"Khurasan previews 18mm Qajar Persians" Topic

Been working on these a while and they've finally moved close to release -- 18mm "Napoleonic" Persians who can also be used for much later in the Qajar period, as the uniform and weaponry remained unchanged for a long time.

This will be a new and unique opponent for your Napoleonic Russians and Ottomans, as well as against the players of the "great game" in Central Asia in the 19th century.

Here's the first batch -- western trained and equipped "new infantry" and artillery. These were good troops, who stood up well to their nemeses the Russians and were a decisive advantage over that other nemesis, the Ottoman army, which had foolishly got rid of its own new infantry. There was even a unit of renegade Russians which was seen as something of a guards unit and had quite a fearsome reputation!

Sculpted by Mike Broadbent.

Sorry that the images are a bit mixed up -- the drummer from the infantry command set is hanging out with those hep cats, the artillerists. I have been accused, with some justification, of previewing models and not releasing them -- these are moving forward, going to the caster and painter today, and I hope to have them available within a month and a half or so.

Now that is interesting! Very unique.

I think I'd rate the line troops as better Prussian landwehr, or perhaps second rate Austrian line, with one unit the same as first rate Russian line. Then there would be clouds of grenzer type skirmishing foot and Cossack-like cavalry, with batteries of second rate artillery equipped with British, French, and maybe a few Russian or Ottoman guns.

The line troops gave the Persians a real edge over the Ottomans at the time, allowing the Persians to defeat much larger Ottoman armies.

Hi there

I should send Mike my research (includes some unpublished items and stuff trawlled from academic journals) as I'm probably not going to be sculpting any time soon.

Not that you asked for comments, but the hats look taller than any I've seen. I'd give the infantry officer with sword a magnifient beard, they were allowed to keep them. And probably a cape / cloak for a senior infantry officer.

The Persians got their European advisors to build horse artillery only, the crews are shown with hussar-style braid on chest.

While there were periods of scrounging guns, they soon enough had factories producing guns in Persia under European instruction.

I wouldn't necessarily describe their guns as 'second rate' there is a record of a bunch of 12 pounders playing a significant role in blunting an Ottoman attack in a battle.

Yes, they would probably lose a fire-fight to better organised westerners – the European observers often comment that the Persian soldiers generally were tough and brave but their officers hopeless.

Regards

David F Brown

Hi there,

Here is an excerpt from a draft booklet of my research, it may give players some idea of the actions possible with the figs.

David F Brown

Timeline of events, battles, wars, treaties concerning Persia or neighbours

Russia, Georgia, 1783
Treaty of Georgievski, alliance between Catherine II (the Great) of Russia and Erekle (Heraclius) II of Georgia.

Russia, Baku, 1795
Persians under Agha Muhammad Khan Qajar capture the city / Khanate of Baku on the west coast of the Caspian Sea. Baku was captured by the Russians from Persia in 1723, who in turn had captured it from the Turks in 1603, the Turks had seized it from Persia in 1587.

In the 18th Century the Khanate was either independent or semi-independent with some Khans pro-Russian, some pro-Persian and some subject to neighbouring Khanates.

Khanate of Karabakh, 1795, summer
Aga Muhammad Khan Qajar attacks the Karabakh Khanate (situated near Georgia and Armenia) and its fortified capital city of Shusha. The Persian army, reportedly 80,000 strong, was unable to capture the city and maintained a siege for 33 days. The successful defenders in the city under Ibrahim Khalil Khan mustered 15,000 fighters including women. Dagestanians and Christian Armenian residents aided the Khan, other forces conducted guerrilla operations in the surrounding country.

Georgia, Khanate of Ganja (Ganjeh), 1795, September 8-11
Battle of Krtsanisi – Persians defeat Georgians near Tbilisi, the Georgian capital, it is thereafter sacked. Khanate of Ganja joins its Persian suzerain in the invasion.

One (Georgian-exile) Source records a Battle at Tiblisi in May 1795, noting that the Persians deployed for battle, at least initially, with cavalry supporting infantry from behind to bolster their morale.

Russia, Baku, 1796 Spring
Catherine II of Russia invades Transcaucasia. Baku surrenders without contest to General Zubov's 6000 troops and a flotilla (June 13th). General (Count) Pavel Tsitsianov governs Baku.

Russia, 1796, November 17
Catherine II of Russia dies, Paul I succeeds.

