"Rhine Confederation Ratings - Empire III" Topic

I was browsing through the appendices in the back of the Empire III rule book and I couldn't find any ratings for Rhine Confederation troops.

Can someone point me in the right direction please?

I no longer have the Empire III book. In Empire V, they are listed by individual state (not generic Rhine Confederation).

Can I help you with a particular state?

I've got infantry, cavalry, and artillery for all of them if you don't mind.

Thanks Lou!

I don't know if you can PM me since I never restored my supporting membership. If you can, please PM your email address. Or post here if you wish.

Can't PM you if you are not a supporting member.

I encourage you to post it here because that way when others are looking for the same info this will come up in their search.

Thanks

My gaming crew cut their teeth on Empire II, and never really took to EIII. I have the info from the Empire II book. It's one exit short of your desired turnoff, but it might be of some use. Interested?

I recently let my Supporting lapse. I had planned to sell stuff but never got around to it. I'll post here if desired. It's kind of a lot, so may take several passes to complete.

Regards

I would appreciate it.
I'm guessing many of them are the same or close to each other?
Thanks!

Empire II unit ratings are made up of 3 principle data points, plus special capabilities info. In the interest of getting as close to an apples to apples comparison it seemed advisable to send some listings for units for which you probably have Empire III info.

Infantry ratings are made up of (1/2/3)
1. Number of figures per battalion
2. Number of fire factors for the Bn at full strength
3. Battalion morale grade.

Ordinary French Line 1808-1812: 12/12/5
Austrian Line 1812: 12/12/4
Russian Infantry 1812-1815: 8/6/5
Prussian Musketeer 1812: 12/12/4
British Line 1810-1814: 9/20/6

With that now established:

Bavarian Infantry
Landwehr: 12/8/3
Line: 12/10/4
Lights: 12/12/5 (©,+)
Converged Lights: 12/12/6 (©,+,R)
Jagers: 12/12/5 (©,+)
Grenadiers: 12/12/7

© denotes a unit which gets a +2 modifier in firing
+ denotes a unit which can "semi skirmish"
R denotes a unit armed with rifles.

More to follow.

k

Cavalry units also have 3 principle data points.

1. Number of figures in the Regiment.
2. Cavalry Grade
L – light
LL – Light Lancer
M – Medium
H – Heavy
3. Morale Grade

Bavarian Cavalry
Chevauleger: 8/L/6 (*)
Hussars: 8/L/7 (*)
Dragoons: 6/M/6
Guard duty Corps: 6/H/8

* denotes a unit able to fully skirmish.

Artillery ratings are always just a rating for morale. You have to do the research for the numbers and types of ordnance for each army.

Bavarian Artillery: (-/-/5)

More to follow

Westphalia

Infantry
Line: 12/10/5
Lights: 12/12/5 (©,+)
Converged Elites 12/12/6 (©,+)
Guard: 12/14/7 (+)

Cavalry
Chevauleger: 8/L/6 (*)
Hussars: 8/L/8 (*)
Cuirassiers: 8/H/8
Guard Chevauleger: 8/L/8 (*)

Artillery: -/-/5

Kleve-Berg
Infantry
Line: 12/10/4
Voltigeurs: 12/12/5 (©,+)
Converged Elites: 12/12/6 (©,+)
Grenadiers: 12/10/6

Cavalry
Chevauleger: 8/L/6 (*)
Lancers: 12/LL/8 (*)

Artillery: -/-/5

Hesse-Darmstadt
Infantry
Reserves: 8/6/3
Musketeers: 12/12/6
Fusiliers: 12/14/6 (©,+)

Cavalry
Chevauleger: 6/L/6 (*)

Artillery: -/-/6

More to follow.

Anything on the specific Rhine Confederation Regiments (small Saxon Duchies, Wurzburg, Frankfurt, Oldenburg, etc)?

The EII info didn't plumb that far down the food chain. The remaining info is for:

Baden
Wurttemburg
Saxony
Brunswick

And, although not really CotR members, the list includes data on:

Poland/Warsaw
Denmark
Holland
N. Italy/Venice
Naples
Sweden, and Turkey

I planned to post info on the first 4, then ask if you wanted info on the others. Since none of this is responsive to your inquiry re the lesser states, shall I refrain?

I did side research on a fair few of the "lesser" CotR states, but it's nothing you couldn't replicate with some digging. And what I came up with, with some guidance from our local guru/GM, is hardly what could be called canon.

