"British mixed uniforms, Peninsular War?" Topic

I recall years ago reading ? in Oman ? that some members of the British militia volunteered to join the forces in the Iberian Peninsula. I understand that all militia units had dark blue "Royal" facings. As the British typically used up existing equipment, might these men have arrived with dark blue facings, and been posted to regiments with yellow; buff; green; white; whatever facings?

With many British soldiers electing to use captured French back backs instead of the more uncomfortable "box" as issued, this offers a lot of options for us who do large battalions for the Peninsular War.

GdeP

GdeP,

I am not sure why you think that all Militia Regiments had blue facings. These were reserved for "Royal" regiments, so it seems unlikely.

There was a posting on TMP listing facings of over 70 Militia Regiments in the late 18th Century.

TMP link

You need to scroll down to the 17th post in the thread.

I doubt if many had changed, since most regular regiments kept the same facing colours for the Napoleonic Wars as they had during the previous century. Regiments like tradition, and would oppose change.

Still, your general point is correct, that Militia recruits may have had different uniforms to their new regular regiments. I have seen memoirs mentioning Militia with old Militia Badges on their back packs joining regular battalions.

Rod

I got that impression – blue facings for the militia – "in the last century" about the time I bought and read the Oman series from the History Book Club.

I wonder if the Belgic shako might have appeared in the Peninsula worn by militiamen, while regiments there still wore the stovepipe.

GdeP

Only if the Militia reg'ts. were due to get their new clothing allowance,and their shakos were due to be replaced anyway.

Not just badges, Rod. If the badges still show,the backpacks hadn't been painted black, and so were probably still in the militia regiment's facing color. All kinds of possibilities.

My standing query: can ANYONE describe the uniforms of the Percy Tenantry Volunteers? They keep showing up as a blank on the accounts of militia uniforms.

The only 'militia' regiment in my Peninsular Army is the Loamshire Volunteers :) They have blue facings.

link

AIUI the militia typically wore the facing colour of the local regiment, so green for west Norfolk, yellow for east Essex, and so forth. If they were distributed to units in Spain on that basis then they would have blended in. Incidentally the box backpack thing is a myth too if I understand it. The wooden frame came lter and in this period the back was shaped but had no frame.

Percy Tenantry Volunteers – Not a militia regiment – there were at least three tiers of non-regular units in the British army: Militia proper, Supplementary/Local Militia, Volunteers/Fencibles(and Yeomanry) – only the first two were properly one the establishments.
Also, at this stage in its development there was no such thing as local regiments. Regiments of the British Army were ordered to assume County titles in 1780 as an aid to recruitment but this idea never really took off with some of the regiments never even seeing the counties they were associated with let alone having a permanent presence there.
The facing colours were just dished out by region any connection with the 'county' regiment is coincidental.

I believe the troops who took the French pack liked the fact that there was no restraining strap across the chest. Very constricting on the march, impairing breathing.

As I recall, the 28th Foot took the French pack for their whole battalion after beating French cavalry attacking one face, and infantry attacking other. I can't remember who was in front, who in rear. I Egypt, earned them the unique "Back Number." Allegedly the continued to wear he conical shako at Waterloo, and their flank companies may still have had the French packs. I don't think they took the packs for comfort. More a way of establishing a unit identifier!

GdeP

Wherever the 28th got their French packs, I don't think it was at Alexandria in 1801- the action you are referring to to. The 28th were manning a salient redoubt and when, in a very fluid battle, a party of French dragoons appeared to their rear, they allegedly received the order,"28th, rear rank only, right about face!" and the intruders were seen off.

No reference to looted packs that I know. Possibly a bit early for the Peninsula?

It was on the return from Egypt that the Colonel presented each man of the Regiment with a 'Back Number' as an 'emblem of the double front.' The 28th didn't receive permission to wear this unauthorised ornament till well after the war.

(The originals were made of silver plate and mostly sold for drink.)

Hello 442flanker.

Back in the 1960's my buds and I were building small "armies" using Stadden and Willie 30mm figures of the Napoleonic Wars. I realized how stupid we would look with 2 battalions of 1814 Prussians; 2 of late war Russians; 2 of Austrians with double-billed shako; another of Hungarian grenadiers, 2 of Bavarians at ease with the pack off to one side, low on the back, etc. So I chose to convert, and used all of the above for Spanish and Portuguese. But we came across the story of the 28th at Alexandria, and claims that they took French packs when the French eventually capitulated. I set aside 40 of the Austrians with double-billed shako to convert to the 28th, and made 20 of them look like French packs. I filed the shako into the stovepipe, and put a piece of brass wire into the front top, adding "liquid steel" to make to small plume. I cut the straps off the non-British rounded canteen, but it passed from 3 feet away. Very animated unit advancing with muskets lowered or at high port. The Austrian figure had no side satchel, but we did not care, and had very serviceable British troops! I still have 20 more to do.