Khanate of Karabakh, 1797
Agha Muhammad Shah Qajar's second attack on Karabakh proves successful, his artillery is noted as causing significant defender casualties and Ibrahim Khalil Khan goes into exile in Dagestan.
Aga Muhammed Shah was assassinated a few days after his success and the new King, Fath Ali Shah, allows Ibrahim-Khalil Khan to return as part of a general settlement.

Russia, Baku, 1797, March
Czar Paul I withdraws Russian forces from the Caucuses, troops leave Baku in March.

Georgia, Avar Khanate, 1798 (or some time from 1798-1800?)
Avars invade Georgia, in a planned co-operation with Persia, however the Persians mobilisation is tardy and the Avars are repulsed before they can co-ordinate.

Russia, Georgia, 1800, December
Russians under Tsar Paul invade and annex Georgia.

Russia, 1801, March 11
Tsar Paul assassinated, Alexander I succeeds.

Britain, 1801
Anglo-Persian Treaty of 1801.

Avar Khanate, 1801
Death of the Avar Khanate's successful ruler Umma Khan under whose reign they expanded their territories and dominated the Khanates / states of Shaki, Quba, and Shirvan.

Avar Khanate, c.1803
The Khanate was under Russian control by 1803, in 1822 the Russians abolish the Khanate.

Russia, Khanate of Ganja, 1803-04
Russians (under general Tsiatsianov) from their base in Georgia invade Ganja in the eastern Caucuses / Azerbaijan, the Khanate was a Persian subject semi-independent state, it falls on January 3rd (or 15th), 1804, after a two month siege and bombardment, Javad Khan Qajar and his sons are killed in the defence. Ganja is formally ceded to Russia as part of the treaty of Gulestan in 1813??.

Russia, 1804-1813
Russo-Persian War

Russa, Khanate of Karabkh, 1805, May 14
Treaty of Kurkachay, Tsiatsianov secures the submission of Ibrahim Khalil Khan of Karabakh. The Khan is killed later this year, reputedly by Russians in return for some act of treachery.

Herat, Afghanistan, 1805
Firuz Mirza of Herat attacks the Persian fortress of Ghorian, he is defeated and pursued back to Herat.

Russia, Baku, 1806, February 8
General Tsiatsianov killed outside the walls of Baku. Several different versions of the events are recorded; one that he rode to the walls of the city accompanied by only a few aides to demand its submission and was shot by the defending troops of Huseyngulu Khan (Husayn Quli Khan). Another version has him stabbed and killed by the Khan following the city's surrender. Another has him shot by the Khan's nephew during negotiations and Prince zxzx killed beside him.

The tale continues with Tsiatsianov's head being sent to the Persian King Fath Ali Shah in Tehran. In an earlier incident an Islamic scholar, Mirza Mohammad Akhbari, reportedly promised to kill Tsitsianov by magic (beheading a wax ‘voodoo' doll is mentioned). Uneasy about possible supernatural power Fath Ali Shah exiled Mirza to Iraq.

Russia, Baku, 1806, September
Russian general Bulgakov occupies Baku, Huseyngulu Khan goes into exile.

France, 1807, May 4
Treaty of Finckenstein, alliance between France and Persia. France recognised Persia's claim to Georgia and parts of the Caucasus not under Persian control. France agrees to send arms and instructors to Persia (4000 infantry, 10,000 muskets and 50 guns are promised, if not actually delivered), in return Persia announces hostility to Britain and agrees to help any French action against British India.

Russia, Nakhichevan Khanate, 1808
Russian army led by general Gudovich occupies Nakhichevan. The troops are withdrawn and the Khanate returned to Persian rule in 1818 as part of the Treaty of Gulistan. (Many of the passes through the Caucuses are in the Khanate).

Turkey, Georgia, Imereti, Russia, 1810
Combined Persian-Ottoman invasion of Georgia, aided by Solomon II the exiled King of Imereti (a small ‘Georgian' state in the Caucuses to the south west of Georgia) and Leon, nephew of Alexander the Georgian King. The Ottoman army fails to arrive on time and the Persians are defeated in a night assault by the Russians near Akhalkalaki in southern Georgia.

Russia, 1812, October 19-20
Battle at Aslanduz, Persian army, including the Russian Bagaderan deserter battalion surround and defeat Russians of General Kotlyarevski.

Russia, 1813
Treaty of Gulistan ends Russo-Persian war, the treaty sees most of the Caucasus gained by Russia.

