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"Morrell3Dprints - Terrain Kickstarter " Topic


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1,597 hits since 20 Nov 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
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Tango0120 Nov 2017 8:33 p.m. PST

Morrell3Dprints launched a Kickstarter for 3D-printable terrain:

picture

Main page
link

Amicalement
Armand

The H Man20 Nov 2017 10:16 p.m. PST

Looks nice and all.

Do they come ready made or do they expect you to fork out for an expensive piece of technology or printing service?

Seems like very lazy business to me. Like selling e books I guess, but you don't have to print e books now do you.

Stealth100021 Nov 2017 3:11 a.m. PST

I get annoyed at all these 3D print it yourself things. Its all ok if you can lay out all that money for a printer but it sucks for the rest of us.

jefritrout Supporting Member of TMP21 Nov 2017 6:50 a.m. PST

This one appears to come ready made. It can also come painted if you prefer that option.

Waco Joe21 Nov 2017 7:48 a.m. PST

Stealth, I have noticed a new trend in the last couple of kickstarters I am following. In addition to the pledge levels for the stl files to do it yourself, the companies are offering a print license, usually limited to four or five backers who want to go into selling the terrain. You would just need to contact the backers who get the license.

SeattleGamer21 Nov 2017 8:41 a.m. PST

I don't understand the animosity towards 3D printing, purchasing the files, and printing/making them yourself.

It is just another (new) aspect to the hobby. Some people sculpt their own minis. Most do not. Some people hire painting done by other. Most do not. Some people scratch-build their own terrain. Most do not.

And now, some can actually pay for the files to be designed by others, then use a printer to make as many as they want.

Some of the files I have purchased came from hobby folks who have design skills, and a 3D printer made it possible for them to realize their own dreams of making their own stuff. And after having designed their own stuff, friends pressed them to make it available to the public. Raise some money to support their own hobby.

There are many people out there who make terrain and sell it, and I don't remember a single negative comment about them doing so.

This is just one more example of gamers providing something to other gamers for a price.

I've seen lots of comments about a product that looks great, but it is in the wrong scale for the poster. Seems to me you could just say "Looks nice, but I don't have a 3D printer."

Maybe, over time, you will see enough nice stuff that fits your gaming needs, that you will actually get a printer.

Just don't get the negativity.

Tango0121 Nov 2017 10:32 a.m. PST

Glad you like it boys!. (smile)

Amicalement
Armand

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP21 Nov 2017 11:05 a.m. PST

"Just don't get the negativity."

Some people seem to think that being negative about things is clever and edgy. They are just projecting an image. It just isn't the one that they think they are projecting.

The H Man21 Nov 2017 11:49 p.m. PST

I can see you both require help understanding the situation.

It just a useless product to most people. We don't have 3d printers. Simple as that.

While it's great they may now offer limited prints, that is probably what they should be doing to begin with. Though, then it would be cheaper and easier to just cast them in resin.

3d printers are a novelty. At least in this industry. They produce, usually, lower quality items for a higher price with more fuss. They are not designed for high volume production and require much maintenance. They are not a microwave. More the bread maker, remember those?

Just sell people the rattley box.

Personal logo Sgt Slag Supporting Member of TMP22 Nov 2017 7:45 a.m. PST

3D printers are actually relatively affordable, cash wise. They still have a very steep learning curve. The deal-breaker's, for me, are: the low resolution; the learning curve; and the time it takes to print stuff.

I expect in the next five years, they will become more mainstream, faster, less expensive, with a much higher resolution, and with a much easier learning curve. I figure I will likely buy a 3D printer in about five years… Cheers!

The Angry Piper Supporting Member of TMP22 Nov 2017 8:43 a.m. PST

It just a useless product to most people. We don't have 3d printers. Simple as that.

It's also cheaper for a company (or an individual) to provide a file to those who may have access to the technology rather than manufacturing the whole "rattley box" you mention. No, not everyone has a 3D printer, myself included. I'm more inclined to Sgt Slag's POV. Maybe in a few years. Until then, what's wrong with talented people making stuff that they may not be able to manufacture themselves, but allowing those who can to do so? And making a small profit in the meantime without shouldering the production costs?

