"A few rules questions..." Topic

I had a very small game of TSATF last night to acquaint myself with the rules, as it's been a number of years since I last played them. The game led to a few rules questions that I hope some of you can help me with.

1. When a scout spots a hidden unit, thus revealing it, can the newly revealed unit still move that same turn (assuming it hasn't moved already)? This would seem to be a death sentence for the scout, since he will inevitably get butchered by the unit he just spotted, being within only 4" of them.

2. When a spear armed unit charges, do you allow the whole unit to throw spears? I played it as just the front rank of the mob.

3. Can a routed unit rally? From what I could see, the Rally table is only used for Pinned unit? Does this mean once a unit routs it just keeps making rout moves till it's off the table and that's it?

4. According to the rules, scouts move at the same speed as their parent unit. To me this doesn't make much sense, having scouts move as slow as a square or line (if the parent unit is in either of said formations), so I had scouts roll for movement individually, counting as open order cross country. They still moved on the the parent unit's movement card, but just rolled distance separately. I guess this isn't really a question, just curious if other people handle scout movement like this?

That's all the issues I can remember right now, so thanks in advance.

As a bonus, here's a few pics and brief write-up on what turned out to be a very short and bloody game: link

I'll leave the formal replies to those who can properly quote the rules, chapter and verse.

However, "Yes," routed units can Rally under the proper circumstances.

Regarding Scouts, I am unaware of any rule requiring a "scouted" unit to remain stationary in the turn of their discovery. If the hidden unit has passed its chance to move, or has moved already, then it has been "scouted" when it's too late to do otherwise. If it has not previously moved in the turn, then it can do so on its side's card draw.

Reasons for NOT immediately pouncing on the otherwise hapless Scout include coming out of whatever cover they were in before, thus exposing themselves to fire for the small comfort of nailing their discoverer. Mind, in the Firing portion of the turn, they can certainly chuck whatever missile weapons they have at him, if not simply gun him down for his efforts.

Note that if the Scout is mounted, he may be able to use the rules for Cavalry allowing them to move any unused portion of their movement distance to avoid a Charge, possibly making coming out of cover again a wasted effort.

Notice how this rightly emphasizes the value of Cavalry for Scouting purposes.

And while it's not the "official" rule for Scouts, I believe many, if not most, players determine their own movement speeds for them. Indeed, as individuals separated from their parent unit, they can even be treated as independent "units" and drawn for movement as well.

Of course, as the late Sergeant Brom would be the first to tell you, play the rule as you think works best for you and your mates. If you play with other gamers, bring it up during the set-up in order to agree on how to proceed in current game.

And if there's an honest disagreement during play, roll a bone for it! The dice never lie, and what happens in one game doesn't have to become local law until it's generally agreed on.

Remember: The Play's The Thing!

TVAG

The way we play it.
Hidden units are often used to "burn" a card. If it's card has been burned, and later in the turn it is discovered, it can't move.

Spear units can only hurl spears IF they pass a test to close. You can't fling them at a lone scout if they don't charge him. And yes. Only the front rank.

A "unit" gets as many dice as the formation it starts the turn in. Arguably, a lone figure is at the very least on open order.

A single infantry figure makes a poor scout. Even with 3 movement dice, it is hard to be safe. You can't save inches. You can only save unused dice. It's problematic if infantry can save dice.
Cavalry can have up to 5 dice for phased movement. This makes them much safer for survival as scouts. For example, use 3 dice to move up. Bingo! You discover sinister natives! You can then use the 2 unused dice to run away.

By the way, we roll all the dice for that unit's movement at once. The unused dice are placed right behind the unit. They are not re-rolled.

…and scouts can only be hit on a Key Figure card.

Thanks for all the replies, that clears things up.

Unfortunately I have to rely on foot scouts rather than mounted for the time being as I have no mounted troops in my Zulu War collection.

Spear units can only hurl spears IF they pass a test to close. You can't fling them at a lone scout if they don't charge him. And yes. Only the front rank.

So you have them throw their spears in the melee phase of the turn, since the test to contact isn't taken till that phase (thus after the shooting phase)?

Yes. It seems odd, but check the rules as written in the 20th anniversary Ed.

Everyone in the unit that has a spear throws them.

In the section on spears it says "Each spearman who closes may throw a spear." So after both sides have rolled to close and then to stand and before the actual hand-to-hand you throw spears and allot casualties.

The rule on routing units says they move 4D6 inches to the nearest edge until they exit the battlefield and are out of the game for good. There is no specific rule to allow for them to rally. If both sides agree, or the gamemaster decrees, you can have the unit test Critical morale at each morale phase to see it they recover.

Trojan bunny,

Here are some answers to your questions:

1) As per the 20th Anniversary edition official rules changes / 2003 as found on sergeants3.com, scouts and unattached leaders automatically attempt to evade a charging enemy. Roll 3D6 for foot and 4D6 for mounted disregarding any terrain penalties. If they roll enough to evade they are safe, if not they are dead. In fire combat they can only be hit on face cards.
2) The whole unit throws spears before they close into melee IF they pass their "Roll to Close". 20th Anny edition, pg 26, each spearman who closes into melee may throw a spear.
3) Routed units as Noted in the rules may not be Rallied. Reference the 20th Anny Edition, pg 30. Sect X. The Morale Phase.
Rallying is for Shaken Figs. Shaken figs are those which have retreated from or lost a close combat. Shaken figs can be rallied on an attempt to move when their card is pulled in the movement phase. Use the Rally table on pg 29. Some people allow routed units to rally in the same manner. If so the GM should state this prior to the game begins or if no GM both sides should note and agree. I for one have allowed routed units to use this Rally roll when attempting to move. However (pg 31) Routed figs that are charged or fired at and take casualties before they move must make their 4 D6 movement toward the table edge immediately.
4) I also allow the scouts to move as open order troops despite the formation of the parent unit.

I hope I didn't muddy the waters for you. The great thing about these rules is you can alter what ever you want and still have a fun playable game. As TVAG stated, Larry would have told you to play them how you want them. As long as you and your mates agree before the game begins it's all good. If there's a discrepancy roll it out, high die wins. If you are GM'ing then it's your game your rules…. Just remember to have fun!

Cheers,
JB
SgtGuinness.blogspot.com