"Talk Some Sense Into Me - 28mm, 15mm or 10mm" Topic

I already have the start of a nice collection of 28mm Sash and Saber and Perry miniatures for the ACW. But I am feeling pulled into the realm of 15/10mm figures for this period. Perhaps because of the size of the battles or perhaps because I am lulled into a sense of (false) security of believing I can paint these smaller sized miniatures quicker and get them onto a battlefield faster.

Blue Moon and AB have my attention for the 18mm zone. Good Ground/Cracker Line have my attention for the 10mm zone (kallistra also looks good, but I think are more of a true 12mm size).

Anyhow, I think it might be silly to have the same period of wargaming in different scales (although I have 15mm and 20mm WWII)…

I want to stick at 28mm, but am also feeling I can get so many more figures at the smaller size. I am also concerned about wargaming rules for 28mm (although Black Powder supplement is on the horizon).

For heaven's sake, someone talk some sense into me….thoughts?

What size is the majority of your terrain? What are other folks in your area playing?

For BIG battles I like 15/18mm (not really a skirmish player)

What ever line of figures you decide on --- my choice of scale has always been the smaller scales. Armies and units look like armies and units and the table now has room for actual manuever. The 15/18 mm figures available today are every bit as good as the larger scales and the art firing ranges look more reasonable even though the guns do not really fire and are just playing pieces. I tend towards meglamania so I personally probably do not save any money as I just buy more figures -- but the units look so darn good!!
Regards
Russ Dunaway

My army is mostly 15mm regimental, with some 6mm for brigade games. If I was to start over for regimental, I would do it in 10mm. A lot of variety nowadays, and you can fit more on the stands.

I went 15mm mostly QRF but I really like these 10mm from Lancashire Games.

link

I started off with 15mm old glory figures. That was 20 years ago. If you want a lot of figures on the board, you cant go wrong with 15mm. I think 18 and 10mm might be the same. And sculptures and casting methods have really improved so you get a lot of choices with a lot of quality.

That being said, I think there are a lot of great figures from many companies out there. My eyesight is getting worse and I had to go with a larger figure. But nothing comes close to the visual impact of a large number of troops on the table that looks like the size of units we are thinkng of when gaming in 15mm.

Matthew

What rules do you prefer? Johnny Reb, Fire & Fury were designed for 15mm figures, play well with 10mm, not so well with 28mm. You can play big battles just fine with 28mm figures using Volley & Bayonet, or smaller actions with Black Powder, or skirmish with Uncivil War, etc.

You can buy more smaller figures for the same amount of money, but you can't paint units any faster without lowering your standards. More smaller figures = more smaller figures to paint. Some people like the look of speed-painted mass armies, but I was always a detail man.

How old are you? How steady is your hand? How keen are your eyes? I'm reaching an age where I can see bigger figures better.

Personally, I'm not dumping my old 15mm collections, and I'm still building them out, but I'm moving more toward 28mm figures for current projects. I can afford it, and I'm worth it.

The bigger the scale, the more work per figure. The smaller figures aren't necessarily less work because there are more of them, but there is less detail work. Bigger figures make more of a splash in how they look. Smaller figures let you get more figures on the table (assuming you spend the same), and that makes your regiments look more like regiments instead of squads. My next big project (a year or two away) is to buy some 6mm ancients so that the armies really look like masses of men. There are a ton of photos out there, compare the look of the scales and then go with what you like.

"I already have the start of a nice collection of 28mm Sash and Saber and Perry miniatures for the ACW."

-- Don't stop, don't look back, don't question your initial vision. Drive on to 28mm Victory!

Let's talk about how many figures make a unit, and how that looks. I like at least 24 figures in a 28mm battalion, prefer 36 to 50 figs per battalion. This is for F&IW, or small AWI games – I only have two or three battalions per side on the table. Looks great.

For Johnny Reb, by 15mm regiment is 10 to 20 figures. Kinda small for a regiment, I need 4 or 5 of those and a battery to have some presence on the table and look like a brigade, if I'm gaming with at least a division per side. Or I can drop down to 6mm scale, and really load each stand up with figures.

There are a lot of solutions.

I have and like the 28mm scale. The others look too small to me.

I am with Cleburne – I have ACW in 54mm, 28mm, 15mm, 10mm and 6mm – but if I was to do it again I would not have my massive 15mm collection, it would be 10mm

My advise is not to do the same thing in two scales. If you have big fellows you're happy with, use them to fight skirmishes--burn bridges, scout, bushwhack supply trains and such. Then use 10mm--or 15mm or 5/6mm--to fight out the bigger battles. Just don't let the stands get so small that becomes a problem. I don't mind putting a lot of castings on a 1" square stand, but I try to avoid anything smaller than 20mm square.
Not that I haven't done it. I just don't think it was my cleverest move.

The very first historicals I got into was 15mm ACW intended for Fire & Fury. I have quite a few bases of rebs, most with 'good enough' paint jobs, to get the ball rolling. Ultimately, nothing else ever came of the project.

But since then, I have concluded that the ACW just doesn't *look* quite right at smaller scales, and I would prefer to have gone with 28mm. I certainly wouldn't go any smaller than 15mm myself.

Just my 2 cents.

….Your first mistake is thinking any of us have a lick of sense…

I see my post disappeared…

Personally, I prefer a smaller number of larger figures. It's all really a matter of taste.

Thank you all so much….my problem is that I agree with each of you.

