"How many files of Musketeers were used in the TYW" Topic

Sorry about the clunky title. I'm hoping Daniel S is around as I'm prepared to bet he will be able to provide the answer with supporting evidence.

I recently read that Tilly preferred to have no more than 20 files of musketeers in each block of shot flanking the pike. The logic being that with more than 20 the outermost files would struggle to reach safety under the pikes in case of cavalry attack.

It makes sense to me but I can't find my source. Hence the question. BTW much as I would like Daniel's input everyone is free to chip in. :-)

It appears the TMP bug is alive and well…or that I have hit enter twice! Bill please delete one version of the OP.

I think it varied from the one you mention to 6 for the Swedes. The number varied according to which organizational scheme was chosen by the general.

6 would be the depth of the formation counting ranks from front to back of the body. I'm looking at the width of the body from flank to flank counting the files. There is a lot of information on formation depths and as Shagnasty says the depth did reduce to 6 or some times 5 ranks of shot. What I can't find is the source of my information stating that Tilly preferred less than 20 files wide.

As a re-enactor I am aware of the need to be able to quickly reach the shelter of the pike block. What I have not been able to find is any hard information on the maximum width of a body of shot. I have always felt that there must have been a practical limit to the number of files which could easily run to shelter when attacked by horse. Which is why I was interested in the information on the quote by Tilly.

As an aside I recently read in David Blackmores book "destructive and formidable" that it is thought that from the middle of the English civil war Musketeers were able to stand against cavalry charge in line and deal with the threat by sheer firepower. They were only at significant risk if the horse managed to turn their flanks or attack the rear of the formation.

Given that very little detailed tactical data on Tilly's army survives I have doubts about the quote mentioned, even more so given that inventing Tilly quotes and opinions seem to have been a sport for some authors.

Can't think of other commanders or writers mentioning 20 files as maximum. Swedes used 32 files in wing of musketeers in Swedish brigade while Basta battalion has 21 files.

As for musketeers being able to hold their ground in line from firepower alone from mid-ECW it does not match continental battle experience on open ground. Also if mid-17th C firepower was enough why then invent bayonet for late 17th C and 18th C armies? Firepower could halt cavalry attack but it was risky to rely on it alone as even a very small force of cavalry could do great damage to infantry. (For example 200 man cavalry squadron could wreck brigade of infantry 5-6 times it size)

Can't get at my copy of Blackmore at the moment but if you give me a couple of hours I will provide the examples provided in his book to support the idea.

Swedish battalion had, on paper, 192 musketeers in 6 ranks. So 32 is the number of files. They also had a reserve sleeve of shot that were often used as commanded shot to support the cavalry on the wings. I suppose, since the operated in brigades of 3-4 battalions it was easy enough for the shot to simply run to the center of the diamond while the pike gave the cavalry "the business".

The Imperialists and Spanish preferred larger and deeper formations. I would not be surprised that they would have fewer files. Generally they would have blocks of 1000-1500 men for a later tercio. Distribution of pike/shot would be about even. I presume the formation would be deeper than the dutch or Swedish system but could not tell you by how much. If you can figure that out, you could get your answer.

Dutch battalions were about 500 men strong with an even distribution of pike/shot. So at even say 252 shot at 9 ranks deep, we have a total of 28 files in 2 sleeves so each sleeve would be about 14 files.