"HC or W&C? How do they play? Differences?" Topic

I was interested in a discussion on how these two systems play, and what are the differences between them. I have a passing familiarity with both of them, but am by no means a proponent of either.

My understanding is that HC has more of a fog of war aspect, and W&C has more direct control.

Two criticisms of HC I have heard are the lack of tight control (i.e. the c&c aspect) and the tendency for units to either be destroyed or set to rout quite easily.

I have not heard a negative thing about W&C, except maybe that it is not popular enough, or the lack of a PDF.

So, I would like some insight from others who may have played both. Thank you.

What is W&C?

It's War & Conquest, the game by Rob Broom, the main guy responsible for WAB. It's the successor to WAB.

Thanks, have not heard of W&C.

In my area 'To the Strongest' is very popular as is Hail Caesar.

Assuming HC is Hail Caesar – the two games are very different. War & Conquest is very similar to Warhammer Ancient Battles in the way it plays and mechanisms. It is a one-on-one game designed to be played in the same fashion as WAB (and most wargames). It plays well as a straight-forward one-on-one game on what I would consider a standard sized table (say 6 to 8 feet long and 4 foot across). If you like/liked WAB you'll get on well with W&C.

Hail Caesar is designed to work as a multiplayer or club game with two or three players on each side. It has a diced movement system – similar to Warmaster Ancients – so you can never be certain whether you can achieve what you set out to do. It can be played one-on-one and many folks do, but it works better if you want to play bigger, communal games on larger tabletops.

In terms of mechanics and represention – W&C is a classic ground up approach and HC is a top down approach. W&C has a more traditional sequence and game format – it suits players who enjoy tournament or tournament style play. HC on the other hand is probably better for scenario based games, multi-player and multi-sided games and more unusual deployments and objectives.

Units in HC are no more likely to be destroyed or set to rout than in – for example – WAB.

That's my take on it – having played both – it just comes down to what you enjoy about gaming and – more importantly – what your prospective opponents are playing.

Hope that's useful.

My prospective opponents are role-playing DBA.

@Rick Priestley

how does HC do with smaller army lists? i've heard it is designed for larger battles and maybe doesn't scale down very well.

Play 28mm Clash of Empires (COE) here in SoCalifornia. Others play the occasional HC game. Never seen W&C in play but I am aware of the rules. We found HC has the same elite unit, fighting leaders, and units configured to player "cheese" aspect taken from its WAB background, which is why my group shifted to COE.

HC is units based, you'll want 8 to 12 for a good game. The size of the units is up to you – it could be a handful of figures or 32+ per base. The units just need a common frontage on both sides.

The HC army lists are more guidelines than strict rules. The points system is simple and more about putting large armies on the table than trying to stop min/max.

@Ran The Cid

Thanks. What I was looking for was how many units, and you answered it nicely. I'm looking for a game that will play as well with 6 units as it will with 15. And I'm not looking for a game that solely caters to huge armies.

Do you think HC can do that?

Thanks. What I was looking for was how many units, and you answered it nicely. I'm looking for a game that will play as well with 6 units as it will with 15. And I'm not looking for a game that solely caters to huge armies.

Do you think HC can do that?

Yes.

I have not played HC. I do enjoy W&C and agree that it is very much like WAB.

The W&C army lists are available free online. They are for the most part just that, army lists, not as rich in background and detail as the WAB books were. W&C does include points costs which can be used to design your own army lists from the ground up if that is something you enjoy.

I would recommend Hail Caesar Rules. Hope it helps.

As always, comments are appreciated.

Take care

Andy