"Making Fall In or Cold Wars a Four Day Convention?" Topic

Hey all

I was wondering if the attendance numbers justify making Fall In or Cold Wars a four day convention? I'd like to hear how people feel about that.

A four day convention would make it more attractive to me – since I have to travel from SW US

Cold Wars tried a 4 day model a few years back, but it didn't seem that it much caught on. CW and FI are already on an informal 4 day basis with many gamers arriving Thursday to settle in and socialize and catch the odd Thursday night game. The real trick will be selling the vendors on the additional day. I go Thursday, but that's just me.

No interest here. I usually make it a one day Saturday thing.
And if I stay over to Sunday, it's never for gaming. Just last minute shopping.
Thursdays are pointless for me.

From an attendee standpoint I feel like four days is bumping the saturation point. From a convention management point of view it seems to me that there are not enough game masters as it is and it might be hard to fill four days. I can't back that with numbers, though. Maybe someone more keyed into HMGS can say.

An odd thought struck me: offer
Thursday evening as a free flea market session like Sunday morning?
Mind you, I have't had _any_ coffee yet, so no consequences of this action have burbled their way through the fetid muck of my brain yet to what I satirically call my consciousness.

A flea market Thursday night is a great idea that would be met by howls of protest from dealers (who would see their customers spend their money before they ever opened their booths) and the convention management (who would see money from flea market tables decline).

The question would be: "By how much?" That is the real issue here isn't it? From what folks are saying Thursday is a "dead day" anyway. Let's see how dead. If allowing a small free flea market space limited to say 1 table per participant/family/team etc. it could be a great way to gauge the interest and act as a "draw" factor for Thursdays. Also pick the con that has the largest number of folks arriving on Thursdays for the test. The management may also want to consider "early bird" dealer areas as well. Say 50% off your normal day fee for showing up and setting up on Thursdays.

I think a full slate of Thursday night games would be very attractive without disrupting the dealers in any way. I always run a game Friday or Saturday. Running it Thursday evening would be no problem.

I'm usually there Thursday evenings anyway.
Wouldn't mind a Thursday flea market one bit. This might get me there earlier in the day.
I think the dealers would welcome this. It would give them a chance to participate.

TRU

Please no. As a vendor, the extra day only adds additional costs and time since some of us have to arrive a day early to set up. I personally do not think attendance will increase much more than it is already, so increased cost with usual sales is not a win/win. At least leave the vendor area on it's normal schedule.

Too far for me sadly, but I'll add my input anyway, based upon what I've observed of local cons.

The Thursday evening/night games schedule idea is a good one, if people are getting there early anyway.

At a minimum, they should cut the price down by 50%, or 75%, since it's only night gaming.

Perhaps even consider making it free, in order to lure some that are on the fence, and want to check out a convention for the first time. If they like it, they just might come back for another day, or the full weekend.

Seems to me like getting people to run and participate in more games for longer, on Sundays would be a good idea. I know here, Sundays are usually way under attended, and there are fewer good offerings.

I realize some people may want to leave by lunchtime, in order to travel to get home, if they live a long way from the convention. However, I suspect a lot of people may not be able to attend Friday events as well, so really then, Saturday ends up being the only full day of gaming.

Expect less action Saturday nite.

Cuz we need our rest!

At least leave the vendor area on it's normal schedule.

You bring up a good point. I'm thinking Thursday could be a day to get in allot of tournaments, games and flea markets. I know it's tough when you want to participate in the Bolt Action tournament and the Saga tournament. Opening Thursdays up might help that.

Me personally, I love to get into Lancaster early on Thursday, have breakfast at Cracker Barrel and roam around until my friends start getting in.

Another potentially brilliant/idiotic coffee-deprived thought:
Thursday night would be a great time for demo/walk-up games to help the vendors sell their wares by exposure. It would also allow the word-of-mouth to help sales along as the players' friends got word of how much fun the game was. I know I've bought several sets of rules and complementary figures,etc., once I chanced to play the game.

