"English regiments at Dunkirk/The Dunes 1658" Topic

Does anyone know anything about the Commonwealth regiments which took part in the Battle of The Dunes in 1658? I have found mentions of four – Alsop's, Cochrane's, Lillingston's and Morgan's, plus Lockhart's horse – but nothing much more.

I would particularly like to know how – if at all – whether they were related to the original 12 regiments of the New Model Army. None of the units I have found appears to be.

Many thanks for any information received.

Not got my sources immediately to hand, but I seem to recall that the Foot regiments were raised specifically for that expedition, so no direct lineage.

To be honest, the 1645 regiments went through a lot of change in terms of reductions, amalgamation and splitting off into various garrisons that I think very few made them into the later Commonwealth forces intact.

Wiser, more informed and better referenced posters will probably disagree.

Have you tried the British Civil Wars Regimental Wiki – link ?

According to link and other accounts there were six Commonwealth regiments of foot: from the list in the wiki, Alsop's, Clark's, Cochrane's, Lillingstone's, Morgan's, Reynolds'. Looks like they were all new-raised in 1657.

And of course, there are also the regiments that fought on the other side too. Also English and British.

Some of which also went on to form permanent regiments in the standing army.

Hi all,

Tim from the BCW Regimental Wiki here, the info in the wiki is according to Firth & Davies

At Battle of the Downs:
Commonwealth
Foot: link
Cochrane,
Alsop,
Clark,
Lillingston,
Morgan,
Lockhart (ex Reynolds),
Gibbon 5 companies,
Salmon (ex Mauleverer) 5 companies ?

Royalists-
Foot: link
Blagge's Bde:
King Charles' Footguard,
Lord Digby
Muskerry's Bde:
Duke of York
Ormonde's Irish (Grace)
Newburgh's Scots (W Urry)

Horse: link
The Duke of York's Troop of Horse Guards.

As ever, any more information is very welcome,

all the best

Tim

This is the info I have together with the colours of their flags is:

Lockhart/Reynolds – Blue
Lillingston – white
Alsop – red
Cochrane – orange
Clark – green
Morgan – yellow
Pepper – amalgamated companies formed of companies from Salmon (red) and Gibbon (blue)
Lockhart's Horse (600 men) arrived in Flanders after the battle

Royalists
Kings Own English (Wilmot)
Middleton's Scots
Ormond's Irish
Duke of York's Irish
Duke of Gloucester's Irish (not present at the battle)
Lord Bristol's Irish
Duke of York's Life Guards (50 men)
Most of the Royalist regiments were only a few hundred men each

This came from Iain Stanford's article in Arquebusier Vol XXXIV/III

Cheers smacdowell!

Does the Arquebusier article mention any sources for the flag colours? Peachey & Prince have Lillingston as possibly blue, Lockhart white based on a couple of contemporary mentions reported by Firth & Davies. I'd be really interested in finding out more on this!

The lists accord well, Royalists are the same as the King's regiment was the Guards, Middleton's was Newburgh's, as Middleton was sent to Poland on a diplomatic mission, and Lord Bristol = Lord Digby.

All the best
Tim

Thank you very much, one and all – superb info, especially the flag colours.

@Timbo W The Arquebusier article does not footnote the flag colours. Cust, Clark, C.H. Firth, Firth & Davies, Scott, Swaine, Tessin and Walton all mentioned in the bibliography

Thanks smacd,

I'm pretty sure the flag infos not from Firth or Firth and Davies, but not run into any of others, if anyone can track the flag references down that'd be really above and beyond the call of duty.

Apparently Morgan remarks on a "blue regiment", but I had a feeling it was Lillingstone's, not Reynolds.

If you can wait just a bit longer, John Barratt is publishing a book on this exact subject in June, through Helion Publishing and their Century of the Soldier series. link

Very interesting! Having read Barratts new work on the NMA Iregiments im sure it'll be very well researched.

I look forward to it. I am currently building both armies that fought at the Battle of the Dunes. With French troops on both sides and Commonwealth English facing Royalist English, Scots and Irish alongside Spanish – what is there not to like.

They look fab! The figs really capture the period appearance, and vibe even, very well I think.

Thanks -- more on the emerging armies for the Dunes and initial skirmishes on the blog at
link

Interesting stuff. This link might be helpful ("Royalist & Cromwellian Armies in Flanders 1657-1662" by CH Firth) :

link

Cheers,

Phil