"Cold War Random Forces Generator" Topic

I decided to post this here, under a title, so it doesn't get buried and lost, in case some find it useful for coming up with their Cold War Forces, randomly:

For NATO, in NW Europe, roll a 1D20 (adjust as needed, based upon what miniatures you have):

Americans – 1 – 8
British – 9 – 10
West Germans – 11 – 15
Belgians – 16
Canadians – 17
Danes – 18 – 19 (on the front lines, in the Baltics)
Dutch – 20

Not sure I have the force ratios right, based upon numbers, and positions in Western Europe (relative proximity to the front lines, and/or in later battles further west), so feel free to tweak the above as needed for your battle locations, and time period during the Cold War.

Other options to include are: Norwegians, Italians, and French.

Perhaps much less likely, are Greeks, Turks, Spanish, Portugese, in adjacent theaters.

Non-aligned possible/probable allies are: Swedes and Finns.

For the Soviets/Warsaw Pact (1D20):

Russians – 1 – 12
East Germans – 13 – 16
Poles – 17 – 18 (further from the front lines – might need to increase % chance of encounters with them, especially for amphibious landings in and around the Baltic Sea)
Czechs – 19 – 20

For the forces, I'd suggest going with either companies, and/or battalions, if playing 1:1 real vehicles/troops to miniatures ratios. You can go a little larger, like regiments, if using one vehicle/troop stand equals a platoon.

Roll 1D20:

Tank unit – 1 – 5
Recon/Scout/Cavalry unit – 6
Mechanized Infantry unit – 7 – 12
Infantry unit * – 13 – 16
Airborne/Paratroopers/Helo-borne troops ** – 17 – 18
Marines/Amphibious unit (usually only around major bodies of water – like seas, oceans, the English Channel)
Home Guard – 19 – 20

* you may swap these out for mechanized infantry/motorized infantry units, as appropriate, for the nations selected, and the time period you are gaming. Many modern infantry units now have at least truck transport, if not APCs/IFVs, but that was not always the case for some, I suspect.

** swap out marine/amphibious units for airborne/paratrooper, or Home Guard units, as appropriate/desired. If you want to have them both in the lists for your nation(s), then I suggest reducing the mech. infantry, and infantry units by one each, to permit you to roll randomly for both airborne and amphibious units at the same time.

Again, use the above as a rough guide, since I haven't run the numbers to determine if the above percentage chances are correct – could use a little tweaking, especially for some nations, but works reasonably well as a rough guide for setting up battles.

Haven't included the small, specialist units like Spetznatz, Seals, etc., so feel free to substitute them for others, or add in as extras, as desired.

Obviously, you'll also need the forces available on the charts as well, in miniature, in order to use them effectively for your games.

Note – feel free to set up your games, as desired, however, from a historical perspective, the communist (Soviets/Warsaw Pact) forces should generally have a numerical advantage of at least 3:1, so a battalion vs. a NATO company, or a company vs. a NATO platoon. Of course, in any conflict, force ratios can change hourly, daily, weekly, as well, so you have a lot of leeway with the above.

Enjoy!

Some of you may find this info useful as well (look at how few M-1 tanks were in the inventory in Europe, during the early 1980s – only 150).

Ran across this, while looking for info to tweak the charts above, I suggested:

link

A good overview of the number of divisions by nations, and type, as well as number of tanks.

Would love to see the same for IFVs/APCs if anyone runs across those, and/or listings by country for the various division numbers, cross-referenced by types, e.g. tank divisions, mech. divisions, etc., for various time periods too, e.g. late 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, early 1980s, mid-1980s, etc..

Add the Austrians to your non-aligned possible allies. Hungarians are likely in northern Italy and less possibly in southern Bavaria. If you do chose a Balkan scenario that includes Greeks and Turks, Bulgarians will be a 100% certainty. Romanians quite likely, but less of an absolute given.

I think the British should be a larger percentage with maybe 3-4 possibilities. I would also think the West Germans would consitute as many rolls if not more than the Americans. It may be better to break it up By NORTHAG and CENTAG.

NORTHAG
1-3 West German
4-6 British
7 Dutch
8 Belgians
9 Danes
10 French

CENTAG
1-4 West German
5-8 American
9 Canadians
10 French

Creating a full blown generator that factors in years would be wicked but a ton of work (and I haaaaaate doing TO&E work).

If you guys want, I'll share the army generator for Brigade Commander. It's intended to be pretty generic, not specifically cold war, but might be handy nevertheless?

Yugoslavs could end fighting either side, depending on who aggro's their border first.

Yea, I wasn't sure about that, for the Germans – they were assigned to hold four sectors, from maps I've seen. The Americans two, but it appears those were larger, and at the critical attack location of Fulda Gap, and adjacent regions.

