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"Crusader Mk2 & Humber Armoured Car for Operation Crusader " Topic


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540 hits since 29 Oct 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
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mysteron Supporting Member of TMP30 Oct 2017 2:40 a.m. PST

Was the Crusader MK2 used during Operation Crusader?

I am getting back into WW2 again and I was hoping to include the new FOW Crusader sets in my planned force for Battlegroup Tobruk. However the set but doesn't include the option to build the MK1 which equipped the 22nd Armoured Brigade at this time. So I was wondering if the other units for Operation Crusader used the newer MK2 as the build programme indicates more of the Mk2s were built during 1941 than the MK1 version .

Would the 11th Hussars at this time be equipped with the Humber Mk2 Armoured Car?

Thanks in anticipation of your help

kustenjaeger30 Oct 2017 7:40 a.m. PST

Greetings

From secondary sources, 11th Hussars had Humber II for Crusader but Crusader Mk II arrived in early 1942. However I haven't seen primary support for either statement.

Regards

Edward

Lion in the Stars30 Oct 2017 1:22 p.m. PST

Wiki says that the difference between Crusader 1 and 2 was the addition of some armor on the glacis and turret front.

How visible is that at 15mm?

I mean, it's not like the spaced armor on the Pz3…

mysteron Supporting Member of TMP30 Oct 2017 2:23 p.m. PST

There is quite a big differnce between the Mk1 and 2 in the way of the machine gun turret sitting at the front.

mysteron Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 3:12 a.m. PST

Somebody on another forum has pointed out to me that the FOW kit does come complete with the machine gun turret to make the MK1 Crusader. For some reason they don't advertise this and its been listed as a component that isn't used in the kit. A strange way of doing things but Hey Ho.

This means I can now do 22nd Armoured .

The only thing to clarify is whether the 11th Hussars had the Humber or not at Crusader. A few sources say they did but there appears to be lack of photographic evidence to back this up

Thanks for the input and comments

badger2231 Oct 2017 6:34 a.m. PST

Yes the assembly diagram doesn't even show the small turret, so I have not included it on any of my crusaders for crusader. However, after a small bit of looking I found somebody that says a lot of them were removed by the crews, so that's my story and I am sticking with it! The rest of the crusaders will have it on however.

mysteron Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 7:42 a.m. PST

Hello Badger22 You don't have to be exact its just whenever I pick a force to collect I like allocating a specific time period to them. I will be using mine, at out club for encounters in other periods as well.
I don't know when they started removing the turrets but I can concur with you that they did.

badger2231 Oct 2017 8:01 a.m. PST

Mysteron, Brits in NA is a new bit for me. I have done Germans for many years, but now I am collecting both sides, and am having a bit of trouble.

Do you know where the A13s were, and how the were issued out? I believe they were all in 7th BDE, but in 1 RGT? Or a squadron in each RGT? Or something else I have not visualized? Any help is much appreciated.


Owen

mysteron Supporting Member of TMP31 Oct 2017 11:26 a.m. PST

Hi mate

At the time of Crusadar according to my research A15s were in 6RTR which was part of 7th Armoured Brigade .There were also in one of the squadrons for the 7th Queen Hussars also in the 7th .
7TH ARMOURED Brigade is quite interesting to represent as it is varied.

badger2231 Oct 2017 6:56 p.m. PST

Yes I think I have the A15s figured out, it is the old A13s I am having trouble with. One count I have from a website shows more than a single RGT worth of them actually present for the campaign. Even which BDE they were in, just not which RGTs had them.

I am sure the info is somewhere, just having a hard time finding it.

Owen

badger2231 Oct 2017 7:35 p.m. PST

Specifically, 7th ABG shows 71 crusaders and 87 A13s. As that is about the same total number of tanks as the other 2 BDEs it seems reasonable, but no way to evenly break that into RGTs. So there either was a mix of vehicles in a RGT or 2, or there was some big variance in RGT strength.

Thanks for the time BTW, always nice to find somebody who wants to talk NA.

Owen

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