS which I thought were Army only. Afficionadoes have probably already debated that.

Tgunner02 Jan 2018 4:40 p.m. PST

Sort of.

In the Stripes book they have the 2nd MarDiv landing in Jutland and spearheading a LANDJUT counter-offensive to link up with III Corps near Bremen. They are supported by German and Danish armor forces who do a lot of the heavy lifting while they carry out a blitzkrieg along North Sea coast. They do carryout a couple of amphib flanking maneuvers to force the Soviets to fall back. I'm guessing that NATO has air and naval superiority, if not supremacy, in the area.

So, not too far fetched. They are NOT on the central front.

The set is also useful for making elements of the 82nd Airborne as I mentioned above. The M60s are fine for 1st AD too, at least according to the fluff. I wonder if they are good for the 1st ID? I would think so.

I believe you're right about the M60s. The Marines had the M60A1 in the Gulf and that was 1991. The instructions seem to say that the only difference between the two types are the gun barrels. But I think you're right about the IR gear. I don't see a spotlight there.

picture

I have seen pictures of M60A1s without the thing, but that was in the Gulf.

picture

Or oddball shots like this:

link

link

Are these A3s? They look like they have M1 style "dog house" sights to the left of the main gun on the turret.

The dino tankers out there (like Murphy) could probably fill in the details on that. All I personally ever saw were A3s.

Mardaddy Inactive Member02 Jan 2018 6:22 p.m. PST

I was AD USMC 1983-2004, seen & deployed with M60's with and without the IR during the 80's (west coast.) I wasn't a tanker, so never gave it much mind at the time, but sometimes they had the box, sometimes not.

Eumerin02 Jan 2018 7:44 p.m. PST

I'm guessing that NATO has air and naval superiority

Your guess is as good as mine for naval superiority. But neither side has air superiority. The fighters are busy killing each other at high altitude, and can't risk dropping to low altitude because of the disadvantage it puts them at with regards to enemy fighters. So the ground support aircraft (fixed wing and helicopter) on both sides are able to do their work with minimal interference.

seneffe03 Jan 2018 2:27 p.m. PST

Tgunner- I think that the 1st AD tank units had the M60A3 TTS by 1985, according to the very well sourced Tankograd volumes on the Reforger exercises which has photos of A3s with that Division's 1/12 Armor and other units.

However, the same source does show the 1st ID (at least 1/34 Armor of 1st Brigade) were still using M60A1 AOS in 1986. Other photos show M60A1 with the 3rd ACR in 1983 (pres POMCUS vehicle), and with the 3/77 Armor and 4/12 Cavalry (POMCUS again) of 5th ID in 1984.

Nearly every other picture of M60s on FTX in Germany from c1983-87 (1st AD, 8th ID, 4th ID, 197 Sep Brig) show the A3TTS whether regular or POMCUS issue.

I can't recommend the Tankograd Reforger series (and all their other books) highly enough. They are produced by some guys who were evidently extremely dedicated tank spotters back in the day and amassed a huge photographic archive of what units used what equipment and when (down to the day sometimes). Other interesting items are pics of mid 80s M113s of 1st AD and 8th ID equipped with ACAV kits- presumably from Vietnam-era stocks- to give them a little extra capability during the wait for Bradleys. Maybe useful for TY gamers with spare Battlefront Vietnam ACAVs lying around.

Of your pics- I think the first is an M60A1 of GW1 vintage (I think they had been given a TTS fit and thermal shroud on the gun barrel by then- making them very similar spec to the Army A3TTS except for the reactive armour) and the other two are A3s. Happy to be corrected on any of the above points.

LDC271 Inactive Member04 Jan 2018 10:26 p.m. PST

@Tgunner
The spotlight is a two-piece build. The two pieces are right next to the hatch.
@seneffe
Interesting point about M113s. I'm doing a South Korean force and apparently they loved the ACAV turret so much they use it to this day.

Tgunner15 Jan 2018 7:24 p.m. PST

I just saw that. Thanks for pointing that out!

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.