"Squadron/regiment horse colours" Topic

I am returning to painting Nap cavalry ater a few years off. I dimly recall that it may have been customary for squadrons and/or regiments to use the same colour horses, with the trumpeter perhaps mounted on a grey and the officers doing what they liked. Is that correct, in that each squadron would have its "own colour" horses, or did each regiment adopt one colour for all squadrons? My own French armies are for the 1809-1812 period - I fully appreciate that after 1812 the cavalry would have taken whatever colour horses they could get their hands on!

I'm probably going to adopt this approach anyway, for ease of painting if no other reason, but am interested to know whether it's historically accurate.

Giles

Regardless of historical practice a mix of horse colours always looks best. Single colour squadrons or regiments look a bit artificial unless you can make a rock-solid historical case for it.

While I agree that for the periods I game, Waterloo and ACW, standard horse colours are wishfull thinking, I still use them for Waterloo, because it helps me see who belongs to what unit, and because I like the looks of a "uniform" unit.

Going by memory of past reading (not generally a good thing), there were some guard units that had all black horses. Possibly the mounted Grenadiers of the Guard. If you are painting line regiments, I don't think any had standard horse colors. I believe the French were too hard on horses for standardization to last long.

My reading of "Swords Around a Throne", DePuy's history of the Grand Armee would indicate that probably only the Guard could be choosy about horse color. The rest of the army was happy if the horses had four legs, and that goes for the entire period, not just post-1812. After 1812 they probably accepted three-legged horses, along with teen-aged ploughboy troopers.

The long wars (starting in 1792) and bloated military establishments meant horses were at a premium on the continent. Cavalry regiments also had to compete with the artillery and supply trains for horseflesh.

I read where an English trooper's horse captured in Spain was given to a French general. I suspect the French cavalry rode a pack of multi-colored nags. But paint 'em how you like 'em.

Uniform horses seem to be more of an ideal than a practice. But then, most of us paint our troops in new, unfaded, unripped up uniforms, so why not have spiffy horses also??

They only regiment I can recall off the top of my head are the Greys (Royal Scottish Dragoon Guards).

SMc

There is a good discussion on this at link
If it doesn't take you to the right place, you want message 1259.1 onwards.
Swampster

Five French regiments of the period were black horse outfits: The Grenadiers a Cheval, the Guard horse artillery, both carabinier regiments, and the Elite Gendarmerie.

The French also had designations, by squadron in the line cavalry regiments on who was to ride what colored horses:

1st Squadron: black

2d Squadron: bays

3d Squadron: chestnut

4th Squadron: gray

White or gray mounts went to trumpeters, and kettledrummers rode piebald or skewbald horses. Officers usually did what they wanted and bought their own mounts.

On campaign, especially in places like Spain, keeping the color/squadron was difficult if not impossible, even for Guard units. Horse casualties were usually higher than man-losses in cavalry regiments.

In addition to the above:

I believe the Chasseurs a Cheval of the Imp. Guard rode bay and chestnut horses. (In my army they do!)

For ease of identification, I prefer to paint all the horses in a given unit the same basic color (except buglers and maybe officers). You can add some individuality with different blazes, stockings, etc., but consider this: with most lines of figures the horses are all going to be in step! How realistic is that?!

Does anyone know what colour horses the Dutch and Polish lancers riding?

Chestnuts and bays with greys or whites for the trumpeters of both regiments. Kettledrummers rode piebald or skewbald horses.

Sincerely,
Kevin

I think Gandalf is spot on.
What I would like to know is the height of Red Lancers' horses, but this is another topic :-)

Zurich,
I couldn't find the height of the 2d Lancers' horses, but those for the 1st Lancers were to be between 14 1/4 and 14 1/2 hands high. The source also mentioned that they tried to keep horses uniformly colored by squadrons: bays, chestnuts, blacks, and dark grays. That was a uniform practice in the French army, except for the black horse regiments (Grenadiers a Cheval, 1st and 2d Carabiniers, Artillerie a Cheval de la Garde, Gendarmerie d'Elite).

Sincerely,
Kevin

According to Nigel de Lee's "French Lancers" (Almark, 1976): "The Lancers of the Imperial Guard rode horses of 14 1/4 to 14 1/2 hands, other formations made do with smaller ones. Larger horses were an advantage in a charge, where they provided impetus, but were less able to survive the exertions and privations of a campaign than smaller ones."

By contrast, the Union army in the ACW advertised for cavalry horses of 15 hands or taller.

For comparison: It shows my age, but I recall from my childhood immersion in Western movies that Roy Rogers' famous horse Trigger was 15 hands tall. (Rogers was rather short, himself, maybe 5' 8" at most, probably shorter.) A "hand" of course, is the width of a man's hand (5 inches?), and it's measured to the top of the horse's shoulder.

Anyone know what color horses were ridden by the Dutch-Belgian Cuirassiers at Waterloo?

G'day, Don.

A hand is actually 4 inches, mate. So a 14 1/4 horse (usually written as "14.1hh") would be 57" or 4' 11" tall at the withers (the bump behind the neck, for those wondering).

Cheers.

Dal.

It is interesting to note that while the Carabiniers always are illustrated on black or very dark bays that Detaille- an impeccable source- has a fantastic painting of a senior officer of Carabiniers in the post 1810 uniform prominently riding a beautiful dapple gray.

Officers had to provide their own horses, did they not?

Thanks for the info, Dal.