Another potentially brilliant/idiotic coffee-deprived thought

Personally I'll file that under brilliant :)

We arrive on Weds for both and bring a couple of games to play.
Would like flea markets at least to run also.
clif

My suggestion: How about having convention start on Thursday, but having dealers only on Friday and Saturday, but both full days. Dealers who need time to set up can show up Thursday and set up at their leisure, then get in some gaming Thursday night. The opposite on Saturday night / Sunday morning, dealers can tear down on Saturday if they want, or game Saturday night and tear down Sunday

In my mind, the Sunday three hours is a joke (as a dealer….) Very few sales, and I have to be there for three hours that I'd much rather be somewhere else.

Now, what about the Host? I have my doubts they will even be allowed to serve clients this November!

I award arrive Thursday, one or two friendly games that evening and catch up with others.
A small Sunday like flea market would be nice.

Yeah apparently the Host had numerous write ups on a DOA inspection on 1 Sept.

link

The host has been prohibited from serving food at all until they pass inspection. It was particularly run down during WBC. They had to cancel a charity dinner on Friday.

To second BTC's point, if the conventions were expanded to four days we would probably stop attending as a dealer.

I always thought adding Thursday (say starting at noon) would work well. I understand why dealers don't want it, as they'd probably sell the same amount with more costs. But why can't the first day be gaming only, formal and organized, with the dealer hall opening the next day?

That way, everybody who wants an extra day of gaming (a decent number, I suspect) can come out early without putting more pressure on the dealers.

Whoops, sorry Daribuck. Didn't notice you'd suggested the same thing already. Obviously, I agree with you.

@civildisobedience:
I was coming at the problem from a different perspective, thinking a "nonofficial" Thursday would be less stressful environment.

Daribuck, the challenge of allowing some dealers to pack out on Saturday evening becomes a security nightmare for the rest of the dealers……….I have never minded Sunday mornings. It is always icing on the cake so to speak. I am sure some dealers have better Sunday experiences than others……………..

RE: I am sure some dealers have better Sunday experiences than others…

Possibly, but the ones I've talked to (myself included!) think Sunday is absolutely horrible. Basically, no one is there until 10 anyway (They're all sleeping?) and many of the dealers start at least thinking of packing it up at 11. The net effect is that we are compelled to stay overnight for three hour's worth of sales. Why?

BTC, I appreciate, and understand, what you are saying. It just seems odd to me that the dealer area is open for business exactly 18 hours, which is split over three days, including a 9 hour Saturday. My suggestion, as a dealer and fan of gaming, is to split those 18 hours over exactly two days instead,

Daribuck

I would love to have the opportunity to grow the show to 4 days. If it becomes prudent to do so, with the backing of the BoD and the vote of the members, I would do so.

I would love to have the opportunity to grow the show to 4 days. If it becomes prudent to do so, with the backing of the BoD and the vote of the members, I would do so.

I guess the main question is what is the criteria for adding another day to the convention?

Dare I suggest a poll or "suggestion box" for issues that make or break a convention?
e.g. adequate lighting, reasonable climate control, noise levels, onsite lodging, food service, walking-distance restauants, airport proximity, parking, etc.

The purpose of the above would help provide a wishlist/checklist for considering a particular site.

Bad idea all around.

Four day cons stress the volunteers who staff the cons (they can barely find enough people now), and increase the costs of the cons.

Four day cons have not proven to draw more people at all. People pick and choose the days they will attend, without an increase in revenue to cover the added costs of another day – let alone the stress on the volunteers and dealers.

Many dealers no longer attend due to the costs. You'd only drive more away who could not afford yet another day off of real work, or away from their business at home where they often make more money than going to a con.

Case in point – used to be that Saturday night gaming areas were packed. No longer. So now, with empty space already, why add another day?

Sunday is horrible, yet oddly enough HMGS has the (fill in the blank) to charge people $15 USD for the privilege of watching the dealers pack up.