Sounds like good business to me. Kind of like how companies sell you the PDF version of a book that you can print yourself (or not). Saves them money, saves you money.

And to save you some time and effort (and to save myself some unnecessary snarkiness), I require no help in understanding "the situation". No need to explain.

link

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP22 Nov 2017 12:05 p.m. PST

From the defensiveness of the response, it sounds like I hit the nail on the head.

The H Man22 Nov 2017 12:28 p.m. PST

Only your thumb pics, as usual.

Also pics, at least I am trying to explain a few things and not simply causing trouble. I am sure we wiuld all love to hear your ideas on the subject. (I wouldnt, so you may as well, at least it would beat your previous bothersome posts)

Don't worry piper you need no explaining.

Sgt slag got it also. Although you forgot about maintenance. Print beds, the tray it's printed on, require frequent (100ish? Prints) replacement. Also other bits have ware and tear. Print fails can occur. Time can be spent adjusting things. So time and money basically.

If you have one and enjoy novelties, use it. You can enjoy your fake homemade bread while you watch it print (I will never understand bread machines!?).

Golgoloth22 Nov 2017 12:56 p.m. PST

The H Man wrote:

"Do they come ready made or do they expect you to fork out for an expensive piece of technology or printing service?"

Had you even bothered to take a look and read the KS, you might not have needed to appear so … exposed ..?

But you didn't. You just mouthed off, insulted a couple of people, and … well … the rest is as evident as your lack of civility.

Pretty bad form insulting other members, but I'm sure they can hack it.

But it's very bad form to start lies about somebody's kickstarter campaign, don't you think?

The H Man22 Nov 2017 1:53 p.m. PST

Who am i supposed to have insulted? I have said nothing to that end and apologize to anyone who feels I have.

Pics got on and gave me grief. Have a go at him, he deserves it. He still has not commented on the topic, just causing trouble.

I'm only going by what's in the initial post. True. It never said anything about pre printed parts. So I'm only going on what the reviewer said. And now fellow posters.

I'm still not sure what all the bad vibes from a few are about. Comment on the topic, not things you read into comments that are not there and are not related to the topic, you only waste people's time.

The H Man22 Nov 2017 2:26 p.m. PST

Looking at the ks it is good to see they are printed for the customer.

Again. Yes, they do come preprinted.

Still would it not be both cheaper and easier to cast in resin? I would think so.

Not sure the chances of the ks being funded however, with only 4 backers. Still a week to go though.

The chap in the video seems to really like the terrain. But we can't take his word for it as he did not say anything!

I think any design problem may be the generic nature of the ruins. Hardly unique to this company. Still they do offer great opportunities for conversions to suit your army. And being what sounds like their first range, genetic is a safe road to travel.

They are abs. Is this not harder to paint? Anyone had experience painting it?

SeattleGamer22 Nov 2017 3:01 p.m. PST

Happy to stand with you Pictors Studio.

So H Man, by your reasoning, since I don't game Napoleonics, I should deride those who do? It's a worthless product to me, therefore, it should be worthless to everyone?

My preferred scale is 28-32mm ish. I learned long ago that I just could not stand to paint anything smaller. So does that mean anyone who offers up a nifty product but in the "wrong" scale should be called out for offering up something worthless?

I embrace diversity in my hobby. I am glad that some folks get a kick out of ordering ancient legions about the table, or panzers, or alien life forms intent on wiping out mankind. I like that they do so in many different scales, to many different rule sets.

And I like these .STL files that will let me crank out as many of a thing as I want, and upscale or downscale it to suit my needs.

Are the terrain elements I print better resolution that I can get in a store? No. Do they get hte job done, and in a pleasing enough way for me to enjoy that aspect of my hobby? Yes.

And the printers will get better. And the resolution will improve. And the cost will go down. I can see why some would wait. I can see why some will never get one. And I can see why some (myself included) might pony up the dollars and get one now.