Herat, Afghanistan, 1817
Hasan Ali Mirza, son of Fath Ali Shah, defeats Herat in punishment for their new attacks on the fort of Ghorian

Khorasan and Khiva, 1817
Revolt in Khorasan and the Khan of Khiva invades in support of Afghanistan.

Afghanistan, 1818
Hasan Ali Mirza defeats the Afghan leader Fatteh Khan. Toward the end of the campaign Fath Ali Shah arrives in support with a massive army.

European Turkey, 1820
Revolts in Montenegro, Wallachia, Bosnia.

Turkey, 1821-1823
Turco-Persian War

(Russians give encouragement and clandestinely even monetary support to Abbas Mirza in his conflict with the Turks).

Turkish Morea, 1822
Revolt against Tukish rule in Morea – inspired by earlier raid by Greek exiles over the River Pruth in Beser (Moldovia).

Turkey, 1822, May
Battle of Toprah Kaleh, Mohamad Amin Rauf Pasha commands Turk forces, perhaps over 40,000 strong, many apparently recently raised near Constantinople and of dubious quality. The fort of Toprah Khaleh was held by troops of Husein Khan, ruler of the Khanate of Erevan – a Persian subject. The fort was blockaded by one of the three Turkish army corps. Abbas Mirza concerned that the fort might not hold out moved to offer battle with perhaps 20,000 men (including 4000 regulars including one guard unit and Russian Bagadaran ) and 7000 reinforcements arriving during the battle, against the Turks 40,000 to 60,000 men.

P96 description of battle
Include a pic + phases

Persian advance to the Turk provincial capital of Erzerum is cancelled after an outbreak of cholera decimates the army.

Turkey, 1823, July 23
Treaty of Erzerum ends Turco-Persian war.

Russia, 1826-1828
Russo-Persian War

Russia, 1826, September, 13-14
Battle of Yelizavetopol, ??????? Russia defeats Persia? Bagaderan unit deployed in Persian centre-right, part of the Guards – with a Persian Guards unit.

Russia, Nakhichevan Khanate, 1827 July 14-22
Russian forces under General Paskevich attack the fortress of Abbasabad on July-14, they are repulsed with heavy loss and then mount a siege. The defender Ehsan Khan Kangarlu negotiates the fort's surrender on 22 July – he is later made governor of the area, and given a Russian military rank when the Khanate becomes a Russian possession in 1828 with the Treaty of Turkmanchy.

Avar Khanate / Muslim Imamate, 1828-64
Uprising of Avars against Russians inspired by misrule and / or enthusiasm for hard line Islamic fundamentalist religious leaders Ghazi Mohammed (1828–32), Gamzat-bek (1832–34) and Imam Shamil (1834–59) who perpetuate a guerrilla war.

Kurdistan, 1830-32
Kurds of Khorasan (and Turkmenia) rebel – Persian forces sent to quell. Seige of Kurds at Kuchana, 1832.

Herat, 1833
Persians unsuccessfully siege the city.

Khorasan, 1835
Persians campaigning against rebel Uzbeks, Turkomen, and Kurds.

Kurdistan, 1835(?)
Kurds ambush some Persian forces in the mountains, some Persian units rout, but the Russian Bagaderan forms a square to repel Kurdish cavalry.

Turkmenistan, 1836
Persians campaigning in the area.

Herat, 1837-38
Persians attacking again.

Heart, Afghanistan, 1838-1841
First Herat War

Regards

David F Brown

Royal forces, Irre

So, these guys wouldn't be good for Persians circa 1890s?

And how much more business do we need to throw your way before we make it a full-time job for you, K?

Yes please !!!!

I have a 15mm Qajar army in the painting queue to take on my Russians. Currently using an odd mix of colonial arab types and some Russo-Turkish wars Turks with minor mods.

These Khurasan sculpts are perfect for the Qajar line troops !!

The more the merrier .. looking forward to adding some Khurasan Qajars as soon as they are ready to go.

Not that you asked for comments, but the hats look taller than any I've seen.

and from the Anglo Persian War

I wouldn't necessarily describe their guns as 'second rate' there is a record of a bunch of 12 pounders playing a significant role in blunting an Ottoman attack in a battle.

Artillery doesn't have to be first rate to do that. I would not rank the persian artillerists on par with french or british artillery.

Those are really interesting. I love seeing different "Napoleonic" figures. I will probably get a set of these.

