"Gaming Jade Helm 15 - what if US civil war" Topic

G'day all,

Anyone have a TO&E of the Texas State Guard?

I probably won't repaint my UH-60s black or the green berets blue, but a modern US civil war game might make a change.

For those who are not following the politics this
link
is unlikely to get me dawg housed.

I don't know if I should laugh or cry…

It is more of a staffing and disaster response type of an organization.
"The Texas State Guard consists of six Civil Affairs Regiments, two Air Wings, a Medical Brigade and a Maritime Regiment"
link

Thanks for the link – I'll dig a bit to try to find some detail – otherwise make it up. But with "regiments" with names who can complain!

TSG has a website,… as I recall, there is an air component with a few aircraft, and 4 regimental headquarters. One regiment's HQ, the 4th, is based here in Fort Worth. As a delegate to last years Texas Republican convention, I submitted a resolution that proposed that the Governor allow the Texas State Guard Reserve Militia to begin voluntary musters. The TSGRM consists of all the citizens of this state between the ages of 18-60. Most folks in Texas are heavily armed.

With the rise of separatist and "sovereign citizen" movements and several cop killings in the last few years, I suppose you could get plenty of skirmish scenarios.

CIA certainly seems worried enough about the possibility of domestic terror movements.

Cops and national guard versus various militia movements.
Get some use out of those SWAT mini's.

As far as the specific topic, I don't think there's any risk of DH'ing.
There's not, to my knowledge, any rules about conspiracy theories.

Thanks – found their website
txmf.us/texas-state-guard
Good to see that they are a well regulated militia
Pity I can't find my war gaming needs – a TOE
I suppose I could use a light infantry one :-(

The Texas State Guard aren't combat arms in spite of the civil war regimental names. They are public information specialists. Each "regiment" has between 20-40 members. Don't know much about the air and maritime units. The army version of the state guard units usually get deployed to assist with parking at public events although, on paper, they can assist the TxANG in a state emergency. They are no match for a regular army unit even a non-combat arms one. Your average high school marching band would do better in a firefight Oh and not to be mean but the TSGRM exists only in some republican delegate's imagination. Neither Perry nor Abbott has acted on such a resolution to the best of my knowledge. Now for gaming purposes, they can be whatever you want them to be, I'm just letting you know what they actually are.

As a European looking to news coming from the US, and reading what the OP linked, I simply do not understand why those politicians seem to behave like dangerous lunatics. This is at least one of the reasons I do not expect the suggestion of Mr OFM (to allow discussions of politics)realistic. As long as some of your politicians express themselves like angry children it cannot be worthwhile to try to comment on that. Fortunately, having read lots of responses on TMP over the years, there seem to be very little American poliicians amongst them… ;-))

Oh well – skirmish counter terrorist games then. Or war game the war game with red vs blue

We aren't really talking about politics here (at least I am not) Someone asked about the actual organization of the TSG and since I have some knowledge about that I answered the question. I just wanted to clarify that the TSGRM doesn't actually exist (although I suppose it could at some point). This is all in the context of specific wargaming scenarios and you can do just about anything you want to in that context although its nice to have a baseline that reflects reality. Granted that its a current event, the topic could easily spill over into forbidden political commentary, I hope it doesn't.

Thanks for all the information on the Texan units. As far as gaming a US civil war, are there parallels between the USA Volunteer-militia-national guard-regulars as existed in Spain prior to and during their last civil war?
I suppose what I'm thinking is will units loyalty split along arm, commander or regional basis or a mix?

That is a tricky one David in Coffs as we have a number of groups with similar sounding names with wildly varying capabilities.

The National Guard – These are reserve elements of the US army that double as a state militia. They are subject to federal call up and when that happens the state government loses all control over these formations. In a hypothetical civil war scenario some would probably defect to a rebel faction but I imagine the majority would stay loyal to the federal government.

The Army Reserve – These are also reserve elements of the active army but they have no role as a state militia. Again the majority of these units would probably remain loyal.

State Militia – very few states still have a true state militia that is not subject to federal call-up. These tend to be very small and poorly equipped since they rely on their home state for funding. These would be the most likely to defect in the case of a civil war depending again on how rebellious their home state was.

Home grown militia – these are bands of like-minded individuals who band together to protect themselves against a perceived threat. They have no official attachment to a government and would likely be the core of a rebel movement in a civil war. Very few home grown militia's would support the government, individuals loyal to the government would tend to join a more formal government force.

Police – Police would be a real wild card in the event of a civil war scenario. In the past, they would be very lightly armed and still primarily charged with keeping civil order so they wouldn't be a major player either way, but with the militarization of many police forces, that may longer be true. They would probably go the way of the majority in their jurisdiction.