I was wondering about the British as well.

Will have to double-check the link I provided to count up divisions, total tanks by country, etc., to get a rough idea of the ratios. Of course, they'll probably vary significantly by decade, or year, as well.

Soviets have buku divisions, but a lot of them weren't deployed in Eastern Europe, so I need to check that out as well.

Poland seems to have twice as many troops and tanks as the East Germans, but I don't know how many/if they planned to forward deploy them. I do know they were supposed to seize the Danish isles, and perhaps some of Northern West Germany with their amphibious troops.

Thanks Kyote.

I like the North and Central suggestions, so thanks for those, General.

Split into three areas

BALTAP
- Danes
- WG Pz Gren
- UKMF
- AMF
- USMC
- US Inf

NORTHAG
NL
Ge
Br
Be
US

CENTAG
US
GE
Fr
Ca

This then gives you a wider range of options for both NATO and WP units

Only slightly more than 1% of America's tanks in Europe were M1 Abrams, in 1981 – 1982.

Here's the breakdown of numbers I got off a Wiki site (hope their numbers are accurate).

Okay, so I've run the numbers, and here are the percentage breakdowns for US tanks, just in case you're interested:

Not including the USMC tanks

M48A5 – 15.54%
M60 – 13.24%
M60A1 – 49.17%
M60A2 – 4.60%
M60A3 – 12.77%
M1 – 1.28%
M551 – 3.41%
M60A1 – Marines – not included in this analysis, since they may be deployed only to coastal zones, or another region – Norway(?)

With the USMC Tanks included

M48A5 – 14.81%
M60 – 12.62%
M60A1 – 46.88%
M60A2 – 4.38%
M60A3 – 12.18%
M1 – 1.22%
M551 – 3.25%
M60A1 – Marines – 4.67%

So, I suspect you can use the above percentages to come up with your own US Tank Encounter Charts, using either percentile dice, and/or a D20, and rounding off, as needed/desired.

Would love to see numbers/percentages for the above, for the 1985/1986 timeframe, if someone has those, or runs across them, to see how the numbers change. Obviously, there'd be a much higher number of M1 tanks in the force.

I hope BF is aware of the above, and offers us a nice looking M60A1 variant for the USAREUR in their tank preview, tomorrow. A nice M48A5 model would be appreciated too.

Revised Numbers – almost counted the British Challengers "on order". Figures on an order form don't equate to firepower on the battlefield.

Hmmm, looks like tank contributions by percentages need to be tweaked a little more, based upon the Wiki link info for 1981 – 1982:

link

West Germany 23.73% (including Jagdpanzers)
America 59.58%
Britain 6.09% (not including Challengers on order, or "Armored Cars" – presumably Scorpions and Scimitars)
Canada 0.55%
Denmark 1.88%
Belgium 3.70%
Netherlands 4.47%

I didn't include France in these numbers (since they're not a NATO member), or Norway either. I will do so below.

Also not included are the armored cars for the UK, or the Challengers on order, which bumps their "tank" numbers up to about 1,900 units, and increases their percentage to about 9%. Percentage of tanks for other nations remain virtually unchanged.

Including France in the NW EU totals, but not Norway, and not counting France's AMX-30s on order (who would include those?):

West Germany 22.03% (including Jagdpanzers)
America 55.30%
Britain 5.66% (not including Challys on order, or A/Cs)
Canada 0.51%
Denmark 1.74%
Belgium 3.44%
Netherlands 4.15%
France 7.18%

Including Norway as well:

West Germany 21.84% (including Jagdpanzers)
America 54.84%
Britain 5.61% (not including Challys on order, or A/Cs)
Canada 0.51%
Denmark 1.73%
Belgium 3.41%
Netherlands 4.11%
France 7.12%
Norway 0.83%

My first posting to W. Germany was to the 3ID in 1981. I don't recall seeing a single Abrams at that time. And Marcin, if you read the above, do you see why I keep harping at you to do a 1/600 M60A1?

Those figures are worldwide holdings not just assigned to NATO or based in Europe.

Ah, I see.

So, any ideas on tank numbers for the Americans in Europe?

I'm guessing they'd be the only ones to have tanks deployed outside of Europe, other than perhaps the Canadians too.

Also includes training fleet and any held back for PDS work.
The POMCUS and reformer sirtes tell you which units needed to collect kit so the holdings could be worked out, probably not by type.

In 83 when I arrived all armor in the 1st Armored Divison was M60a3's with the Division Cav Sqdrn just getting its M1's along with the border Cav units. My second tour was with 3rd Armored Div. Starting in mid 86 all US units had either the M1 or the M1IP and were starting to convert to the M1A1. Once again starting with Div Cav Sqdrn's and Corp level ACR's

Thanks for that info, Cav!