Help support TMP

"5th Guards Armoured Brigade at Arnhem" Topic

5 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.

Back to the Getting Started with WWII Message Board

Back to the WWII Scenarios Message Board

Areas of Interest

World War Two on the Land

Featured Hobby News Article

1,353 hits since 10 Apr 2017
©1994-2020 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

alexjones11 Apr 2017 3:31 a.m. PST

I am struggling to find a decent reference which breaks down the make up of this formation during Operation Market Garden.

Preferably down to the lowest level (eg. cromwells or shermans).

(I have the oob from Osprey but it isn't at this level.)

Martin Rapier11 Apr 2017 4:52 a.m. PST

Guards Armoured Brigade was a standard Sherman equipped brigade, three armoured regiments with three sabre squadrons (Sherman 75s, and fireflies), a recce troop (Stuarts) and Regt HQ, plus a motorised infantry battalion (1st Bn, Grenadier Guards).

No Cromwells anywhere except the divisional armoured recce regiment (2nd Bn, Welsh Guards).

The Divison generally fought in late 1944 outside of the OOB with two square brigades, each with two groups of two paired tank and infantry battalions and supported by one of the field artillery regiments.

By this stage of the war, the mix of Shermans and Fireflies in the sabre squadrons was a bit variable, with some troops having two fireflies instead of just one. I can't remember if they'd reverted to five troops of three tanks by September or still had the old Normandy organisation of four troops of four. I suspect it was still troops of four, as Lord Carringtons troop crossed Nijmegen bridge with four tanks.

The regimental Recce troop had 11 Stuarts (two HQ and three sections of three).

alexjones11 Apr 2017 9:56 a.m. PST

Thanks Martin for such a comprehensive answer.

I think I will do a recce section of Stuarts first.

zoneofcontrol12 Apr 2017 11:15 a.m. PST

I remember this page from being on their site many times.

Fire & Fury: Battlefront WWII

PDF link

Thomas Thomas28 Apr 2017 8:37 a.m. PST

I think post Goodwood most (all?) Brit armored division went with the 1 tank battalion/1 Inf battalion battlegroup set up. Creating 4 battlegroups).

1 tank battalion would have come from the recce regt. (ie Cromwells). 1 of the Inf battalions would have been the halftrack borne "Motor Rifle" battalion (formerly broken up into companies to support the 3 tank battalions).

Pip Roberts (of the 11th) generally credited with this battle wise if organization busting set up. (Very similar to US Combat Commands such a good idea I named a game after it…)


Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.