Of course, individuals are going to go either way in dribs and drabs, we are concerning ourselves with which way a formation would tend to go since that is the way most of its equipment beyond small arms would go. For a US based scenario, I think regional loyalties and values would be the most dominant factor.

All of this is highly speculative and not meant as a commentary on anything real, just a baseline for someone doing a hypothetical wargaming scenario.

The reason that I ask is that the ADF is national with some reserve forces having a state base but unlikely to have a strong regional loyalty except perhaps for football. In such a military if it came to a civil war you would expect more of a split in unit dynamics for factional loyalty. Of course this is all very situation dependant as it relates to the causes of a civil war and so may just be too widely speculative.

Game context – I ran a multiplayer 1980's Sudan civil war where each unit had a random morale rating for each faction – spending influence points would increase the chance that the unit declares for a player with also opportunities for the unit to change during the game based on dice roll with morale and influence and similar modifiers.

Thanks DFD! Caveats noted!

David in Coffs 05 May 2015 8:38 p.m. PST
G'day all,

Anyone have a TO&E of the Texas State Guard?

I probably won't repaint my UH-60s black or the green berets blue, but a modern US civil war game might make a change.

For those who are not following the politics this
link
is unlikely to get me dawg housed.

I don't think this would get you DH'd. In fact, our first published game, Warfare in the Age of Madness, envisions this very scenario: the cover features elements from Fort Benning fighting Georgia civilian militia! :-)

And while a large scale civil war is unlikely for now, even now we're seeing armed (if not violent) confrontations between civilians and federal officials. Recently large numbers of armed supporters of an AZ rancher stopped federal officials from enforcing a court order.

If one person does that they face a SWAT team. If lots do it they become media darlings of certain networks and get support from major politicians (there are now programs of dubious legality in the works for states to sieze and sell off federal land in the west).

What makes this scenarios more interesting for wargamers is the prospect of regular forces being on both sides. You might have U.S. specops on one side and a mix of civilian and national guard troops on the other. For balance purposes that makes heavier assets available to both sides instead of being limited to "insurgents with IEDs vs tanks".

You might even have U.S. SpecOps without heavy support facing state-level tanks and IFVs.

Technically, we have a revolution every four years.

Reaper is right, TSGRM exists only in my imagination, and in Texas State Code Title 4, Executive Branch, Chapter 431, State Militia.

You mean this state code? link

Guess it slipped your attention that it was repealed in 2013. Still good fodder for a wargaming what-if.

Governor Abbott has definitely earned this, even if he's only pandering to the fringe:

Simple solution – move Jade Helm 15 to the D.C. area and play it as "Seven Days in May".

No, that's not it. I know there were some changes made. There is a reference here to "emergency militia, link Sec.437.004 ( b ) so there must be code somewhere for the reserve militia. It was probably just moved or renamed.

link

I suspect the TO&E of armed civilians wanting to hold on to their free speech rights, guns, religion, and other constitutional freedoms will be pretty substantial in Texas.

I am sure that some of my fellow Texans have noted that "Armed Forces of the United States of America" and "United Nations" both share the word, "United." That likely causes concern in some circles that either the UN or federal government is suddenly going to take over. How that could be any worse than our current legislature (maybe one of the worst in history – and that encompasses some pretty serious lows) is beyond me.

Derek, just so you know who you are trying to argue with, I spent 28 years working in Texas state government. I've worked for 6 state agencies and I have been an assistant director, a director, and a deputy commissioner. I spent several years reviewing the state code for changes so I could advise my agency on impacts and potential impacts.

It is true at one point, years ago, a reserve militia was authorized, but it never became a reality. Not a single penny has ever been allocated for this purpose and no such group I am aware of actually exists. Again, a fun topic for a what-if second civil war scenario, but little else.

I am going to drop this because I have more than proved my point and this is straying outside the scope of wargaming. I suppose it was foolish to think it wouldn't.

DFD,
I'm not sure that your description of the National Guard is quite correct. The National Guard is not a reserve force, they are the state's military/militia under command of the state's governor. There are active and reserve (hence the weekend warrior title) portions of the National Guard. In order to be called to active duty for federal duty, they must be called to active duty on specific orders. This also has to be approved by the governor. Your description , to me anyway, sounded like the Guard was a federal component in the state. Apologies if I am wrong.

Their function as a reserve component of the federal armed forces takes precedence over their function as a state militia. A governor has no say whatsoever in a federal call-up of the National Guard. That is how President Kennedy neutralized the Alabama National Guard (by federalizing them) when George Wallace tried to use them to prevent black students from enrolling in an Alabama state university during the civil rights movement. At the time, there was a lot of speculation as to whether the Alabama National Guard would honor its federal commitment or not. In the end they obeyed their oaths of commissioning and enlistment and helped the federal government keep the peace and even escorted the students in question to the campus on federal orders. hmmmm having a hard time figuring out how to use that in a wargaming scenario though.

