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"The last fight of the Santísima Trinidad." Topic


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1,028 hits since 19 Oct 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

ModelJShip20 Oct 2017 10:32 a.m. PST

Tomorrow, October 21 marks the 212th anniversary of a battle that truncated Napoleon's plans. The British fought against the Franco-Spanish alliance. On the one hand, the british had 18000 men on 33 ships and the alliance about 27,000 men on 40 ships. Many lives were lost that day, among many others, Spain lost ten of the fifteen boats with which it fought, with a total of 1022 dead (among which Cosme de Churruca, hit by a cannon shot in one leg; Luis Perez del Camino Llarena, Dionisio Alcalá Galiano and Francisco Alcedo and Bustamante. Vice Admiral Federico Gravina and Napoli would die months later because of the wounds suffered in this battle), 1383 wounded and about 2500 prisoners, of the total of 12,000 Spaniards who intervened in the battle. France lost twelve of its eighteen ships, with 2218 dead, 1155 wounded and about 500 prisoners captured by the British. Only a third of the 15,000 French participants in the battle returned to France one day. The United Kingdom suffered 449 deaths in Trafalgar (among which, in addition to Nelson, were thirteen of its better officers) and 1241 wounded.

link

More photos here: link

Steve20 Oct 2017 10:52 a.m. PST

Fantastic work as always. The cannonball shots going into the water are a nice touch.

Big Red Supporting Member of TMP20 Oct 2017 11:40 a.m. PST

Absolutely beautiful! Do you game with these models?

JimDuncanUK20 Oct 2017 11:48 a.m. PST

I can't believe that such detailed models obviously constructed with great patience and skill can still have the Union Jack and the White Ensign poorly presented, otherwise these are fantastic models.

Personal logo deadhead Supporting Member of TMP20 Oct 2017 1:21 p.m. PST

I am sure he is doing what we call a "wind up" in the UK…surely.

The last time I made a ship from this era was an Airix plastic effort, in a much larger scale, and I was 45 years younger (and 6 lbs lighter). The end result was not to this standard. The model I mean, not me.

Modelling the sea is not easy. I have pictures of my many Landing craft and of the Hornet launching the Doolittle raid…but nothing would prompt me to…..

And yet, it sounds like Jim D is serious. If so, no harm, tell us what simple ground plodding modellers are missing in Naval flags. I am sure no-one will be offended and will learn. The UK national emblem history is incredibly complicated.

JimDuncanUK20 Oct 2017 1:44 p.m. PST

Look at the Union Jack on the foremast of the model Victory.

Look at the red cross parts.

They look like 8 red lines running from a central point.

Easy to paint. It is inaccurate.

This however is a proper Union Jack.

picture

Look at the red cross parts.

The horizontal and vertical red parts are wider than the red diagonal parts.

The diagonal parts do not meet the other red parts in the centre. They have a narrow white border in between.

On top of that each diagonal red part is offcentre on its equivalent white diagonal part.

This is because each diagonal is made up from a red diagonal and a white diagonal side by side and each have a narrow white border.

The red/white diagonals nearest the flagpole have white above red and the red/white diagonals away from the flagpole are red above white.

I think there is a better description on YouTube somewhere which I will try to find.

JimDuncanUK20 Oct 2017 2:02 p.m. PST

Best I can find is here.

Bear with the guy, he gets it a lot better than most folk.

YouTube link

jdpintex20 Oct 2017 3:08 p.m. PST

I thought the cross of st Andrew was added after 1805?

Personal logo deadhead Supporting Member of TMP20 Oct 2017 3:24 p.m. PST

Cor Blimey……says an Irishman.

First thing, is respect for even spotting that.

I looked over these pictures over and over (a subject totally out of my comfort zone) thinking what the heck is he on about? If I could paint lines as thin as this, in this scale, I would be one happy pixie.

But I reread and see what he means.

This is what I personally welcome on this forum. I have the idea that the St Andrew Cross was before the anniversary….but the comment is welcome.

Will anyone remember the "Immortal Memory"?

Think of the date

von Winterfeldt20 Oct 2017 9:57 p.m. PST

very very impressive

Personal logo Artilleryman Supporting Member of TMP21 Oct 2017 1:49 a.m. PST

JD, the original Union flag in the 1600s was the combined cross of Saint George for England with the cross of Saint Andrew for Scotland i.e like the current flag but without the red saltire. The current flag came into being in 1800 with the union of the British and Irish parliaments (i.e. direct rule from Westminster) when the red saltire cross of Saint Patrick was added.

ModelJShip21 Oct 2017 2:24 a.m. PST

Thanks for the comments and constructive criticism. Always have to improve!

Best regards,
Julián

ModelJShip21 Oct 2017 2:37 a.m. PST

Big Red: "Absolutely beautiful! Do you game with these models?"

No, theese are for my presonal collection.

KniazSuvorov21 Oct 2017 4:16 a.m. PST

I like it. It looks really good. The difficulty with trying to model something realistically is that there are inevitably inaccuracies.

Your ability to take criticism positively is as noteworthy as your modeling skills, Julián. Keep up the great work!

Personal logo deadhead Supporting Member of TMP21 Oct 2017 4:36 a.m. PST

and remember the date today

Supercilius Maximus21 Oct 2017 5:32 a.m. PST

To the Immortal Memory.

whitejamest21 Oct 2017 6:40 a.m. PST

Very beautiful Julian, a joy to see. You should do the whole Trafalgar fleets :)

ModelJShip21 Oct 2017 6:43 a.m. PST

I am preparing the frenchs ship Redoutable ;) Little by little, they are expensive and cost quite to make them.

StarCruiser21 Oct 2017 7:38 a.m. PST

And the older ones are worth every penny (or pence) while that little line of new releases…not so much…

archiduque21 Oct 2017 7:38 a.m. PST

Fantastic work!

JimDuncanUK21 Oct 2017 11:04 a.m. PST

A credit to all who have commented on this series of posts and replies. The general demeanour has stayed well away from acrimonious which sometimes pops up elsewhere.

Keep it up.

Old Wolfman21 Oct 2017 11:05 a.m. PST

(Humming "Hearts of Oak")

18th Century Guy Supporting Member of TMP21 Oct 2017 6:36 p.m. PST

I use his ships to game with and they look fantastic on the table.

ModelJShip23 Oct 2017 12:16 a.m. PST

Sorry but the link is down. The page of Sail of Glory is being updated and within two days you can not see anything.

Thank you for all comments!
18th Century Guy. Thank you! I glad you enjoy with my ships.

ModelJShip25 Oct 2017 12:24 a.m. PST

The link is up again! :)

devsdoc25 Oct 2017 1:27 p.m. PST

Julian,
Your flag is fine for the battle of Trafalgar!
The "Union Flag" is only called the "Union Jack" when it fly's from the "Jack". This is a flag-pole set up on the end of the Bowsprit when the ship was in port. So unless it is on the "Jack" it is the "Union Flag".
Julian is the British ship Damaged? I think I see damaged rigging on her!
Be safe
Rory

ModelJShip26 Oct 2017 1:46 a.m. PST

The colors are correct but what JimDuncanUK refers to is how they are applied. I should have left a white line superimposed on the oblique red bands (a detail that on that scale is almost invaluable, but our colleague Jim has found).
Regarding the rigging of the HMS Victory. Yes, I made some broken strings. If I want to change them in the future, it's easy.

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