Help support TMP


"Modern Dogfight using Lacquered Coffins (Modified)" Topic


14 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the Cold War (1946-1989) Message Board

Back to the Solo Wargamers Message Board

Back to the Modern Aviation Discussion (1946-2006) Message Board

Back to the Modern Battle Reports Message Board



548 hits since 20 Apr 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Just Jack Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 7:05 a.m. PST

All,

Okay, standby for something a little bit different, something I've been meaning to get to for quite some time, and something we're going to have to step back in time for. Here's the deal: my intent for this massive Imagi-Nation-type alternate history was always to have a bunch of ground fights, but also some air to air fighting, and perhaps even some naval fighting. If you're reading this I'm sure you're aware of the eighty-four (84) battle reports for ground fights I've posted for Cuba Libre. Now it's time for some air fights.

I just bought a new set of air rules called "Lacquered Coffins," a set of WWII rules that (as always) I've modified a bit to suit my purposes in order to use for 'modern' aircraft (can you still call F-4s and MiG-21s modern?). My changes are thus:

-I play solo, so I need to mix it up. Rather than IGO-UGO, I'm using cards (one card per aircraft, with the aircraft tied to a particular card) for activation. So I do the mandatory move for every aircraft, then move to cards.

-I shortened the range for guns (6, Long Range 8), gave them 2D6.

-I made missiles minimum range 5, good out to 12, Long range 16, 4D6. I gave each aircraft four missiles. I know F-4s can carry more than four missiles, so if you like it better, think of it as four shots of two missiles ;) I also am not currently differentiating between IR and radar missiles, I'm just getting into some new rules and want some quick, fun games.

-I added deflection as modifiers, side and front quarter -2 (the game already has head-on and tail, which is assumed).

-I can't remember if this is in the book or not, but when a plane is going down I have the pilot make a test to bail out.

-I'm using a hexboard with 1/600 minis, so 1" in the rules equals one hex.

Everything else is as written.

This is an even up, 4 vs 4 matchup, which I plan to do a few times while I learn these new rules, before getting into various force sizes and initial deployments. All of these will be straight up fighter duels; perhaps someday I'll branch out into other stuff, but that's what interests me right now. I'm not sure how many fights I'll play out for the War of Liberation; I'm hoping for around ten, but it could be more (if I'm really enjoying myself) or less (if I run out of planes/pilots). Right now I'll be simply referring to these guys by callsign, i.e., Boxcar 01. As they prove themselves (by surviving!) I'll become more invested and begin to actually start naming them and getting into personalia.

picture

The board, north is up. I'm using a hexboard from the old game "Flight Leader" (you can actually see the name in the bottom right corner). CLA Air Force in the southwest (bottom left) corner, Castro Air Force in the northeast (top right). I'm using the relatively new set, "Lacquered Coffins," modified slightly. The airplanes are 1/600; the CLA flight consists of F-4 Phantoms from PicoArmor, the Castro flight consists of MiG-21s from Tumbling Dice.

picture

Hopefully it isn't too off-putting, but in an effort to make it more clear to readers, I'm now photo-shopping the pics and putting in identifiers (1-4) for the aircraft and brushing in trails to show maneuvers.

To see how the fight went, please check the blog at:
link

The fight was a lot of fun; it flows well, mixing things up with the cards for activation worked like a champ, and everything made sense. It took a bit longer than I'd like; yeah, that's always the case with new rules, but I gotta tell ya, I don't think that factored in a lot, as the mechanisms were very familiar. I think more of the time is spent with the maneuvering, then manipulating the dice for altitude, speed, and missiles, which is a little bit of a pain in the butt, but worth it. Let me know what you think of me doing the batreps with the blue and red trails and black numbers (I'm already writing the next fight up the same way).

Next fight up in this series is the second flight, Blackjack 01-04, on another vanilla fighter sweep, taking on four Castro-regime MiG-21s, though I should be posting batrep number five of Operation Rush Delivery first.

V/R,
Jack

Defender1 Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 7:49 a.m. PST

Jack you are living the dream of gaming all the time.

Allen57 Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 8:44 a.m. PST

Good looking game. I like your flight stands. Where did you get them?