It's a long shot, but I once tracked Scotty Bowden down with a question about late war (1813-1814) Berg cavalry. He was very accommodating. It might be worth a try.

Also, if I remember right, Bowden has a book on the war in 1813 that has a good but of info on unit rankings. If it sounds useful, I could dig up the citation.

Bowden is the fountainhead of Empire. Whatever he provides must be taken as canon.

Please to advise what you want.

k

You can stop.

Looking specifically for the actual Rhine Confederation regiment info.

I was hoping there was an amendment or something that was issued after this was missed in the rules.

Thanks for your help!

Can anyone who owns Empire V tell me if this information is in that edition please?

I think we may be dealing with a slight definition problem. All of the units in the forces raised by the Confederation of the Rhine states from Anhalt to Wurzburg constituted CotR regiments. I think what you're after is a specialized subset of that, made up of a bunch of minor state units, that formed the Rhinbund Division. It was sort of the "et. al." of the CotR.

I've never seen a definitive OOB for the Rhinbund. Sometimes Frankfurt is the 8th Regiment. Sometimes the 4th. I think you'll do better to sort out what each if the minor states was obliged to raise and form a division of 16 Bns out of that. Nafziger's books on the various CotR states is pretty definitive.

One thing I can offer from Empire II is the Nassau organization. They were listed under the Brits because of their being with them at Waterloo.

Nassau line 16/16/5
And although it isn't listed as such, I think these guys can skirmish.

I hope this proves helpful.

k

This isn't authoritative,but it's what I came up with when I dug into the subject years ago.

1st Rhinbund Rgt:
2nd Nassau Rgt. 3Bns, each 16/18/6 *

2nd Rhinbund Rgt:
1st Nassau Rgt. 3Bns, each 16/18/6 *

3rd Rhinbund Rgt:
The Frankfurt Rgt. 3Bns, each 12/12/5

4th Rhinbund Rgt:
The Saxon Ducal Houses
(Saxe-Coburg SC)
(Saxe-Gotha-Altenburg SGA)
(Saxe-Hildburghausen SH)
(Saxe-Meiningen SM)
(Saxe-Weimar SW)
1st Line Bn (SC, SGA). 12/12/5
2nd Line Bn (SC, SGA, SM) 12/12/5
Light/Fusilier Bn (SH, SW) 12/14/6 +

5th Rhinbund Rgt:
Anhalt Bn. 12/12/5
Lippe Bn. 12/12/5

6th Rhinbund Rgt:
Schwarzburg Bn. 12/12/5
Reuss Coys. 6/6/5
Waldeck Coys. 6/6/5

7th Rhinbund Rgt:
Mecklenburg Line Rgt. 2Bns each 12/12/5
Mecklenburg Fusilier Bn. 12/14/6 +

8th Rhinbund Rgt:
Wurzburg Rgt. 4Bns each 12/12/5

Of course, these states also generated cavalry and artillery units, as well as some Sappers and pontooneers, but the notion of a Rhinbund "Division" is illusory. These regiments were deployed piecemeal as garrisons or guard troops in small detachments. Some saw hard fighting, especially in Spain. One composite unit was made of companies of several regiments and was called Der Fursten Battalion, The Prince's Bn.

Again, you should think of this as no more than a serviceable B+ try at the question.

Oh, BTW, Oldenburg was only in the CotR from 1808 to 1810, when it was mediatized/absorbed into metropolitan France. It fielded 2 Bns each 12/12/5. The troops were made part of the French army.

Infantry:
All are standard French model 6 company battalions except Nassau with 8.
Nassau and Wurzburg are veteran with crack elite companies.
Mecklemberg conscript with veteran elite cos
Based on this I'd tend to put the rest as conscripts with veteran elite cos.

For cavalry:
Mecklemburg – chasseurs: crack, 16L, non battle, 6-8 castings
– hussars: elite, 18L, battle, 6-8 castings
Wurzburg dragoons: crack, 18L, non battle, 4 castings
Nassau chevaulegers: veteran, 14L, non battle, 4 castings
Don't think there were any from Saxon duchies, Anhalt, Lippe, et al.

Artillery:
Mecklemburg foot – conscripts, 6 pounders & 5.5" howitzers, 8 guns
None of the others are listed and I've not heard that they had artillrty.

Nassau and Wurzburg are veteran with crack elite companies.
Mecklemberg conscript with veteran elite cos
Based on this I'd tend to put the rest as conscripts with veteran elite cos.

Gentlemen – that is exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for coming through!

I found this helpful as well. Just getting back into it after about 20 years.