Does anybody have flag references?

Colin

Does anybody have flag references?

The 1979 Iranian flag shows a direct linage to Qajar and even earlier Persian flags.

A few to choose from here :

1886 flag :

Some older flags that follow the same theme – A motif of sun + some sort of creature in the centre of the flag :

Note from the pics that there is a LOT of scope to add a crazy mix of different figures to make a very colourful and original Qajar army.

Also from the large battlescene prints, there is a crazy array of different jacket and trouser colours for each unit – even the Euro trained regulars are in a variety of different kit.

The artillery only appear in green jackets with red facings in the pictures, but the rest of the units I reckon that you can get away with some bizarre artistic interpretation on a unit by unit basis, and still claim to be authentic.

Fun !

Damn, why did you have to go and do that, just when I was promising to not start any new projects. I have both Russians and British in the Napoleonic period, this might be too much to resist.

ok, now I really want some of these.

In addition to what has been already said:

1. The hats were not stiffened/had no internal structure. That means that you would end up with lots of different shapes.

2. The Artillery of 1810 plus was excellent and likely the most europeanized branch of the Persian Nezam Jedid (which by the way means new order in Farsi). It's even said that they were supposed to be clean shoven, but I seriously doubt that.

3. The figures shown would work from about 1806 to 1840.

Some uniform plates that I made recently:

Line infantry:
link

Militia Infantry:
link

Artillery (incl. regular and irregular Camel-gunners)
link

Line cavalry:
link

Kurdish cavalry:
link

Persian Flag of a northern Khanate:
link

Totally interesting. Thanks.
Don't we love TmP even more when we find such infos there?

Whenever I will finish the medieval search, I will look for the Russian histories for these battles. Yes finally the 1812 Russians can fight something else than The French Army.

Does anyone have info on the OOB of the Qajar's during any of those battles with the Russians or Turks? It seems as though the army would have a core of regular troops and a lot of irregulars troops to supplement (perhaps in a 50/50 ratio).

Yes, we'll definitely be making the irregulars as well. We can then modify the irregulars by changing their hats, which is the best way to tell which era 17-19th C. Persian troops are from. They seem to have been required to wear the headgear of the ruling tribe at the time. So we will be able to offer Safavid armies and those of Nader Shah with head swaps.

But one thing at a time! This is not what you'd call a mainstream Napoleonic range. I'd like to see if there's any interest whatsoever before I take on more sculpts.

Man, I've got to get me one of those hats!

Yes, Mike nominated it for "silliest hat of the year" when he was making these, but actually when you see them massed up, like in the image above from the Anglo-Persian War, they look quite impressive.

So how long do you think it will be until you can take my money?

(And I thought I was free from Khurasan when I moved away from 15mm sci-fi!)

I hope to have them available within a month and a half or so.

Maybe some cooperation on doing articles on this would generate interest? After all, most of us have no clue at all beyond the "well Persians and Russian did fight a bit" somewhere between 1700 and 1900…

E.g if you have a list of Russian books that can be perused in the Ru State library…

hiya

>>>>>>>>
Does anyone have info on the OOB of the Qajar's during any of those battles with the Russians or Turks? It seems as though the army would have a core of regular troops and a lot of irregulars troops to supplement (perhaps in a 50/50 ratio).
>>>>>>>>>>>>

This is a big question, with a lot or variability, as with other non-Europeans who were modernising their armies there were some rulers who were enthusiastic about the reforms and some who prefered the old ways.

IRRC one a-typical force was 25,000 tribal cavalry and nothing much else.

With all this interest it looks like I should go off and finish my booklet.

Regards

David F Brown

Hiya

>>>>>>>>>>
Mr Kurasan said

I hope to have them available within a month and a half or so.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

Superb, I guess I'll be ordering 120-200 of them, and then I can see if I still think the hats are a bit tall.

(The third pic you posted is new to me, many thanks for that too.)

Regards

David F Brown

Hi there

Here's the intro to my unfinished booklet

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The Persian Army of the
Napoleonic Era

This compilation covers the Persian military from 1796 to 1857, ie from the founding of the Qajar dynasty to the 2nd Herat War and Anglo Persian Wars.

Calling the period Napoleonic is probably a western conceit, an Iranian might describe the period as early Qajar, however the name was chosen to reflect that the diplomacy and wars in Europe echoed both politically and militarily in nations far removed from Paris, London or Moscow.