I really like the detail work of 28mm figures. I am middle-aged over 40. I need magnifying glasses when I paint so, to me, the scale doesn't make it more or less difficult to paint from a vision standpoint.

However, I find that I put as much time into painting 15mm as I do 28mm between base, shades and highlights. I just don't paint the eyes on 15mms (that does save quite a bit of time).

On the other hand, I like the idea of larger battlefields with more figures on the table. So 15/18mm or 10mm might be a nice change.

Saber6 – I don't own any ACW terrain yet. Not quite sure what others are gaming here as far as scale goes.

Zippyfusenet, you ask a good question – I am not sure yet which rules I prefer as I have not had a chance really to play any. It's a fair question.

Mywindsorfw, I agree with you. Smaller figures should, in theory, be less work per figure because there is less detail; there are just more of them to paint.

Perhaps common sense will prevail and if I do nothing at all, the urge to do something will simply dissipate….

Nah. Who am I kidding?

My advice is choose one scale and stick with it.

I think I'd be guided most by what the guys in your club or region are playing. It doesn't matter how many figures you buy and paint if you don't have anyone to play with.

10mm Pendraken and Broken Ground are the way to go….I love the size and scale of the battles you can create and the figures still allow a good paint job with decent detail level.

I mulled this over for years-got some 28mm, then Newline 20mm which is really cost effective but in the end Peter Pigs 15mm range was the chosen one.

I know exactly what you mean.

28mm figures are lovely and you want some. But you want to do big battles with loads of figures.

My solution, which works for me in all periods, is to do both 28mm and 6mm. The 28s are great for skirmishes and small scale actions of all sorts. The 6s are great for building big armies using big units.

6mm figures paint up really quick. And no, you don't need great eyesight or great skill – even I can do it! My Napoleonic battalions, for example, have 50-odd figures in them. My Bavarian army is almost finished. Finished as in having every battalion, squadron and battery represented.

6 and 28 is the way to go. You have the 28s with all their detail to satisfy your desire for eye-candy. You then want smaller figures so you may as well not compromise and go all the way down to 6mm!

I amjust getting back into ACW myself. Had many thousands of 15mm years ago.
While i quite like 10mm, i don't see the savings as to price with 10mm over 15mm.
So it will be 15mm again for me.

Start with a simple question: Why did you get into 28mm ACW in the first place?

If it was simply because you saw some cool 28mm ACW figures and had to have them, or if it was because you didn't know there were other choices out there, and you have found something new that is clearly better, then it comes down to is it worth the additional time and financial cost to redo what you have already done.

If instead you had a more substantive reason for selecting 28mm, chances are that reason will still remain valid. There are always going to be other new shiny figures coming out in another scale to tempt you. Rules may be designed for another scale, but they can be modified. An individual regiment of 12 men may not look as good as a regiment of 20 or 24, but that advantage largely disappears when you start fielding a dozen or more of those regiments. Finally the time you spend rebuilding your ACW armies in a smaller scale is time you could have spent expanding your 28mm ACW armies.

Hope that helps.

@john lacer – if you are getting back into 15mm, which line will you go with?

Bill N – thank you for your thoughts. The questions you ask me to ask myself are good ones…

I have 10mm armies from Perrin from long ago, when I was a wee lad who could see better. I find myself doing 28mm now and having to use a magnifier headset to paint these even because my sight is so bad now. I like the look of the 28's but the 10mm look so cool in mass formation, but its no big deal I will have both now to do games in. I had 15mm way back but sold them for 10's, they just lend more to a massed effect than the 15's even.

After years of 28mm (which I still get for other projects), I opted for 10mm for ACW. To me, 10mm is the right balance between 6mm (too little detail for me) and 15mm (where I find enough detail I spend the same time as 28mm), and 10mm still presents a suitable mass on the table.

I went with Old Glory 10mm, with a few bits from others.

I collect ACW in both 28mm and 15mm. With 15mm I can fight the big battles that I sometimes like to do and 28mm gives me the visuals I like. While 15mm does look more like armies fighting I still think a 28mm game just looks better.

I do understand folks wanting to do 10/6mm to really magnify the effect of armies, but for me nothing compares to a well done 28mm game.

Christopher

I do all my ACW gaming in 28mm now. I started in 15mm but stopped when I was given access to a very large 28mm collection. I strictly do large battles (Shiloh, Gettysburg, etc) and find that the 28mm looks very good at that scale.

In fact, for almost all of my periods i am doing 28s. The only exception is SF where the general lack of faces (full helmets) and straps makes painting much easier.

Old eyes demand 28mm.

For 15mm, i like old glory, stone mountain, and musket miniatures.
blue moon are great, but 18mm. not much of a problem, but why bother when i can get the above mentioned in 15mm? Seems to me, blue moon had a oppertunity to make 15mm figures and decided to make somewhat short 20mm figures.
dumb, dumb, dumb.

I relate to "Old eyes need 28mm".

And this idea of smaller scale presents a suitable mass effect; I get it but it really doesn't make logical sense. Say a 600 man regiment is represented by 12 28mm figures or 36 6mm figures; neither the 12 figures nor the 36 smaller figures look anything like a 600 man regiment. In which case since it's an abstraction anyway I'd rather be able to see the uniforms and go with the 28.

I am 65 years old with poor eye sight but just discovered this new invention called Glass's? 36 or more figures still look like more men then 10 or 12.
Regards.
Russ Dunaway

I think a game looks more like a battle in 10mm:
link

10MM looks great also!!
regards
Russ Dunaway