No need to belittle those who do, or the merchants who offer up such files. Just because something is worthless to you doesn't mean it is worthless.

The Angry Piper Supporting Member of TMP22 Nov 2017 3:16 p.m. PST

HOLY CRAP! The KS guy is from New Bedford, Massachusetts!!!! That's literally my backyard!!!!!

I feel like I should have learned of this sooner through word on the street rather than the Argentinian grapevine. :) But thanks anyway, Armand!

The H Man22 Nov 2017 3:20 p.m. PST

Quick. They need your backing.

Re seattle gamer. Why stand up for a person who only commented to harass others? Each to their own I guess.

I'm only pointing out the flaws I see in the product and it's production. That's kind of the point of these reviews, don't you think? To weigh up the pros and cons.

It's certainly not to come in like your hero pics and have a go at someone without any mention of the topic being discussed. He may well be the type to use others for his dirty work (who knows?). Just don't let him use you.

While you may show a little printer owners bias, your insight and comments are most welcome.

Golgoloth22 Nov 2017 3:30 p.m. PST

Never underestimate the power of the Argentinian Grapevine …

@The H: you really are coming across as TFG.
But I guess you know that already, right?

The H Man22 Nov 2017 4:28 p.m. PST

Tfg? I don't know what that is.

Looked it up taken for granted.

All I'm trying to do is comment on the topic and suddenly there are hecklers. Thats all. Ill try to ignor them. Thats probobly the best thing to do.

About that topic. Abs. Anyone painted it before? Sounds like priming is important.

Golgoloth22 Nov 2017 5:16 p.m. PST

LOL Very wrong definition!

Your first post:

"Looks nice and all.

Do they come ready made or do they expect you to fork out for an expensive piece of technology or printing service?

Seems like very lazy business to me. Like selling e books I guess, but you don't have to print e books now do you."

Had you bothered to read it, you'd have known that they do come ready made (well, would have … they probably won't now, actually … funding looks meagre … but still).

And then you have the temerity to use the word "lazy" in respect of their business model?

Pot, Kettle, Pot … and both black all over … or something…

The H Man22 Nov 2017 5:34 p.m. PST

If you had read above posts you will see that I have been to the ks. I was initially just going by the first post. Nothing wrong with that.

It is still lazy as they are using 3d printers to do the molding and casting work instead of tried and true resin or other. Perhaps looking for an easier way. Unfortunatly we may never know if this production technique works out for them. At least for now.

It also seems a process that a lot could go wrong with when the pressure ison. Like trying to fulfill ks obligations.

Hey. The parts look OK. If this fails they should just mold them and try again with resin. Or as some people seem keen, sell the program files. Or better yet both! (I say this as they have already done a lot of work and should see some return for their efforts)

Golgoloth. Please write what you mean in future and not hide behind letters. Very rude. As we could only guess was your true meaning, what ever it was.

Tango0122 Nov 2017 9:01 p.m. PST

A votre service mon ami!. (smile)

Amicalement
Armand

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian22 Nov 2017 9:55 p.m. PST

I expect in the next five years, they will become more mainstream, faster, less expensive, with a much higher resolution, and with a much easier learning curve.

I'm not sure. The current technology seems to have hit a dead end, and the other technologies have problems. We'll see…

The H Man22 Nov 2017 10:46 p.m. PST

There are also the physical limits. How fast the print head can move and still have stability. How fast the filament can melt and be extruded. Speed may always be an issue.

Something more instant may be the future. Like 3d photo etching or light sensitive resins. Zap, its done.

Rev Zoom23 Nov 2017 9:06 a.m. PST

To all the naysayers: If you don't have a 3D printer, then move along, nothing to see here.

The H Man23 Nov 2017 1:53 p.m. PST

Actually the opposite is true.

What if you never looked at 3d printing? You would have never gotten into it!

Seems yet another who has nothing to say on the topic. How dull.

Perhaps these are the people who should move along?