TMP link

I started this thread in 2012, and note the back pack comment from Haythornthwaite in his Waterloo book. Luckily, I made NO attempt at putting a back number onto the 28th!

GdeP

A fascinating thread. The first rule of British infantry knapsacks is that there are no rules….

Well, As I say I haven't come across stories of the 28th looting knapsacks from the French after the fight at Alexandria. I have to say, it seems to me remarkable that enough French knapsacks and enough veterans of Egypt had survived for them to be in evidence in the Peninsula, let alone at Waterloo- but what do I know?

By the way, I didn't mean to suggest that the 28th were not to be seen with 'Back numbers' on their caps in the years between 1805- when first reported- and 1815. The original silver badges were replaced with less marketable brass. They clearly were in evidence, as was reported in Belgium in March 1815-

"I recognised Picton's division standing at attention. In a few minutes the troops broke into subdivisions …. The old 28th followed, having their number both front and rear of their low caps, a memorial of Egypt."

MY 28th have only a bare stovepipe, for I could not figure how to paint their front plate. I understand is may have been blackened, or cut out, to show a brass scroll above and below, with a brass 28 between. I am only accurate when I CAN be, and just settle for toys that fit in!

I really enjoy getting new information that replaces the old news, for then my old units can become my Napoleonic Imaginations Army!

GdeP

By the way, the reference to the 'low caps' of the 28th suggests to me the later false-front model (Belgic/Waterloo, or what have you).

What is the basis for believing the 28th were still wearing what must have been some very battered early-model infantry caps in 1815?

I do not remember what the French link is called, illustrating all units of all countries present at Waterloo, but this looks like the style of those illustrations. Note the unique front brass pieces to the cylindrical shako. These would certainly have been replaced since Egypt. Perhaps other TMP'ers have better information about the 28th?

link

GdeP

It would seem odd to suggest that they might have been the only unit of the British army, well, infantry anyway, not to wear a waterproof cover over their headgear. makes it easier for modellers though…….

Garde de Paris: I believe this is the site you are thinking of:

centjours.mont-saint-jean.com

Dr J

Le shako. Le 28th (au moins les compagnies d'élite) au cours de la campagne de 1815 portait le shako d'ancien modèle, orné d'insignes particuliers au régiment : un lion surmontant les chiffres 28, entouré de deux banderoles ; celle du haut portait l'inscription "Barossa", celle du bas "Peninsula".

Le régiment aurait porté un "badge" particulier à l'arrière du shako, qui commémorait la belle attitude défensive du 28th à Alexandrie en 1801. Ce badge en forme de losange, qui n'est pas visible sur le dessin du capitaine Jones, était porté en 1815 d'après le témoignage d'un officier d'état-major (JSAHR, 1946, p 112). Le shako était orné d'un pompon rouge dans le bas, et blanc en haut, couleurs de la croix de Saint-Georges.

'Shako. During the 1815 campaign, the 28th (or the flank companies at least) wore the earlier model of shako, decorated with the specific badge of the regiment: a [crowned] lion above the numerals '28' placed between two scrolls; the upper one bearing the inscription "Barossa" and the lower, "Peninsula."

The regiment would also have worn a unique badge on the rear of the shako, which commemorated the courageous stand of the 28th at Alexandria in 1801. This badge, in the form of a lozenge, which is not visible in Captain Jones' drawing, was being worn in 1815 according to the account of a staff officer (JSAHR, 1946, p 112).

The shako was decorated with a tuft, white over a red base, the colours of the St George flag.'

Curiously, I have never seen in any English text or commentary, a correlation between the white over red 'regulation feather' of 1797/1800 and the St George's flag. Given that, originally, the regulation feather was briefly white, and between 1829 and 1844 was white again, this may be coincidental, but an interesting observation nonethelsss. Clearly, in 1797 the red, white, and blue of the Union flag would not do.

Thank you, Dr. Jeckyl, that is INDEED the site!

Here is their version of centre companies of the 28th. Does not show back packs.

link

GdeP