| ogriffy | 01 Sep 2015 11:04 a.m. PST |
Hello All, I have a short question that I need help with. Does anyone know if the Irish infantry regiments in the service of France/Louis XIV (Mountcashel, Lee, Dillion, Clare/O'Brien) wore small ribbons on their right shoulders, as the rest of the French infantry regiments did during the period 1684-1698? It's hard to find if they kept closer to the English uniform or not after they passed into French service. Thank you in advance for any answers. |
| Winston Smith | 01 Sep 2015 11:37 a.m. PST |
These regiments did NOT "pass into French service". They were always French regiments, primarily recruited from foreigners. |
 Herkybird  | 01 Sep 2015 11:37 a.m. PST |
On the league of Augsburg site there is this image:
..which is Regiment Clare. In the Beneath the Lily Banners rulebook, there are some Irish units shown for the Williamite wars, and they have no cords on the shoulder either. As such, I would say they did not use them. |
| ogriffy | 01 Sep 2015 12:03 p.m. PST |
Very true Winston. I should have been clearer; I meant the five Irish Jacobite regiments sent from Ireland to France in 1690, that then were formed into the Irish Brigade under Lord Mountcashel. These 5 Regiments had originally been part of James II's Army in Ireland. The Irish Brigade then did recruit widely in French service, but always maintained a large contingent of Irish soldiers. |
| ogriffy | 01 Sep 2015 12:07 p.m. PST |
Thank you herkybird. The Gents over at the League of Augsburg probably can shed the best light on this. |
| Rudysnelson | 01 Sep 2015 1:44 p.m. PST |
Have you looked at the Osprey book titled Wild Geese. |
| Rudysnelson | 01 Sep 2015 1:45 p.m. PST |
Have you looked at the Osprey book titled Wild Geese. It coveRed several wars. I have five in the warehouse. |
| Oh Bugger | 01 Sep 2015 1:48 p.m. PST |
James had to transfer 5 Irish regiments to France as part of the deal to send French troops to Ireland and to equip his Irish army. I would say at that point they effectively entered French service as Louis paid their wages. That said they remained part of James's notional British establishment that would spearhead, in accordance with French policy, James's return to the throne. Their uniforms reflected this political aspiration red coats and no shoulder knots. It would not be correct to say they were French regiments until much later in their history. Nor can we say that they were always French regiments as they began life as soldiers of a British king. |
| ogriffy | 01 Sep 2015 2:13 p.m. PST |
Hello RudyNelson. Yes, I have this book, but it didn't contain the information I was looking for. |
| ogriffy | 01 Sep 2015 2:26 p.m. PST |
Hello Oh B*gger. Yes, that's what I understood after reading Michael Mcnally on the subject. Had James II won, they would most likely have been reincorporated to the English Army. Thanks for the clarification about the uniform; it makes sense. |
| Oh Bugger | 01 Sep 2015 2:30 p.m. PST |
No problem, its a great period to game. |
| ogriffy | 02 Sep 2015 9:50 a.m. PST |
Just a quick follow-up question: what was the headgear of the grenadier companies in the Irish Brigade? Did they wear the same soft broad hat as the fusilier companies (as did French infantry with the exception of Gardes Francaises), or did they have Grenadier hats similar to the English regiments?
Thank you in advance. |
| Oh Bugger | 02 Sep 2015 11:54 a.m. PST |
If the regiment in question was part of the Irish military establishment prior to the outbreak of hostilities then they will have been uniformed and equipped as their English equivelents. So for those lads grenadier caps are possible. Sapherson notes one of the Jacobite regiments that remained in Ireland were known as 'the caps'. So it seems caps were about. |
| clibinarium | 02 Sep 2015 1:43 p.m. PST |
Yes I was just reading that in John Steven's journal last night. He comments that they had caps as they were more easily had than hats. |