Don Corleone, "Just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in"

I'm actually really enjoying this thread…great, creative idea. I so appreciate the tone and responsiveness…very informative. THANKS

Thank VIS – I'll have a look at Age of Madness.
And for those who would like to game a civil war in the UK, a background could be after the current election a hung parliament that is intolerable to the various nationalist have Scottland, Wales and Northern Ireland all declaring independence and the UK military splitting. Critical will be who's side the Isle of Mann joins.

Thanks DFD – very interesting about the National Guard and Federal orders. It is something that isn't clear to those who's military are not structured that way. For Australia before federation the States had their own forces, after they became Commonwealth forces but still had regional focus. After WW2 and Vietnam state identification, apart from for football, is lesser that nationalism and so would me a civil war would be less likely – except by those Sandgropers in the West ;-D

Jade Helm 15 – what could possibly go wrong with members of the military running around in civilian areas, especially in areas that aren't used to having a military presence? Some serviceman makes a local (any color or background) angry and you could have a scene out of Southern Comfort.

Not a conspiracy theorist, but this "planned" exercise reeks of poor planning. I live in Houston and we have at least one weekly occurrence of someone driving down the wrong side of one of our freeways drunk. Daily occurrences of thieves running from cops and going through anything in their way while usually firing their weapons in any direction. I'm pretty sure race relations will take a massive hit with mainly white soldiers moving military vehicles through one of the wards. Not sure what the president is thinking with this one.

From a gaming standpoint I would add the influence of gangs and narcotic traffickers. Mexican, Salvadoran and large indigenous US-based gangs have fairly high numbers in major TX cities. Also add people smugglers who are fairly well armed and probably would look at the military as a threat.

I've been thinking – sort of ;-) and he is a rough skirmish scenario generator.
Take a deck of cards and split it into suits – the US military player get to select either Spades or Clubs secretly, the OPFOR player secretly selects Hearts or Diamonds.
The players each draw two random cards from their decks
The first card is how many figures they will be using
The second card will be their mission
Note that the suit chosen will determine if your forces are lawful or criminal
Hearts and Clubs = lawful
Diamonds and Spade = illegal
Feel free to flesh it out – here are some examples
2C & 7C = 2 US military acting lawfully mission Check point – stop and search as part of war game add 2 police who are there to assist
9D & AD = 9 civilians on table are Criminals mission Zombies!
Lawful military and OPFOR have limited real small arms ammo as they have MILES to fight it out with the other side. Which will make it hard if the other side is criminal

Reaper, you're right, this can spill over into politics. I'm happy for you that you feel like you have " proved your point", whatever that was. Thank you for making me aware of the change, and for your years of service to our state.

Thank you reaper for your expertise and knowledge.
An update – with Chuck Norris joint the "concerned citizens" does this mean we can add the Texas Rangers in? Or do we just add Chuck in?
link

Don't forget about Ted Nugent, he's here too, and very vocal. He and Norris could form the basis of a "celebrity platoon". Just think of all the modifiers you could tack on to that one, +3 or more for hand to hand, blasting enemy units with high powered Rock and Roll sound waves, etc.,.

I would use Vietnamese figures for the local militia. Paint the conical hats silver. Wearing a silver hat prevents government drones from reading your thoughts. They do that, you know.

Don't forget the black helicopters. Of course most of the ones you see in the U.S. outside of the major training areas are being flown by the National Guard. And all Army helos look black from a distance.

The deck of cards idea is not a bad way to randomize things

Glad you like the cards – of course all drawn cards are secret until the end and you get to have fun working out the missions. Good if you can have a game master for hidden and random as well as non player figures etc. but friends can have fun setting it up to look good and play interesting
For urban don't forget the bank and armoured car. Suburban can have the meth lab. Rural can have a compound. While the wilds can have that lonely house…

For multiplayer games each can have a full deck of cards – thus making it difficult for all – but you do have to declare if you are blue or red otherwise there would be too many blue on blue. But you can have blue legal and illegal at the start – if so the blue legal will need to act against the blue illegal as soon as they become aware of that. At the end of the day loyalty to legal trumps "allegiance to side" – of course that doesn't apply to illegal.

Blue includes anyone in a uniform with a blue arm band
Red includes those in or out of a uniform with a red arm band or otherwise oppose the blue

How to handle armed civilians who do not belong to a player at the start?
When they get drawn into the blue vs red – draw a card from a full deck for alignment but their mission is survival – so they won't shoot unless they perceive that they are being attacked.