Personal logo MiniPatton Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 10:40 a.m. PST

The flight stands look like Legos to me.

Personal logo Weasel Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 10:44 a.m. PST

Very cool, thanks for sharing!

M C MonkeyDew20 Apr 2017 11:45 a.m. PST

Nice one Just Jack! Now I miss my copy of Flight Leader : (

:)

Bob

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 11:53 a.m. PST

Looks like fun!

Love your use of the hex map, and the guy in the parachute.

Thanks for sharing your report and photos.

Just Jack Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 12:32 p.m. PST

Wow, thanks guys, I appreciate it! How come my ground batreps don't draw this much attention? ;)

And Ben's got it, the "flightstands" are just Legos, which I bought direct online so I could order just the parts I wanted.

V/R,
Jack

boggler20 Apr 2017 2:45 p.m. PST

Great stuff..as always!

:O)

Just Jack Supporting Member of TMP20 Apr 2017 7:27 p.m. PST

Thanks Jim!

V/R,
Jack

Joe Legan Supporting Member of TMP22 Apr 2017 6:07 a.m. PST

Jack,
Good to see you branching out! Now try SAGA! Have not heard of the rules? Have your tried Bag the Hun? For activation I swiped the system from the star wars game. Roll 2d6 with modifiers for skill/altitude. Then move from lowest to highest. then shoot from highest to lowest. Works great for solo.

Joe

Just Jack Supporting Member of TMP23 Apr 2017 7:57 p.m. PST

Hey buddy, thanks! Yeah, I played a fair few dogfights, but keep searching for the "perfect" rules. I've played quite a few Bag The Hun fights, and it's my usual standby, and Lacquered Coffins have a lot of similarities.

I tried a similar activation system to what you described, but it really bogged down for me as I ended up having to do a whole lot of paperwork to try and keep it straight. You know how us Marines are…

V/R,
Jack

Joe Legan Supporting Member of TMP24 Apr 2017 3:47 p.m. PST

Jack,

You are baiting me, no fair. If you do it correctly there is no paperwork. Write out 13 boxes on a scrap piece of paper ( oh the fun I could be having with this!)and label them 2-14. Get out 8 counters and label then GG 1 through 4 and BG 1-4. Everytime you roll up your good guy pilots and bad guy pilots put the appropriate marker in the appropriate box. You can count to 14 right? ( sorry almost made it!)

Joe

Just Jack Supporting Member of TMP25 Apr 2017 11:53 a.m. PST

Well, I'm sure I wasn't doing it correctly, but I also had about 20 aircraft on the board.

1. I got a white board and markers and wrote down each aircraft type, call sign, altitude, pilot skill, and status. I needed some sort of roster as the aircraft type, its altitude, pilot skill, and status (damaged or not) were all modifiers that played into the activation process.

2. Each turn I conducted a series of seemingly endless rolls to determine the order of activation. Each aircraft got a D6 roll +/- its modifiers, to determine its place in the order of activation. Invariably there were tons of ties using a D6; there were simple tie breakers (a fighter beats a bomber, a good fighter beats a damaged fighter), but lots of others required another roll. Making 20 separate D6 rolls, figuring out the modifiers, checking for and working out ties, took up quite a bit of my precious time. Even moving to a D10 didn't significantly alter the number of ties per turn that had to be figured out/re-rolled.

3. I would write the numbers for activation on the white board, then check it to make sure I'd gotten it correct. More time…

4. I would then activate the aircraft in order, lowest to highest, then shoot highest to lowest. This was kind of cool, and the mechanic worked better with a D6 for activation order as it kept things closer, which meant a Rookie actually had a slight chance to take on an Ace; using a D10 meant that was pretty much impossible, and thereby not very much fun.

In any case, I played a couple games then gave up on it as too much work. I generally use my pared down version of Bag the Hun, and now I'm getting into Lacquered Coffins, which has its similarities (activation is not one of them, however, though I'm using a very simplified version). What I'm still missing is that activation differentiation (not just firing and maneuvers) between different pilot classes. It's a tough one, and, for me, one that even Bag the Hun wasn't very satisfying.

V/R,
Jack

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.