By way of example see zxzxz who outlines the French diplomatic moves to have the Ottomans and Persians both attack Russia as distractions to the main French effort through Poland in 1812 and indeed Britain's efforts to stop those moves.

The rise of European nation states powered by the first rumblings of the industrial revolution saw a renewed phase of colonisation where non-European powers were exposed as possessing an inadequate military capacity to resist such manoeuvres.

The non-European nations were mindful of the ‘western secret' even if they could not exactly quantify it.

The military response by them was to recognise that their often feudal, part-time and ramshackle armies were outclassed by Europeans and to begin a process of building ‘regular' standing armies with new weapons in imitation of western forces.

The non-European process of modernisation was widespread; imitation forces were developed with freelance or foreign-government supplied European military advisors, in Ottoman Turkey, Egypt, the Maghreb states, Persia, Afghanistan, Bokara and other Central Asian states, in Mysore, Manipur and other Indian or Southeast Asian nations.

Context

In the three centuries preceding the period under study there were several attempts by the Persians to modernise their army by introducing western gunpowder weapons and training.

In the 15th century Venice sent (or promised to send) firearms, artillery and instructors to Persia, presumably to aid against their common foe, the Ottoman Turks. It's not clear how many of the promised arms, if any, made it to Persia – and the Ottomans were famously using massed gunpowder weapons to score victories over them into the 16th century.

The first Safavid ruler, Shah Esmail, some time after 1514 formed a force of tofangcis (‘musketeers' both matchlocks and flintlocks were used) (1) and instituted a tofangci-basi, ‘musketeer commander'.

The Safavids used bombs and hand grenades (ḵompâra) The latter were made of a clay pear-shaped jar with a hole and a fuse. Rockets (műđak) were used as well. (1)

By 1517, Esmâîl's army is said to have included 8,000 musketeers, and Venetian reports from 1521 and 1522 speak of 12,000 and 15,000 to 20,000 arquebusiers. (1)

Persian artillery of this period was either captured or locally produced. Those produced locally were reported by Europeans as being of modest quality and sometimes supported by scanty supplies of ammunition.

Toward the end of the 16th century and into the 17th, Shah Abbas also undertook a period of modernisation of his military. He was aided in 1598 by Englishmen Anthony and Robert Sherley with 14 (or 26) advisors who helped reform all branches of the army – the re-unification of Persia and a victorious war in Afghanistan suggest the reforms were successful.

In the 1720s to mid century Frenchmen and other Europeans could be found in charge of Persian artillery.

The next significant Persian efforts at modernising their military were by Nadir Shah of the Afsharid dynasty, the man sometimes indeed called Persia's Napoleon.

Nadir Shah campaigned with success in Afghanistan, Pakistan and North India, against the Ottoman Turks and Russians in the Caucuses. His army included new modern artillery and infantry units wearing red uniforms, armed with muskets and trained by Europeans.

On Nadir's death the nation declines and his army is not maintained.

This looks the pattern of the previous two centuries where a stable and energetic Shah modernises and strengthens his army only to have it degraded thereafter – the lack of underlying permanent institutions meant the next able ruler has to rebuild almost from scratch.

Regards

David F Brown.

Hiya

Here's some more of my incomplete scribblings.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Royal forces, Irregulars and Semi-regulars

In addition to the European-style troops formed from 1807, Persian forces consisted of the Shah's or a senior potentate's guard or personal troops, provincial or city-based militia, tribal troops and subject or allied states' forces.(5)

The Shah's personal troops include guard units of gholams, 2000-4000 cavalry that were an elite of highly paid cavalry of two types. The gholam-shah (‘shah's servants or retainers') were the highly paid elite riders armed with carbine, pistols, and sabres and possibly uniformed. The gholam-tofangchis (‘musket-servants') were armed with long-barreled firearms equipped with rests, these men were expected to dismount to shoot. This unit was a lesser status than the former but still paid at a higher rate than others and supplied by the state with wheat fodder.

The joushan-pushan (‘dressed in armour') were cavalry supplied with arms and horses by the state, they were paid in cash and fodder. At one point (1812-14?) we hear of the Shah accompanied by 4000 such cavalry, in 1801 10,000 of them are part of an army and the Frenchman Drouville estimated there were 20,000 throughout the kingdom.

