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"National Anthem at Wargaming Show?" Topic

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Action Log

25 May 2018 10:15 p.m. PST
by Editor in Chief Bill

  • Removed from TMP Poll Suggestions board

2,797 hits since 31 Oct 2017
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
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Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian31 Oct 2017 6:39 p.m. PST

If they play the national anthem before a sports game, should they perform the national anthem at the start of the day at a wargaming show or convention?

RudyNelson31 Oct 2017 6:45 p.m. PST

It is a hobby not a sporting event.
In the end it is all up to the host club and staff.
I have no problem with it.

Timbo W31 Oct 2017 6:48 p.m. PST

At Crusade in Penarth it would certainly surprise the English

Stryderg31 Oct 2017 7:32 p.m. PST

At one of the conventions I was at, someone started playing bagpipes. Apparently it added some flavor to the game he was hosting. It was pretty good…if you like bagpipes.

Lord Ashram31 Oct 2017 7:34 p.m. PST

Anyone can play bagpipes whenever they want to, as long as they play well, as far as I am concerned…

McKinstry Fezian31 Oct 2017 7:59 p.m. PST


Personal logo capncarp Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 9:08 p.m. PST

Only if all the games have 'Muricans as one of the contestants. Otherwise, "Hail, Hail, Fredonia!", "Waltzing Matilda", "La Marseillaise" (with Spanish guitar, brass section, and Sam's piano accompanying), The Conch Republic Anthem, "Lydia the Tattooed Lady" or "Hooray for Captain Spauldlng".

KSmyth31 Oct 2017 9:15 p.m. PST


23rdFusilier31 Oct 2017 9:17 p.m. PST

Please no….

PrivateSnafu31 Oct 2017 9:28 p.m. PST

No! It should be the Pledge of Allegiance.

lloydthegamer Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 9:31 p.m. PST


Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 10:34 p.m. PST


Do all the players playing "progressive" nations ( Soviet Union, Revolutionary French, Cuba…) have to kneel?

What a dumb topic, which flagrantly violates the vaunted TMP "no politics" rule.
The OP needs 5 days in the DH for that.
Oh, wait. It's The Editor.
Never mind.

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member31 Oct 2017 10:47 p.m. PST

Trick or treat!

shaun from s and s models Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 2:06 a.m. PST

which national anthem?

Dicymick01 Nov 2017 3:29 a.m. PST

How about onward Christian Soldiers.

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 4:00 a.m. PST

You're confused. It's the people who want exemptions from anti-trust laws and taxpayer-funded stadiums who want to play--and then disrespect--the Anthem.

For us, how about a few bars of "The March of the Tin Soldiers" on opening day? Beats that woman at Valley Forge Convention Center who wanted to give a speech.

JimDuncanUK01 Nov 2017 5:02 a.m. PST

Don't think some UK wargamers would be happy with an anthem which includes a verse about 'crushing rebellious Scots'.

Joes Shop Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 5:11 a.m. PST


Ottoathome Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 5:35 a.m. PST

As far as I know, no wargame convention has ever played the anthem or recited the pledge of allegiance. Nor has any model railroad show, coin collecters event, numismatic event, quilting show, auto show, boat show, flea market, garage sale, or social event or county fair, picnic, barbecue or lodge day.

Deleted by Moderator

Rotundo01 Nov 2017 6:04 a.m. PST

To answer as posed, I would participate respectfully whether my nation or another. I do not however, feel it necessary.

Legion 401 Nov 2017 6:16 a.m. PST

No need for the Anthem[the US's I take it as Bill lives in the USA ?!] to be played at a place where [supposed]grown men and possibly some women play with toys. IMO, of course, it really is not necessary …

I think Otto put in best …

WarWizard01 Nov 2017 6:28 a.m. PST

At the start of the day? What is considered the start – 5 minutes before they open the ticket booth? Not everyone, is present at the start of a wargaming convention. And mostly everyone is not present. At least at the ones I've attended. would be better attended in middle of day. But I see no reason to do either.

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 9:57 a.m. PST

You're on to something there, Robert:

Though given some Historicon trips,this might be more appropriate:

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian01 Nov 2017 11:39 a.m. PST

Comments attempting to politicize the discussion have been removed.

When I attended college, the national anthem was played every morning. Wouldn't that be even more appropriate at a wargaming convention, where the battles are inspired by real men who gave their lives for real causes? Is it too much to ask wargamers to take a moment to reflect on the real casualties of war?

Personal logo Flashman14 Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 12:00 p.m. PST

The long historical and pervasive process of conscription detracts from the notion that men died for a cause. Men who volunteered maybe, but in the end men give their lives for their brethren in the ranks.

GildasFacit Sponsoring Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 12:22 p.m. PST

I think that you overstate the link between wargaming and real war. Very few wargamers I know have any links to the military at all.

I can't really see what effect a national anthem has that will make any link between military deaths and games simulating combats that may have been many thousands of years ago or even imaginary.

I suppose the anthem has more cultural significance in the US than it does in the UK but still doubt the efficacy of the plan.