Tigerjlm24 Nov 2017 11:00 a.m. PST

1: How can you call someone's business practice lazy when you don't take the time yourself initially to read into the product?
2: Don't all new technologies start off as 'novelty', at least until it's is figured out how to make it work at scale?
3: As was already stated, useless to some(no matter the ratio) does not in itself make it entirely useless for all. If the shoe fits wear it, otherwise move on, no ones forcing it on you.
4: 'Lower quality at a higher price'?? I would disagreed. If your buying prints off Shapeways as I have done before, I would say they are High Quality @ High Price. Now having a lower quality printer myself, under $200 USD, I have been printing pretty decent models and from doing the math, it's been at pretty low cost and I'm still learning how to adjust the printer in order to improve quality.

Business are built around strength's. Modeler's and sculptor's know physical objects so more accustomed to Molding/Casting. Software/3D modelers know software so will develop their business around that. Problems can arise in Molding/Casting also and from my experience are more costly in the material sense.

In my view 3D Printing will be most impactful in two areas: Production of masters that can then be Molded and Cast. But don't expect every company to take it to that level. They might not have the expertise, and you can't fault them for sticking with what they know.
Two, Specialty Items that would be cost prohibitive to actually Mold/Cast due to lack of demand. This is where 3D printing can boost the hobby and allow for people to create the things that normally wouldn't be seen as worth it.

Rev Zoom24 Nov 2017 1:16 p.m. PST

Hey there H Man – I didn't look at 3D printing with a negative attitude. Notice I said the naysayers – those who reject it before they even examine it.

I have a bit to say – I've said it under other topics.

Now, please play nice. We are on the same side.

Rev Zoom24 Nov 2017 1:21 p.m. PST

H Man – here is what I am referring to:
"I get annoyed at all these 3D print it yourself things. Its all ok if you can lay out all that money for a printer but it sucks for the rest of us."

There is an excellent printer out there for less than $300 USDhttps://www.cetus3d.com/shop
so the argument that they are out of people's price range just doesn't hold. Personally, I have a Prusa I3 Mk2S and a Sindoh DP201. But one need not have anything that costly to have a good time printing – and thingiverse has scads of files for our miniature gaming purposes.

Andy ONeill25 Nov 2017 1:46 a.m. PST

Hey guys.
It's nice to be nice.
Everyone.
Could we all try to get along?


Personally, I feel the technology is not ready for household use. Maybe it never will be.
I'd have been more interested if this was resin.
Each to ones own though.
The market will decide.

Tango0125 Nov 2017 10:21 a.m. PST

Amen!

Amicalement
Armand

Golgoloth25 Nov 2017 1:52 p.m. PST

I have never found myself agreeing with so many Americans as in this thread :)

See? Extracting something positive!

The H Man02 Dec 2017 12:16 p.m. PST

Rev zoom. I have examined 3d printing. Hence my views. And you are forgetting the expenses associated with printing. Computers, running costs, servicing costs. From scratch and for a good few years of regular use the cost of a printer is small in comparison to total cost. To average Joe there is too much hassle. They are still a specialist item if to be used and maintained properly and effectively.

The H Man02 Dec 2017 12:25 p.m. PST

Just checked the ks. Canceled by the creator. Basically no pledges (less than $500 USD). Would have looked better for them to let it play out though, even if it did flop. Not that any of this proves my point or anything. ..

I do hope they cast them in resin and give it another go.

ramsildor02 Dec 2017 10:28 p.m. PST

As an avid 3D Printer fan this is a very humorous thread. Clearly no one here has heard of Printable Scenery, Fat Dragon, Hobgolin, Axolite,Printable Table Top Terrain or Thingiverse. 3D printing is alive and well and with FDM printers now dropping in prices, miniature figures are beginning to pour out with the quality of resin, metal or injection molding. I have 6 3D printers. I print 28mm Tanks, terrain, roads, rivers, sidewalks trees, etc. Pretty much anything you can imagine. I am currently printing a 28mm Mine for gaming. Just finished the 2nd floor of my Tavern that can be used for swashbuckling games. It comes with a Bar, Tables, beds, even rugs for the floors. The last printer I bought was only $154.00 USD a Monoprice Mini Select III V2. It is a great machine, has a heated bed and is modifiable. There is also a great Facebook group that is nothing but helpful if you have issues and questions. Never saw the KS in question but I have done about 10 .stl file Kickstarter and currently funding three more. So if you are wondering I have 3 Mini Select 3, 1 M3D, 1 Prusa 3i Mk2s, and a Creator Pro for Microcenter. The Creator Pro has been pumping out terrain for three years and hasn't missed a beat