The joushan-pushan were armed with 13-14 foot lances and sabres (and apparently no firearms), they were clad with an iron helmet, mail coat, round shield and vambrace for the right arm. These troops decline in numbers throughout the 19th Century, by the 1820s there were fewer than 10,000 and they are gone by the 1830s.

The pishkhaneh were a specialist transport-logistics unit that would advance before a major army group to secure a camp area, supply water for the camp, establish accommodation (tents) and where necessary build fortifications.

The Persians refered to their irregular forces by several names including Lashkar, Qoshun, Sepah and Charik.

David F Brown

A "wargamers guide" would be very handy for this unusual army and its conflicts.

Thanks evilgong – that is superb info.

Khurasan >

Yes, Mike nominated it for "silliest hat of the year" when he was making these …

(pic on the right) Persian Light Camel Artillery, c 1810

Dont know about you, but I am thinking that I really really really NEED some Napoleonic Persian light camel artillery ?

from – link

link

More here : TMP link

I have been accused, with some justification, of previewing models and not releasing them

Yes you have, by me using the same light touch as a German jazz band.

However, to the topic at hand. No mention has been made of the excellent publication "Unknown Armies" Volume 2 Persia/Iran by Peter Abbott published in 1989 by Raider Books, a division of Raider Games,119 Elmete Way, Leeds, LS8 2ND. It's light on the history portion, but it contains Organization, Uniforms and Insignia from Pre-Qajar Persia up to The Iranian National Liberation Army from 1987. A good source for painting those miniatures.

No mention either about the range produced by Irregular Miniatures in 15mm.

irregularminiatures.co.uk

Scroll down the left hand column and highlight Indian Mutiny. Scroll half way down the page until you hit Persians. They are much closer to true 15mm figures. You wouldn't want to mix them with 18mm Khurasan in the same unit.

Hi there

>>>>>>>>
Cyrus the Great said

No mention has been made of the excellent publication "Unknown Armies" Volume 2 Persia/Iran by Peter Abbott published in 1989 by Raider Books,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

He got hold of some scarce info for that booklet, it is a useful one to have for anybody delving deeply into the topic.

It includes a neat line drawing of a zamburak regular standard- bearer with a square flag showing the national lion and sun design.

(I'm guessing by the shape of the chap's hat that the original source is related to the 2500 year parade.)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
No mention either about the range produced by Irregular Miniatures in 15mm.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

Their zamburak looks neat (but don't they all), interesting that they have three variation figs for the militia man with club. The only reference I've seen for this is a Brit line drawing from the 1857 where he's described as a militia / levy from Kazbin (a town west of Tehran)- the chap does look impressive in hat, (possibly) mail, shield, sword and long-handled mace.

Does anybody know more about these troops?

Regards

David F Brown

I have combined the translations by Mark Conrad with the illustrations from a Russian version for the following articles:
Part 1: The Persian Regular Army, 19th Century, by Aleksandr Kibovskii and Vadim Yegorov. Infantry, officers, flags, musicians & medals.
Part 2: The Persian Regular Army, 19th Century, by Aleksandr Kibovskii and Vadim Yegorov. Cavalry, artillery & zambureks.
warfare2.likamva.in/Persia/19/Russian_Deserters_In_The_Persian_Army.htm

MIRROR SITE:
Part 1: The Persian Regular Army, 19th Century, by Aleksandr Kibovskii and Vadim Yegorov. Infantry, officers, flags, musicians & medals.
Part 2: The Persian Regular Army, 19th Century, by Aleksandr Kibovskii and Vadim Yegorov. Cavalry, artillery & zambureks.
warfare.meximas.com/Persia/19/Russian_Deserters_In_The_Persian_Army.htm

Pictures of irregular cavalry: A Persian warrior on horseback, c.1821, Persian Man on horseback, c.1830 & Faridun goes to capture Zahhak
& irregular infantry: Portrait of Gayumars, the first Persian king,
depicted as a Qajar infantryman, c1820

MIRROR SITE:
Illustrations of Persian 19th Century Soldiers

Druzhina
Persian Illustrations of Costume & Soldiers

Speaking of the flags, I had to laugh at the green one. I was fooling around with some cardboard tubing to make gasoline storage tanks for a Flames of War game with British vs Rusdians in the Persian oil fields. I used that exact design and color for the … Was it Anglo Persian Oil Company?
The animal is a lion holding a sword, the emblem of the late Shah's Pahlevi dynasty.

