"An Errol Flynn type sea battle." Topic

This is kind of a cross post from the "Pirates" board since the bug wouldn't let me crosspost it last night (and the day before I gave up after 4 tries, it seems like when the sun goes down the bug comes out).

I normally game Napoleonic sea battles in 1/1200th scale with Langton Miniatures. I've been thinking though about doing some Errol Flynn "Captain Blood" or "Sea Hawk" style fights, 2-3 ships a side. I was planning on using Langton's "Anglo-Dutch Wars" lines for the ships but I am in need of rules. I don't think that my Napoleonic rules will do a good job, for starters I don't really have ship stats and also let's face it, the ships are different. So, what would be some good rules for a late 17th Century sea fight?

A few caveats;

I don't mind record keeping
I don't mind details
I'm looking more for accurate over "fast play"

Hmmm. "Accurate" Errol Flynn sea battle rules.

Check out the Sailpower rules, designed for 15mm vessels.

They also make 15mm scale vessels too, which are quite nice, and they're planning on doing the same vessels in 1/300th too, but the rollout of that range has been a bit slow.

I have a couple of Disney pirate ships in 15mm scale for sale, if you're interested in "The Black Pearl", and/or "Queen Anne's Revenge" (or just your generic, well armed man of war, armed merchant trader, etc.), and a Chinese Junk too.

Very reasonably priced compared to various resin models of their size, with very nice, engraved and raised, wood grain detailing.

See below for pics and the link:

TMP link

They're available for the price of a dinghy from some manufacturers.

jowady why not Langton's Anglo-Dutch rules, Tiller & Whipstaff fast play rules?

I always felt that Tiller & Whipstaff was a bit light on detail, kind of "half baked" (not quite fully developed), and needed a little extra work (esp. good rosters) to work well. It's a fun game for about 3-6 ships per player, but I would personally rather slow down the rate of damage quite a bit to make the pace of battle feel more accurate to the era and allow more maneuvers per game than the close to shooting distance.

I too am also totally confused about what you mean by "accurate" "Errol Flynn" style actions. Captain Blood and The Sea Hawk were set in the galleon period (late 16th C. and early 17th C.), and were typical Hollywood swashbuckling fluff, the complete opposite of "accurate".

If you really want to play accurate rules for 17th C., I suggest you begin by looking at this essay by War Artisan (which can be found on his web site summarizing AoS rules useful for 18th C. sea fights. The focus is on a slightly different era but the summary information will still help.

War Artisan's own game Captains Bold is not mentioned in this summary, and would be great for fluffier Errol Flynn style actions. It plays very quickly and is generic enough to use for any Age of Sail era. It's not highly detailed, but it's a fun way to do a lot of maneuvering in a short game. I've only played it with 2 ships, one per player, so I don't know how it would do with multiple ships.

- Ix

You might want to consider a larger scale if you're doing small actions. 17th C. ships were smaller on average than Napoleonic ships, and a lot of the Langton models are really small. Check out this blog for some graphic examples.

For the early 17th C. I prefer the 1/600 scale Skytrex Armada period models. They aren't great miniatures, but they paint up nicely and they're big enough to dress up. I add stern lanterns, extra decks, different stern gallery arrangements, move masts, add boats, etc. to make each one look unique.

- Ix

You might consider the PP 1/450th range of 17th century ships along with the pieces of eight rules(available as a pdf £5.00 GBP)?

martin

Consider Blood and Plunder. The kickstarter wrapped up this summer and they are on target to ship in December.

28mm, 17th century historical pirates.
The rules are designed to cover land based, ship based, and a combination of engagements.

When I said "accurate" I didn't express myself too well. If you look at the Errol Flynn movies it becomes pretty obvious that he isn't commanding a typical Pirate vessel, a sloop or a brig or anything small handy and fast. He was always on a pretty large ship, often a small ship of the line. So maybe I should have left Flynn out entirely. I have no experience with Langton's "Tiller and Whipstaff", I do own "Signal Close Action" though. I'll admit that I find "Signal Close Action" to be almost unplayable. I feared that "Tiller and Whipstaff" would be the same.

I guess that what I meant when I said "accurate" was that I'm not looking for rules based solely on "ease" or "speed' of play. I'm looking for ships that move, inflict, and take damage in a realistic way. Thanks for everyone's advice

Tiller & Whipstaff is very closely related to Signal Close Action Fast Play, both of which are extremely pared down from the full Signal Close Action game. I totally agree that Signal Close Action is overwrought, but T&S and SCAFP are both reasonably simple and fun games. Not to mention cheaper!

- Ix

If you're looking for a more accurate system, you might look at adapting Post Captain. It's written for the Napoleonic era, but most of the core rules will work for any Age of Sail era, and you'll just need rosters for period ships and probably adjustments for the slower rates of fire.

If you manage to adapt Post Captain to work for the 17th C., I want to play. :-)

- Ix

Thanks Yellow Admiral (and again, everyone else)for the info.