"PAK 97/38 and the 8th Army" Topic

I bought some excellent Quality Cast PAK 97/38 from Old Glory15s. I am painting them up for my East Front Italians.

Does anyone know about their color scheme? I was going to paint them Panzer grey. But, did the Italians repaint or camo them with Italian Yellow? I do know I could whitewash them.

Thanks y'all

Dear KnightTemplarr,
as far as I know the Italian 8th Army in Russia used Italian ordnance and not "Beuteartillerie" from German stocks.
If the Pak 97/38 is used in Italian hands it should be in Italian "grigioverde" (a medium green like Humbrol 150).
Some can have a brushstroke whitewash.
Greetings.

Thanks Eugenio

I have seen a diary online that referenced Italian anti-tank crews using the pak97/38. Were all the Italian guns green in the CSIR and 8th Army?

The only real photo of vehicles is the famous L6 with Soviet Infantry with AT Rifle. It is tstaed as "dark yellow" with heavy coating of mud.

Thanks again

Dear KnightTemplarr,
the "grigioverde" was the official standard colour of the Italian Army.
From 1940 to end 1941 all the tank were factory painted in green. From 1942 onwards the factory paint was sand yellow with speckles in rust brown, green or dark earth.
Guns and trucks were green in Europe, sand yellow in Africa .
The CSIR Divisions came from Italy and from the Balkan front and all the photos I have in my books show trucks, guns and L3 tankettes in green. The same applied to the ARMIR (8th Italian Army) that included the CSIR and Infantry and Alpine Divisions from Italy.
The 55 L6 light tanks ,replacements of the L3 of the "San Giorgio" Group, were dispatched to Russia in july 1942.
The camouflage is the standard for 1942 (see above).
Therefore the description in Zaloga's book "Eastern front" pages 77 and 84 is correct.
Greetings.

Thanks again Eugenio

I have found very little info over here on the colors of CSIR and 8th Army weapons and vehicles. Do you know if they were ever mixed? If weapons prior to 1942 were repainted in the field or would you see both yellow and green weapons and vehicles?

If you want contact me off the boards at KnightTemplarr@Yahoo.Com.

You have been a great help!

Dear KnightTemplarr,
in Russia, Balkans and Greece all equipment was green.
Tanks and armoured cars were camouflaged from 1942, staff cars also were usually camouflaged.
Some repainting was done on trucks for the Divisions in Italy and South France.
A shot of trucks of the "Piave" Infantry Division after the battle of Rome against the Germans (September 8-10, 1943)show camouflaged FIAT 626 and SPA 38.
The guns were usually left in green and a photo of Italian artillery in action in Rome (September 9, 1943) show green guns.
In my opinion you should paint green weapons and vehicles (including L3 tankettes) for Russian front, camouflaged vehicles (with some in green) for Sicilian campaign and defence of Rome.
From 1944 the Fascist RSI (Repubblica Sociale Italiana) in North Italy camouflaged vehicles and weapons. (But I have photos of some tankettes in green!)
I researched on pak97/38 in Italian hands and I have a photo of a 97/38 used in Corsica against the Germans at Bastia probably of the "Friuli" Infantry Division.The shot is very poor but I believe the gun is painted green.
Greetings.