For civilian "non-player elements" see A Clear and Present Madness, our expansion for Age of Madness. You can actually field unarmed civilians as part of your force.

link

"NEW BATTLEFIELD THREATS

CIVILIAN NON-PLAYER ELEMENT
Your force may include up to 2 Civilian Non-Player Elements (NPE). Each Civilian NPE uses 1 of your 2 Battlefield Threat slots. One Civilian NPE costs 100 points. A Civilian NPE has no combat ability or hit points, it blocks all line of fire but not line of sight, it may not be shot at or assaulted, it moves as an infantry element and is otherwise subject to the NonPlayer Element (NPE) trait. To remove a Civilian NPE from the battlefield a core element must perform a Clear Casualty action treating the Civilian NPE as a casualty marker except that no Victory Points are earned for clearing the Civilian NPE."

In the game they serve as shields for insurgents facing superior force. The expansion also incudes rules for third parties such as news crews and "green forces".

Thanks VIS!

The Texas National Guard is approximately 26,000 persons. They are combined administratively under the Texas Military Forces at Camp Mabry (Austin) with the Texas State Guard, Texas Air National Guard, and Texas Army National Guard, all commanded by MG John Nichols, Texas Adjutant General (TAG), (Former Air National Guard Commander) Joint Military Forces Command (JMF). Texas National Guard Joint Force Headquarters coordinates all other HQ units, Air, State, and Army) located at Camp Mabry.
txmf.us
link
Units of the Texas Army National Guard (MG Smith):
- Texas Army National Guard Joint Force Headquarters (TARNG, Bldg 8 Camp Mabry, Austin TX, TX JMF command here)
-36th Infantry Division (HQ at Camp Mabry, Composite Infantry units around the state, Combat ready, HQ deployed Iraq 2010-11; Units have deployed to Iraq, Afghanistan)
-Medical Command
-Office of the State Surgeon
-Recruiting and Retention Battalion (Administrative, not BN strength)
-State Army Aviation Office
-136th Regiment (CA) (RTI) Recruiting and Training, Offices at Camp Mabry, Training facility at Bastrop, TX)
-Army Ground Safety Office (Camp Mabry)
-Training Centers Command
-101st Information Operations Battalion (71st Theatre Information Operations Group) 101st IOB supports Army deployments Africa and South America, HQ at Camp Mabry, Units in Austin and San Antonio, TX)
-176th Engineer Brigade (Combat ready)
-1st Battalion (Airborne), 143rd Infantry Regiment (Only Co A – understrength)
- 71st Troop Command – (prepares Soldiers and units for Federal mobilization)
- Joint Task Force 71 (JTF71 Maneuver Enhancement Brigade) (An ad-hoc formation trained in rescue, communications, military policing, urban warfare, urban disaster response)

Texas State Guard (MG Betty); Texas State Guard (TXSG) is to provide mission-ready military forces to assist state and local authorities in times of state emergencies (Previous assistance in civil affairs, communications, and in the past law enforcement):
(Regiments are understrength and number more like companies) gotxsg.com

-HQ (at Camp Mabry) MG Rodriguez Commanding, former TAG
TXSG Army Component (BG Palmer commanding)
1st Regt (Col Carag) – 2 BN
2nd Regt – 2BN
4th Regt – 4 BN
8th Regt – 3 BN
19th Regt (Signals) Dallas – 2 BN
39th Regt – 2 BN
TXSG Medical Component (BG Cohen commanding): 3 BNs (1 full strength in San Antonio)
TXSG Air Component (BG Prince commanding):
-4th Air Wing (communications support assets (human and electronic); a uniformed Force Presence; and Weather Observation teams in the North Texas)
-5th Air Wing (Communications and uniform support to ANG and TXMF, Texas emergency support) Subordinate unit: 447th Air Support Group
TXSG Maritime Component (BG Smallwood commanding) : 3 BN and Band
Texas Air National Guard (MG Wisian commanding) Some 3,000 airmen:
136th Airlift Wing (AW)
147th Reconnaissance Wing (RW), at Ellington Field in Houston, TX, flying ISR assets (Predators).
149th Fighter Wing (FW), (Col. John F. Kane commanding)

Domestic Operations Task Force (BG Hamilton commanding) An ad-Hoc unit associated with JTF7

Thanks MDC!

Getting back to the main point.

I am told by persons in the know about such things that one of the most "war-gamed" things the Armed forces does is a civilian uprising against the government. This uprising is never staged as a proxy of a foreign power but purely home-grown.

They tell me that the result is always the same. The insurgents win in 6 to 8 weeks. The armed forces it seems, always joins the insurgents. They're not going to fire on their family, friends, and neighbors, or their former buddies in the National Guard.