Help support TMP

"" Am Freiceadan Dubh"" Topic

21 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.

Back to the 18th Century Discussion Message Board

999 hits since 18 Jun 2017
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP19 Jun 2017 9:31 p.m. PST

Hello everyone

What are the 25/30 mm figures that exist to play the 43rd foot from 1739 to 1745 ?



Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP20 Jun 2017 5:29 a.m. PST

Old Glory has Government Highlander's in its Jacobite range.

JimDuncanUK20 Jun 2017 10:35 a.m. PST

Have a word with Graham at Crann Tara.


Paskal Supporting Member of TMP20 Jun 2017 9:37 p.m. PST

Thank you

What I want to know too,It was when this regiment had a company of grenadiers?

In 1751, when it was no longer the 43rd?



Supercilius Maximus Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member20 Jun 2017 10:46 p.m. PST

Grenadier companies were introduced into the English and Scottish armies in the 1680s, and were well established by the time they merged to form the British Army in 1707. This corps would either have organised a grenadier company immediately on its formation at Winchester in 1741, or as soon afterwards as was practicable, once the appropriate men had been chosen.

Originally raised as Fowke's Regiment, it became the 54th when numbers were issued in 1747, and was re-numbered in 1751.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP21 Jun 2017 12:36 a.m. PST

From the title, he obviously means the Black Watch. At one time they were the 43rd.

JimDuncanUK21 Jun 2017 5:28 a.m. PST


Originally titled Crawford's Highlanders or The Highland Regiment and numbered 43rd in the line, in 1748, on the disbanding of Oglethorpe's Regiment of Foot, they were renumbered 42nd and in 1751 formally titled the 42nd (Highland) Regiment of Foot.

Supercilius Maximus Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member21 Jun 2017 7:22 a.m. PST

It's certainly obvious now you've pointed it out! ;^)

In that case, I would suspect that no grenadier company existed prior to 1739, when the ten independent companies were consolidated into the 43rd, later 42nd. Once the regimentation was formalised, they would have created one from the appropriate members of the regiment.

Extrabio1947 Supporting Member of TMP21 Jun 2017 3:49 p.m. PST

Unfortunately, Crann Tara doesn't make goverment highlanders, only Jacobite clansmen. CT does make a wonderful range of regular government line infantry, including fusiliers.

Minden offers a lovely range of government highlanders though, and they are sculpted by the same individual who sculpted the CT miniatures.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP21 Jun 2017 9:54 p.m. PST

No factory offers the grenadiers of the 43rd for the WAS, only grenadiers for the 42nd for the SYW …

It is strange that nothing is found on the grenadiers of the 43rd …

Neither write of epoch, nor in illustrations of epoch, nor in figurines of our days …

Perhaps his grenadiers appeared only in 1751, why not?

It was a special regiment after all, it may not have been immediately a regiment of troops settled with grenadiers ect …

At first, maybe he had the same kind of status as the light troops (if he was considered so) of other nations?

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP23 Jun 2017 9:37 p.m. PST

It is necessary to buy grenadiers of highlanders of the SYW and to transform them … It remains to know the differences uniforms with those of the WAS for this regiment …

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP23 Jun 2017 11:00 p.m. PST

According to Stephen Manley, there were two regular regiments of Highlanders during the WAS, the 43rd (from 42nd in 1748) and 64th …

The two regiments of a single battalion of ten companies, on wich was grenadiers, and at full strength would have fielded about 750 men apiece.

The tartan is that of the government with in supplement a red stripe for the grenadiers.

Grenadiers had commencd by wearing miter caps, apparently of the usual type, though neither an example or a picture survives. By 1744 the fur cap had come into use.

Their caps were of black bearskin with the section of the front being red and white like the caps of the line.


Paskal Supporting Member of TMP28 Jun 2017 8:15 a.m. PST

It would be interesting to find an illustration of the miter of their grenadiers before they adopt the fur cap …

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP07 Sep 2017 2:19 a.m. PST

No illustrations of the miter of their grenadiers before they adopt the fur cap ?

spontoon07 Sep 2017 11:03 a.m. PST

Since you specify 25/30mm in height; I feel I can suggest two ranges. Minifigs; and RAFM's Flint and Feather range. Minifigs are true 25mm. RAFM's are a bit taller. I use both. RAFM's highlanders are sculpted by the talented Bob Murch. My only complaint with them is that the Grenadiers are not in the same position as the other company men.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP16 Sep 2017 10:51 p.m. PST

Anyway, I do highlanders with willie 30 mm as they get married well with my hordes of ex-Jackdaw ranges figures …

It remains to know the uniformological differences between the Highlanders from the 42nd to the beginning of the SYW and those of the 43rd at the beginning of the WAS …

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP20 Sep 2017 9:02 a.m. PST

The Highlanders from the ex-Jacdaw figures, are the best figures for the highlanders of the WAS!

42flanker21 Sep 2017 1:31 a.m. PST

I wasn't aware of evidence of fur-trimmed grenadier caps worn by the Highland Regiment as early as 1744. The first written evidence I know of comes from 1749 (A French report described in the regimental journal, The Red Hackle from 1932). It is assumed that the Morier painting of a grenadier of the 42nd comes from about the same time.

If fur-trimmed grenadier caps were worn by the Highland Regiment as early as 1744, that would have been barely five years after the commission was issued to form the Independent Companies of the Highland Watch into a Regiment of Foot.

The regiment did not muster until spring 1740 and remained in the Aberfeldy district for the next fifteen months while the men were drilled. If during that period one company was designated as a right flank, elite company, it seems records do not survive.

It may be that the short period between 1740 and 1744 explains why evidence for cloth grenadier caps has not survived.

Alternatively, it is possible that initially grenadiers wore the blue bonnet and that when the company was later issued with grenadier caps, they were fur-trimmed from the start.

The Earl of Crawford the first Colonel moved on very quickly. The second, Lord Sempill, was notoriously stingy and may have grudged the expense of grenadier caps. The third, Lord Murray, who had been requesting the Colonelcy for some time, was appointed in June 1745 and remained a loyal advocate of the Regiment for the next forty years.

In the absence of more firm evidence, it is possible that Lord Murray was the man responsible for providing the fur- trimmed caps adopted by the grenadiers of the 42nd and it may be they were the first caps provided for the regiment.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP21 Sep 2017 7:07 a.m. PST

Originally titled Crawford's Highlanders or The Highland Regiment and numbered 43rd in the line, in 1748, upon the dissolution of the Oglethorpe Foot Regiment, it was renumbered in 42nd and in 1751 formally titled the 42nd (Highland) Regiment of Foot.

I can not imagine the grenadiers of this regiment with miters …

42flanker21 Sep 2017 7:58 a.m. PST

Don't try. You won't be able to un-see it!

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP22 Sep 2017 7:16 a.m. PST

Well, yes, since they have never owned one.

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.