JARROVIAN Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 12:32 p.m. PST

People who have lost loved ones in conflict carry their memory in their hearts and 'reflect' on them continually. For the rest of us, official remembrance days give us a time to do that, although I'm sure many wargamers are not so shallow as to not think of those lost on many occasions while playing or researching.
The playing of a mere 'tune' doesn't do anything for me, unless of course, it is 'The Last Post' or 'Sunset'

goragrad01 Nov 2017 1:27 p.m. PST

As noted, I am not sure why an organizer would want to play the anthem at a convention.

Even the local clubs 'Veteran Wars' scheduled for the 11th and 12th aren't restricting the games to conflicts that involved America – one of them is a HOTT tourney.

At that point, the playing the anthem becomes rather moot.

TSD10101 Nov 2017 5:27 p.m. PST

Only if the anthem is Borussia.

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 5:39 p.m. PST

Hafen, they lied to you. That was the Parade of the Toy Soldiers.

Here is the March of the Little Tin Soldiers:

YouTube link

I play it for troop reviews.

War Scorpio01 Nov 2017 5:59 p.m. PST

I would like to know what was "snipped" out of Otto's post. Otto, tell us in "code".

Nick Pasha01 Nov 2017 6:20 p.m. PST

Please, no. Playing the anthem is not as simple as it used to be. Not everyone at the con is an American. I also agree with Rudy. This is a hobby.

Nick Pasha01 Nov 2017 6:28 p.m. PST

Editor Bill

You deleted entries that you feel tried to politicize the issue, but isn't your post about the anthem in college and playing it at conventions to show respect for those people who gave their lives in the battles we model a little political as well. That is the issue at the heart of the controversy.

War Scorpio01 Nov 2017 6:46 p.m. PST

Nick is correct. The Editor starts this post, pontificates about the cause, and then suppresses the views of TPM'ers. Doesn't seem right. If I went on, I too would be deleted.

Skeptic01 Nov 2017 7:11 p.m. PST

Ha! Ha! Ha! No…

Skeptic01 Nov 2017 7:14 p.m. PST

@NP, @WS: "Let a hundred flowers blossom"?

Personal logo miniMo Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 8:11 p.m. PST

The question was purely political.

Hail Freedonia is the only acceptable choice!
YouTube link

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 8:47 p.m. PST

What,Robert? You're saying youtube is wrong? I cannot believe it!

But you are correct, of course. Except that it's "Parade of the Wooden Soldiers" by Jessel. I still like that video,though. Here's a version from a 1928 film (color!):

At least that one got the name right--I noticed many others say "Tin".

It's confusing. There's also this well-known toy soldier march:

But also this one I never heard of:

And we can't do without Victor Herbert!

Now where did I put those Eurekas?


(^These aren't mine,sad to say. Beautiful though, aren't they?^).

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 9:04 p.m. PST

Oh yes--for miniMo,and for every deleted poster:

Personal logo piper909 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 9:14 p.m. PST

So MANY snips and deleted comments! Is the subject matter of this thread designed to create controversy and bad vibes?

Since when is the national anthem (any anthem) a de facto requirement at a game convention? Should we also pledge allegiance to a flag? Kiss the big toe of an effigy of the Leader? Enjoy a Two-Minute Hate?

Hail, Freedonia!

Personal logo piper909 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member01 Nov 2017 9:19 p.m. PST

Excuse me while I check out the current Dawghouse kennel….

Quelle suprise!! Only two incarcerated, and neither for this topic, far as I can tell. Che miracolo!

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 10:53 p.m. PST

I see no DH icons by anyone's nzme.
And I'm too lazy to check all the DELETED for locked accounts.

So, to anyone who considers this thread as controversy bait, it didn't work.
One would have to be as dumb as Wile E Coyote standing under the giant hammer labeled "TRAP".

Personal logo Doctor X Supporting Member of TMP01 Nov 2017 11:49 p.m. PST

This topic looks like a CIA memo from the Warren Commission with all the redacted statements.

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member02 Nov 2017 6:03 a.m. PST

No locked accounts, Winston. Yet.

Still early days,though.

Legion 402 Nov 2017 8:20 a.m. PST

Oh ! Like those Wooded Soldiers ! thumbs up

Hafen von Schlockenberg Inactive Member02 Nov 2017 8:40 a.m. PST

They are lovely, aren't they? They're from a blog by Corporal Trim,a member here,with whom I share a certain literary connection. I haven't seen a post from him in a while,but I hope he won't mind my posting a link:


You can also find more pics of his stuff through a Google Image search for "Eureka Toy Soldiers".

WaltOHara02 Nov 2017 9:49 a.m. PST

Absolutely not. Let's not polititicize another thing, thank you very much.

dsfrank Inactive Member02 Nov 2017 3:09 p.m. PST

I don't feel the need for the national anthem to be played at conventions or sporting events – I stand & I served this great country in the Army for nearly 10 yrs to protect the rights of others to speak their minds & protest peacefully – I don't see it as a sign of disrespect for the military, my service, or my country

Legion 402 Nov 2017 3:23 p.m. PST

They are lovely, aren't they?
They're classic in look and style !

I served this great country in the Army for nearly 10 yrs to protect the rights of others to speak their minds & protest peacefully I don't see it as a sign of disrespect for the military, my service, or my country
ditto … same-same … thumbs up

Andrew Preziosi Supporting Member of TMP02 Nov 2017 6:25 p.m. PST

As did I, dsfrank…glad to see someone else who remembers just what we pledged to and served for! 😊

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