"Cavalry of the United Provinces army of the Netherlands..." Topic

Cavalry of the United Provinces army of the Netherlands at Fontenoy

Can you help me ?

Because I search for documentation on the organization and number of men in the Dutch cavalry regiment at Fontenoy, According to whether there were 28 or 46 Dutch squadrons present …

Thank you

I cannot remember where I got these numbers but this is what I have for what it is worth:
-21 Infantry battalions with an average strength of 637 making 13,377
-40 squadrons averaging 186 making a total of 7440
With the artillery added you get a total of 21,137 so larger actually than the British contingent. As to cavalry regiments I have this list but unfortunately ir adds up to 45 squ so something is wrong:

Garde Dragoons (l0)
Sandonville Cavalry Regiment (3)
Hop Cavalry Regiment (3)
Carabiniers Cavalry Regiment (3)
Rechteren Cavalry Regiment (3)
Linden Cavalry Regiment (3)
Schaeck Cavalry Regiment (3)
Hessen-Homberg Cavalry Regiment (2)
Nassau-Overkirk Cavalry Regiment (3)
Massen Dragoon Regiment (5)
Schlippenbach Dragoon Regiment (7)

Thank you it's a good start …

You should also read this very interesting site:

obscurebattles.blogspot.fr/2017

The numbers I have for the Dutch contingent at Fontenoy is 27 battalions and 40 squadrons.

Taking the cavalry list there are a couple of probable errors remedying which will get us closer to the right numbers.

The Garde Dragonders are much too strong. They began the war with 4 Squadrons of 8 companies. In the winter of 1742-43 they along with several other regiments were strengthened- with another squadron of two companies added. They are shown at 5 Sqn strength on a contemp document of the 1744 Flanders campaign which I have a copy of. I have never heard of the regiment being doubled in size after this and suspect that it is an error which has crept in somewhere- maybe someone confusing the number of companies with squadrons??

Likewise the Schlippenbach Dragonders appear too strong- they too were augmented to 5 squadrons from 4 in 1742-43. I've never heard of them acquiring a 6th and 7th squadron.

That would reduce the total to 38 Squadrons, but would mean the named regiments are the right size. I need to go over my reference material again but I think there might be another regiment of Horse present. I can't think of the name but most of these were 3 squadrons after 1743 but on occasion detached one to a garrison- which would make the magic number of 40…..

Re the unit names- there are a few small errors in the list above.

'Sandonville' (another minor error in the 1980s Courier article which has been perpetuated by more recent authors) is actually the Regiment belonging to Isaaq le Sans de Sandouville – one of the many officers of Huguenot ancestry in the Dutch army of the period.

There was no 'Massen' Dragoon regiment- this is actualy the Dragoon unit belonging to Gerlach Cornelis van Massou.

The 'Nassau-Overkirk' cavalry should properly be titled either 'Oranje-Nassau' or (I think from sometime about 1745) 'Nassau-Oranje-Friesland'. For interest this had the status of a semi-guard unit and was sometime unofficially referred to as the 'Gardes Friesland'. Its Colonel was the Prince of Oranje-Nassau- who became Stadholder of the United Provinces in 1747. Lots of similar names for the same unit!

The numbers I have for the Dutch contingent at Fontenoy is 13 945 infantrymen in 26 battalions or 21 battalions,3 604 cavalrymen in 28 squadrons or 46 squadrons with six guns of six lb, twenty-four guns of three lb and four howitzers of ? inches…

But in the book of Charles S.Grant – Wargaming in History – Volume 2 – they have:

- 17550 infantrymen in 27 battalions
– 6000 cavalry in 40 squadrons
– 26 cannons and 6 howitzers

And the van Dorth Grenadier Battalion is the Marinier van Dorth Battalion???

hello

«Massen» Dragoons, it was not «van Massou» Dragoons either but actually MASSAU as someone rectified us in an other forum

it appears that this Regiment is often to not say usually mispelling Nassau in many books and so, also ORBATS around the web and around the world, so be careful

the Regiment was taken prisoner of war with the surrender of the garrison of Brussels early 1746 and sent to central France until the peace with the Carabiniers if were are talking about the right corps

below page shared by Marc Geerdink-Schaftenaar author For Orange and the States The Army of the Dutch Republic 1713-1772 at Helion showing an Army list for 1749

two pieces from the Archives I found with the names of two «Dragons de Massau» 1746-1748, one was a 39-years old regimental musician coming from Bohemia

Bravo and congratulations!

This is the Dragoon Colonel:

link

There were thus several different spellings of his (and therefore the Regiment's) name in the era, which of course was very common until the mid-c19th. Hard to day which one is 'correct'. Also Van Dorth/Van Dort; Hop/Hoop; Van Linden/Van Lijnden/Van Lynden; Trips von Berg, Trips van Bergh, etc etc. English Sowl/Sowle, Piers/Peers, Handaside, Handasyde, Handyside; Husk, Husske, Huske. I could go on- but you see what I mean.

So I think you are OK with Massau, Massou, Massow as you see fit.

Bravo and thank you Seneffe and for the artillery of the United Provinces army of the Netherlands,no opinion?
TMP link