The H Man03 Dec 2017 1:38 a.m. PST

Good to hear. However that is quite a set up you have there. Hardly for the casual war gamer (may I call you obsessed?). Most people don't have the space or funds available for a set up like that. At the end of the day a rattley box from a shop is just more convenient and easier for most. Disappointing I know, but only because they are not making it from scratch.

I feel the main issue is convenience. Is there a printer, from target or wall mart, that you can just plugin to a wall socket shove in a USB or store bought card with file, load some plastic cartridge and push print? With out the price tag or need for computer or tech degree? And not having to wait all day for it to fail?

Still a novelty. They have replaced the apple peeler/corer demo at shows and events. Pity. I like apples.

jensutkremp03 Dec 2017 10:37 p.m. PST

3d printing is a new medium that many do not want to understand or understand.
There will always be discussions (negative). But that reminds me of many areas. I know, many years ago I had a discussion with an ambitious amateur photographer. At that time I had bought myself for a lot of money a 1.0 megapixel ;-) digital camera. He told me back then, these digital cameras are gimmicks and will never prevail …… uhahahahahaha

Also I like to remember the discussions in forums with amusement, when it was about 28mm figures and contemptuously looked at the 1:72 plastic figures. At that time was the announcement. Plastic figures will never be able to establish themselves in the wargame sector …. then came Perry, Victrix, Warlord etc ….

Actually, we should see this discussion about 3D printers very relaxed, sit back and rejoice that we can use these great devices for our hobby …

Printing time. Relative. Of course a large building takes hours. But if you are willed to let run your dishwasher over night, also your 3d printer can run over night. At breakfast take a look to your print, itīs ready. If you are ordering your preferred stuff, it can take days, if you have pity weeks ….

The H Man04 Dec 2017 4:26 a.m. PST

However 1 mp cameras never did catch on (back at ya). Film is still a preferred archival choice. Many serious photographers still use film. Digital cameras and storage are just cheaper not better or more reliable.

Which just proves the point with printers. It's cheaper and easier to buy a pre made item. This, unfirtunatly, is what the mass market wants today. Not a workshop tool you have to fiddle with. Otherwise everyone would service their own cars or mow their own lawn. Most people cant be bothered or dont have the money skill or time for many things. I dont see this changing any time soon.

ramsildor04 Dec 2017 4:18 p.m. PST

Funny I remember when folks said the same things about computers, now they are appliances. I bought my first computer in 1980 and quickly knew this technology was here to stay. Next year I will be in the IT business for 40 years. Trust me the technology is here to stay, and with the advent of some very powerful 3D design programs, Many companies are doing all of the miniature modelling there, sadly this may lead to the end of the amazingly talented sculpters. We are actually in what is called the beginnings of the 4th age of manfacturing,between 3D printers, desktop CNC machines and laser cutters, some items are becoming on demand makes for folks. So let me know when you want some pre-made terrain for gaming, not sure about others here but all of the "pre-made" items that I put on Ebay have treated me pretty well financially.

thehawk04 Dec 2017 6:24 p.m. PST

Many companies are doing all of the miniature modelling there

It is possible to print an injection molding die from the 3D figure models. Low cost, when it breaks print another.

One kickstarter delivered a home automated injection molding machine for under $2 USDk. But resin printing produces superior detail and many models can be printed concurrently in the same time it takes to do one.

The H Man04 Dec 2017 8:55 p.m. PST

Both with valid points.

Though I don't think art will ever be killed off by technology. We have cameras yet more people seen to be painting canvas than ever before.

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