"Philippines Asks for US Military Assistance in South ..." Topic

…China Sea

"Last week, Philippine Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin requested military assistance from the head of U.S. Pacific Command, Admiral Harry Harris Jr., to strengthen the Philippines' position in the South China Sea, AFP reports.

According to Colonel Restituto Padilla, a military spokersperson of the Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP), "t was a specific request on the part of the secretary of national defense to Harris to get their assistance in… resupplying and rotating troops."

He emphasized that Admiral Harris made no commitment during the meeting to fulfill the request concerning the "West Philippine Sea" (Manila's name for the closest section of South China Sea). "They just took our requests and the details still have to be discussed," Padilla said. Reuters, however, did report that U.S. Vice Admiral Alexander Lopez told local media that Harris pledged his support to help the United States' oldest ally in the Asia-Pacific region…"
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If the U.S. agrees to this Philippine request it could be a recipe for a confrontation with China.

Amicalement
Armand

Unsaid, but the US military has a long memory and still bristles at being kicked-out of Subic Bay and Clark AFB in 1991. Philipino politicians were quite vocal about ejecting the America back then. Now they are back with hat in hand.

I'm sure the US wants to make the Philipinos squirm, especially since they are no longer of real strategic importance to US interests.

Yes, they were rather ungrateful then, weren't they.

Maybe it's time for SEATO 2.0!

As I seem to be saying all over the web today, everything old is new again! How did the French phrase it, the more things change the more they stay the same!

The US (as ever) will counter China in the South China sea for its own selfish interests.

How would Americans feel if a foreign army/navy/air force were based on their territory and its personnel immune to local prosecution? Many Americans I'm sure are unaware of why Okinawans, Koreans, Filipinos etc. might want to be rid of the US bases. Or why the Iraqi Government asked the US forces to leave. The elephant in the room is called SOFA.

Given US personnel ar every much able to be prosecuted on bases in the UK, why do they get immunity in Asia?

I don't know why but suspect it is something to do with the low standards of justice in countries like Japan, Korea and I'm sure the Philippines is even worse.

Korea does not have jury trials and from what I heard on the grapevine about foreigners getting caught up in the system it is heavily biased.

Japan tends to extort confessions and guilty pleas or imposes outrageous sentences. I heard of one guy in Japan who was convicted of drug trafficking [on pretty scanty evidence] who is handcuffed 24 hours a day – hands behind his back – and in jail for decades. This was following the 2002 FIFA world cup.

So I can see why the US feels the need to protect its personnel. There have been some high profile rape/murders in Japan and the perpetrators [US marines I think] got off very lightly which does send the wrong message. But if they handed over the suspects to the Japanese they'd get lynched.

There is particularly sensitive case going on at the moment in the Philippines with a US Marine as defendant.

It's a very difficult area without obvious solutions.

If the US is serious about a pivot to Asia it would seem a good idea to look into this problem.

Since Japan was a defeated & occupied country, the US certainly wasnt going to subject their forces to local laws.

Korea was a battleground and is now the most dangerous flashpoint in the world, US troops have certain protections for placing their lives on the line as a physical deterrent vs North Korea.

Phillipines was an American protectorate so legal agreements carried over from then. Since the US bases closed, they haven't done much with the infrastructure the US handed over to them so desperately need the US back. But they are simply no longer that strategically for the US "pivot" as the US is securing basing rights directly on the Asian continent.

Enough of the US bashing already. Even UN troops invoke extra-territoriality when posted on peace missions abroad.

Status of Forces Agreements (SOFA) are different for every country the U.S. has personnel stationed. It is a negotiated treaty. If you don't like the outcome negotiate better deals. Except the nations usually are so desperate to have U.S. help, they agree to just about anything in these treaties. The U.S. tries to protect its personnel from what is considered to be arbitrary and capricious punishment, not to excuse their crimes. If countries want the U.S. to leave their country, the U.S. leaves.

It's a complicated issue.

The US could do better by their hosts but I don't expect them to hand over their personnel to local prosecution.

My personal proposal would be to keep US forces personnel on base during their off duty hours. That would solve 99% of the local problems.

Same would go for UK forces, UN forces etc.

Often times of course the host countries want to profit from the drinking and … etc … that goes on around the US bases. So I guess my simple solution is not really practical.

The Philippines bases may not be important now but Okinawa is. So is South Korea as a base to threaten China. I think South Korea could contain the North with the forces it has – but the extra deterrent from US forces is a useful bonus. Taking them out altogether [I gather they were dreadfully run down during the mid 2000s] would be a terrible move as it would only embolden the North.

Like I say it's a complicated issue. It's not just about bashing the US.

This was a discussion about military bases in the Phillipines, until it turned into more US bashing.

Open the discussion by bashing the Phillipines, then complain when someone takes a shot at the US?

Don't order in the spicy kitchen if you can't take the heat ;-)

Bashing? Heat? Bah.

I merely point out historical facts.

I happened to have participated in a 1997 study of Subic Bay on whether the vast facilities could be converted to a world-class Industrial Park (notice this was 1997, the U.S. left in 1991). We expected it would be easy to use existing infrastructure, transport and ready access to English speaking labor. We discovered that anything that wasn't taken by the Pols was left to rot. It was cheaper to build brand new factories in China and Malaysia.

Now, with China encroaching on their territories, and only 14 Marines parked on a grounded Liberty Ship (donated by the U.S.) in the Spratleys to protect their interests, the Phillipino Pols are begging for protection.

Too late. Better, more strategic bases can be had on the mainland.

I think we're done here.

You do realize China now "owns" the South China Sea, right Skarper?

If the US intervenes in the region, it will just be to ensure freedom of navigation for shipping and aircraft through it, since about 1/3 of all sea trade transits through the area, and a significant amount of civilian air traffic also passes over it.

I can see the South China sea from my house…so that makes me an expert – right?

I can see the South China Sea on Google maps :-)