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"Missile and Melee Combat in Ancients Games" Topic

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18 Feb 2016 1:41 p.m. PST
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Comments or corrections?

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian26 Aug 2015 8:08 p.m. PST

Should missile combat just be factored into melee combat, or do you prefer to have the two types of combat resolved separately?

Mako1126 Aug 2015 8:28 p.m. PST


JonFreitag26 Aug 2015 8:36 p.m. PST

Depends upon the ground scale of the game.

Personal logo Saber6 Supporting Member of TMP Fezian26 Aug 2015 8:47 p.m. PST

Probably factored in. Too often Missile combat starts to resemble small arms fire and not what history has recorded

normsmith26 Aug 2015 10:02 p.m. PST

There were missile units that were intended to disrupt enemy from afar and those same missile units could not really withstand melee situations with formed troops.

Lewisgunner26 Aug 2015 11:58 p.m. PST

How units cross the beaten zone in which missile fire has an effect and their level of effectiveness after covering that distance is often key to particular battles, such as Marathon, Pkataea,nCrecy, Poitiers, Agincourt. In those situations missile and melee should ge separate.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP In the TMP Dawghouse27 Aug 2015 2:02 a.m. PST

Some armies used achers and slingers as formed massed troops. While others seem to use them simply as skirmishes. And after the formed troops met for mele, the archers, slingers and javlinmen would be in and around the formed troops doing their thing.

Marshal Mark27 Aug 2015 2:41 a.m. PST

Definitely separately, except for some missile weapons such as pila that were thrown just before contact. For most other missile weapons it makes no sense to factor the results into melee combat resolution.
For example, if attacking across rough terrain there will be time for more shooting than if attacking across open ground. Without separate missile and melee resolution this would not be taken into account.

ZULUPAUL Supporting Member of TMP27 Aug 2015 3:36 a.m. PST


Viktor Renquist27 Aug 2015 3:40 a.m. PST

If you had no separate missile and melee resolution, you couldn't possibly reproduce a battle such as Carrhae … I'm not entirely sure *why* you would want to, but that isn't the point here

Personal logo etotheipi Sponsoring Member of TMP27 Aug 2015 4:56 a.m. PST

Agree with Marshal Mark. Things employed in a mix it up manner should be folded into melee. Things employed in a reach out and touch someone manner should be adjudicated separately.

aapch4527 Aug 2015 5:15 a.m. PST

I don't know, I think DBA represents this pretty well, being as "zoomed out" as it is.
Having static factors for psiloi and bows etc. Doesn't impact the game all that much.


Elenderil27 Aug 2015 5:18 a.m. PST

I'm with the consensus here Etotheipi sums it up best. If "reach and touch" weapons are not dealt with differently then use of ground becomes much less of an issue than it actually was. This would change the basic feel of the period especially in games handling defensive or delaying actions.

Martin Rapier27 Aug 2015 7:17 a.m. PST

It depends what you are trying to represent and the mechanisms you use.

Dark Knights And Bloody Dawns27 Aug 2015 8:46 a.m. PST

Depends on the ground scale used.

williamb27 Aug 2015 8:46 p.m. PST

Ground scale will definitely have an effect, though it can create a situation where light horse archers, who would avoid melee, have to make contact with troop types that would not be able to respond to their out of reach firing.

Clays Russians29 Aug 2015 9:20 p.m. PST

My zwei pfenning worth, commands and colors handles things just fine!

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