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"Landsknecht Pike Additions " Topic


13 Posts

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691 hits since 14 May 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Tango01 Supporting Member of TMP15 May 2017 8:47 p.m. PST

Great job!

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Main page
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Amicalement
Armand

Puster Supporting Member of TMP15 May 2017 9:38 p.m. PST

Wonderfull vignette. Perfect.

I just would have avoided the crossbows. Pillars on an imperial flag are also new to me. Karl was Emperor of the HRE and Spanish king, but the double headed Imperial eagle and the Spanish pillars afaik never mixed. I am almost sorry to be bothered by these spoilers in this wonderful piece of art…

Costanzo116 May 2017 8:00 a.m. PST

Superb pieces and base!

rick32 Supporting Member of TMP16 May 2017 8:40 a.m. PST

Puster,

It's a captured flag that they are taunting the enemy with. Come and take it.

Or at least that's what I would say if it were mine…

Superb!

Tango01 Supporting Member of TMP16 May 2017 9:55 a.m. PST

Happy you like it boys!. (smile)


Amicalement
Armand

olicana16 May 2017 12:47 p.m. PST

I've also got a version of that flag. Was it published in WI?

I think that's where I got mine, then I over-painted it as per usual.

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Curt C Inactive Member17 May 2017 6:35 p.m. PST

Thanks for the kind comments folks, much appreciated.

@Puster: Actually, the flag in question is from Pete's Flags and is identified as a Landsknecht banner. It is also listed in Gerry Embleton's illustration 'Landsknecht Standards'.

If all else fails I will follow rick32's sage reasoning… ;)

archiduque19 May 2017 6:22 a.m. PST

Excellent paintwork!!

Puster Supporting Member of TMP19 May 2017 6:38 a.m. PST

I would paint over the pillars.

A capture is highly unlikely. Landsknechts and Spaniards usually fought together, with only Ravenna standing out when a large contingent on loan from Maximilian fought for the French. As the "pillars" however where only introduced into the spanish arms by Charles the pillars would not be on their arms in 1512. Spanish and Imperial insignia are simply not ion the same banner.

Not that it will bother anybody but me, but given the care and quality of these miniatures this small extra effort would probably be worth it.

BTW: On a similar note I have never seen the motto "Noch Weiter", "Plus Ultra" on a Landsknechts flag. As this was Charles personal motto, however, not part of the Spanish arms, it would imho not be out of place on an Imperial banner.

Puster Supporting Member of TMP19 May 2017 6:50 a.m. PST

Fast research: The flag comes (came) from Pro Gloria. No idea wether its still on sale, as Pro Glorias miniature range was taken over by Warlord Games.

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Curt C Inactive Member19 May 2017 10:34 a.m. PST

@Puster: That's correct, the flag actually came from War Flag, who I believe also made it for Pro Gloria. Peter over at Pete's Flags also produces the same banner for his Landsknecht range.

As Charles V (aka Karl) was both Spanish king and Holy Roman Emperor (with landsknechts in his service well past 1519) I see no issue with the flag and will happily NOT paint over it. :)

PS: Noch Weiter / Plus Ultra (trans: 'Further Beyond') did indeed begin as Charles' personal motto, but became that of Spain and is still in use today. It was also part of the heraldry for the Holy Roman Empire, along with the pillars.

Puster Supporting Member of TMP20 May 2017 5:11 a.m. PST

What we do have of this era is plenty of contemporary depictions – one of the first information wars of history :-)

What I have not seen yet is the pillar symbol with any Imperial instituation, especially not with Landsknechts. There was a pretty sharp distinction between the Spanish crown and the Imperial domain – just as with the Spanish and Imperial units, unified mainly via the person of Karl (who more or less threw his Burgundian heritage into the Spanish pot).

From my own research the only arms I found that combines the Imperial eagle and the pillars is Karls personal arms of 1530, created upon his coronation to Emperor by the Pope (though that has not a plain eagle), which is still used by the town of Villaviciosa for some connection with Karl that eludes me.

I would be bothered by this for my minis – perhaps as with my Canadian units for WW2 Normandy sporting their Flags with added "Stars and Stripes". Actually more so, as Landsknechts and Spaniards – while the often fought together, from Cerignola over La Motta, Bicocca, Pavia, Rome, Naples, Vienna up to Tunis and Mühlberg, they also were in competition and deadly incidents between them were not uncommon.

Anyway, apart from these nice forums where nerds like us gather to discuss irrelvant facts of life I would never comment upon this during a game… and I wish my own attempts at painting would come anywhere near these, regardless of the sported flag.

Retiarius902 Jun 2017 4:05 p.m. PST

stunning !!!!!!

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