
"How many planes in a squadron?" Topic
9 Posts
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Belkor | 27 Mar 2005 11:09 a.m. PST |
How many planes did a squadron consist of? |
PigLatin | 27 Mar 2005 11:37 a.m. PST |
Depends on the nation, in the American Pacific, I believe that a unit had to have able to fly at any one time 14 planes to be considered a squadron and the base I think was 21. I would ask my Grandfather as he was at Henderson Airfield repairing it for many flights, the most famous guy he met was Boyington. But since my Grandfather died a couple of years ago, its impossible to ask him now. He had some great stories about WW2 and hated McArthur, thought he was a jerk, but thats understandable as he was in the Navy. |
Doms Decals  | 27 Mar 2005 11:38 a.m. PST |
Depends whose and when, but 12 a lot of the time, either 4 flights of 3 (eg. early war British) or 3 flights of 4 (eg. German fighters.) Dom. |
OldGrenadier  | 27 Mar 2005 1:14 p.m. PST |
Twelve to fourteen operational A/C seems to be an average. Actual establishment could vary considerably, depending on the time of the war, the type of unit, and the combat status. |
Ed Mohrmann | 27 Mar 2005 2:05 p.m. PST |
USN Pacific early war carrier squadrons: Scout and Bombing squadrons and Fighter and Torpedo squadrons had 18 each on strength, with a general reserve of 8 aircraft carried aboard. At the start of the war, a carrier had 4 squadrons as above. Typically operational at any one time (without regard to damage due to operations, combat, etc.) was 12-14, the remainder down for various maintenance activities. This is the Fleet Carrier organization. Land-based USN and USMC squadrons had generally the same organization, but combat erosion drove squadron strengths down significantly, to the point that early in the war, the VF and VMF squadrons on Henderson rarely could put more than 6-8 aircraft up on one mission. Later in the war, and with the introduction of light and escort carriers the aircraft strength could be quite different, especially with the introduction of the TBM in a bombing and torpedo role. Generally, light carriers tasked with CAP would be 'fighter heavy' in their equipage (up to 48 aircraft) while escort carriers might be a wild mix, given their role as maids of all work AND carrying replacements for the bigger ships. 'Enterprise' late in the war was tasked as a Night Operations carrier and had about a 1/3 to 2/3 ratio of TBM's (radar equipped) to fighters, generally a TBM/fighter pair working under the FDO until close enough to target that the TBM's radar could guide the fighter to an intercept. She also had some TBM's equipped for night bombing operations, but I'm not sure of the number. USAAC fighter squadrons were organized initially as USN (18 aircraft; 24 pilots) but as the war went on, the USAAC organization changed as roles were more defined, the escort squadrons remaining at about that number, while point-defense and ground attack units were reduced to 12 aircraft per squadron. USAAC bombing squadrons started the war with 12 aircraft each, but with the advent of the bombing campaign in Europe, were reduced in some cases to 9, due to the basing requirements and the difficulty in assembling larger squadrons prior to proceeding to target. Medium and light squadrons stayed at the 12 level. Generally, a squadron would carry 1/3 more pilots on strength than aircraft. Please bear in mind that all the foregoing are optimum organizational/administrative numbers. Cases can be found in which a 'squadron' consisted of 4 very different aircraft, or 24 of all the same type. Wartime needs dictated many ad hoc arrangements. Sorry, I don't know anything about Allied/Japanese/ German organization. 'Squadron,' in Quick, is defined as (first definition) 'Two or more flights (USAAC) or Divisions (USN; USMC) organized under a common headquarters, of the same or similar types of aircraft.' A 'flight' typically is two airplanes, but could be four. |
John Armatys | 27 Mar 2005 4:13 p.m. PST |
Battle of Britain RAF worked on the following basis: A full strength squadron would have 20 aircraft and two reserves, plus 16 operational pilots, and would be expected to fly 12 aircraft, either as four flights of three or three flights of four. If the strength fell below 9 they should have been relieved and posted to another Group, however some squadrons suffered exhaustion from persistent combat and heavy losses, and were far from efficient before being withdrawn. Some squadrons lasted 4 to 6 weeks, others had to be replaced after only a week to ten days. On 2.9.40 seven squadrons were reduced to less than half strength, and by 7.9.40 it was impossible to exchange squadrons quickly enough as their strength in operational pilots ran down. A system of grading squadrons was introduced in early September: A 11 Group, plus Duxford and Middle Wallop, maintained constantly at a minimum of 16 operational pilots. Those in 10 and 12 Group had non-operational pilots in addition “as convenient”. B Most of 10 and 12 Groups, kept up to strength a strength of 16 operational pilots plus six non-operational pilots - to relieve 11 Group squadrons. C In the quieter parts of the country, a minimum of three operational pilots act as leaders (except three named squadrons, which had eight), used for training pilots as replacements for 11 Group |
Wargamer Blue | 27 Mar 2005 5:43 p.m. PST |
Are there any good books out there about each nations air organisation? |
RockyRusso | 28 Mar 2005 1:37 p.m. PST |
Hi Germans and Italians used 9 plane squadrons. U.S. squadrons were not always as big as described above. In the case of B24 and B17, 6 planes made a squadron. Partly, this is tactical, and partly, a squadron is an organization unit for the U.S. with a command structure. Thus, a B17 with 10 man crews has more people in 6 airplanes, than a 20 plane fighter squadron. Rocky |
Ed Mohrmann | 28 Mar 2005 8:05 p.m. PST |
Rocky, the organization for the heavies (17's and 24's) was indeed 9 Aircraft for the ETO and intially for the PTO. I served (40 years + ago) with some WWII vets and also availed myself of a lot of info when I was in the USAF. PTO squadrons (especially the late-war B-32 squadrons, which only ever flew 1 or 2 operations) were 6 aircraft, but that had more to do with logistics than anything else. The base admin unit was indeed the squadron, but most service personnel were assigned to what was called an Airbase Unit, which provided maintenance, food service, personnel, security and ordnance/fuel services. From a tactical standpoint, the real HQ element was the Group, two or more squadrons. Two or more Groups would make up a Wing, and Wings were subordinate to Air Divisions. Frag orders were generally only sent as low as Group level for most missions, although there could be specialized missions the planning for which took place at the squadron level, but those were pretty rare. Planning mostly was at the Group level, with Wing providing over- sight and co-ordinating with escorts, etc. At a base on which I served there was an A-26 Group which had been re-activated as a COIN unit(1963). It had 2 squadrons of 12 each, and generally could mount 8-10 aircraft from each squadron at any particular time. |
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