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"Russian Field Marshal Shabraque Color 1798-1800" Topic


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Terry3703 Aug 2017 1:56 p.m. PST

I am working on a Russian army of the 1798 period and am not sure what color the shabraque should be for a Russian Field Marshal. I am guessing either dark green or red, with either edged gold. But which would be correct.

I've found lots of info for 1812, but not for the time period I'm looking for.

Thanks for any help, and if possible references.

Terry

mollinary03 Aug 2017 2:15 p.m. PST

Well, a quick google shows a painting by someone called Stasulevic showing a wounded Suvorov being rescued at the Bsttle of Kinburn by a Grenadier. His horse seems to have a dark Green shabraque and pistol holsters, edged in white/silver.

Mollinary

Le Breton03 Aug 2017 7:34 p.m. PST

Here is the group of officers with the rank of Генерал-фельдмаршал (General-Fieldmarshal) alive in the years 1798-1800, by date of appointment to that rank. You will notice that the youngest was 60+ years old and that their posts involved rather little travel on horseback except maybe for Suvarov.

19 ноября 1794 князь Александр Васильевич Суворов (17291800), генералиссимус (1799) Suvorov
8 ноября 1796 светлейший князь Николай Иванович Салтыков (17361816) president of the "Military Collgium"" (similar to War Minister)
8 ноября 1796 князь Николай Васильевич Репнин (17341801) on diplomatic missions in Berlin and Vienna
15 декабря 1796 граф Иван Петрович Салтыков (17301805) general governor of Moscow, a civilian position with a civil uniform
5 апреля 1797 граф Иван Карпович Эльмпт (17251802) in retirement
5 апреля 1797 граф Валентин Платонович Мусин-Пушкин (17351804) without assignment (had been shef of the Chevalier Guards before their disbanding in 1797)
5 апреля 1797 граф Михаил Федотович Каменский (17381809) dismissed the service, without right to wear his uniform, at his estates

In general, officers of the Military Collegium, those without military assignment, and retired non-cavalry officers wore the standard infantry uniform for their rank. Saddleclothes would be dark green with a gold galloon, unless affiliated with a regiment with white/silver metalwork – not applicable to the listed officers.

Sidenote : Kinburn was in 1787. Suvarov was then a генерал-аншеф (general-in-chief), one rank below general-fieldmarshal. The painting was posted by someone named "Stasulevic". Actually it was painted in 1855 by Constantin Keppen (Kharkiv 1793 Tblisi 1864).

picture

Terry3703 Aug 2017 7:38 p.m. PST

Thanks Mollinary. I have looked at that one, but I also am not sure Suvorov was a field marshal at the time that painting depicts. I have also looked at several others on line, which show what seem to be generals/field marshals with red shabraques prior to 1812. Thus I am hoping there is something finite that will tell us.

Terry

Terry3704 Aug 2017 6:52 a.m. PST

Le Breton, I am just seeing your excellent post too. Obviously you are very knowledgeable of the Russian army. Do you have the knowledge or a suggestion for the color of the shabraque?

Terry

Le Breton04 Aug 2017 8:39 a.m. PST

Thank you for your kind words. If I answer questions, I think I can post mine and call it "even".
:-)

I assume you mean for Suvarov, as the other general-fieldmarshalls were not in the field. I would go with dark green and simple gold galloon stripe. But really, he could have used anything at all that he wanted and no one would have said a word. He might have just used a simple folded blanket, as he was not prone to being "flashy".

Terry3704 Aug 2017 10:58 a.m. PST

My sincere thnaks again Le Breton! And yes, I know what you mean – if I'm going to ask questions I always try to help others when I can.

Thanks again, and green edged gold it will be.

Terry

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