Lots of interesting information but army organization is difficult to come by, I am going to take a stab at a typical army organization, this is a guess at best:

20-25% – Europeanized Infantry – Rated equal with standard Russian or French. Using the troops in the first post

25% – Irregular infantry – tribal levies, rated as conscripts.

10% – Guard Cavalry – rated on par with European Cuirassiers or elite cavalry.

20-30% – Regular light cavalry – Similarly rated as European Uhlans or Hussars

20-30% – Irregular Tribal Cavalry – rated similar to Cossacks.

1-2 Batteries of Guns.

Hi there

For JJMicromegas

Here's an orbat on the eve of the War with the Turks in the 1820s, It represents prince Abbas Mirza's force so does not include the Shah's guard units or mailed lancer chaps.

9,400 regular infantry in 9 'regiments', one of which is the 1000 Bagaderan Russian 'foreign legion' and one is a 1,200-man 'Light infantry' unit.

500 regular lancers (ethinic Afghans)

6 x units of 6 guns (including but not necesarily all Horse Arty)

100 x Zamburaks

10,000 militia / irregular infantry

12,000 militia / irregular cavalry

+ a force of the allied /semi-independent ruler of Erevan composing

1000 x regular infantry
2000 x militia /irregular infantry
2000 x Kurdish cavalry

Abbas could raise a further 8000 Irregular / militia cavalry (and the same number of foot?)

Erevan could raise a further 3,500 Irreg foot and 1500 Irreg cavalry – presumably both lots of additional troops are left behind for home defence or as a reserve.

I think there may be a 'guard' unit lurking among the regular foot, or they could be additional troops arriving during the campaign, the artillery is probably 6 pounders but may include the 12-pounder unit.

I haven't really gathered my thoughts on troop quality, I'm trying to re-read and re-find some primary sources and sift out biased reporting.

However the regular lancers probably deserve a poor grade the contemporary Russian who describes them as hopeless is also able to describe the horse artillery as good quality excelent shots so he is capable of objectivity.

The militia / irregular troops could be of varied quality, how to grade them will depend on how you or your rules deal with non-Europeans. Some ethnic goups were noted as tough, some brave-charging, others timid, some noted as hopeless in the field but ferociously brave defenders of forts etc.

The militia / tribal / irregular cavalry includes some swarming types that would be Cossack-like (one European likened tribal cavalry charging Russian squares to Mameluks at the battle of the Pyramids)and others more hard charging, perhaps like the armoured Kurds, Circassans, Ossetians or similar.

Regards

David f Brown

Hi David,

Thank you for the detailed information, I certainly look forward to your handbook when you have it completed.

Does anyone have any good source material for understanding the history of this particular period, not just OOB's and uniforms, but also the story of Qajars during the period.

Thanks,
JJM

"However the regular lancers probably deserve a poor grade the contemporary Russian who describes them as hopeless"

He felt that the European gear inhibited their natural fighting style. I'd go for 2nd class regulars as far as classification goes.

We need some Quajar generals and some Qajar cavalry in mail and helmets too.

I've been doing some searching on the web an I think that many of the available Safavid armoured lancers without barded horses would be suitable Qajar cavalry in mail. You could also use many of the Ottoman ranges to fill out the tribal irregulars.

I like these Qajar helmets.

hi there

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

JJM said

Thank you for the detailed information, I certainly look forward to your handbook when you have it completed.

>>>>>>>

DB
I've managed to put 3-4 solid days work into the booklet, it's creeping up toward 70 pages, but a lot of that is pictures.

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JJM
Does anyone have any good source material for understanding the history of this particular period, not just OOB's and uniforms, but also the story of Qajars during the period.

>>>>>>>>>>

Perhaps the on-line Encyclopaedia Iranica is as good a place as any.

Regards
David F Brown

hiya

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You could also use many of the Ottoman ranges to fill out the tribal irregulars.

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Or even some Cossack ranges, I converted an AB Cossack officer into my Qajar Shah.

Some of the 'Grumpy' range Cossacks look like they might fit the bill with a quick addition of a Qajar hat.

Regards

David F Brown

Hello, I just wanted to revive this thread and find out if any progress had been made on the sculpts or the booklet David mentioned.

Ditto to what JJ wrote…like I need another period or project, but if Khurasan goes all in (cav, guns, crew, along with the infantry) and if the booklet comes to light, I am thinking this might be one strange and cool looking army to field. Now who in my group has Napoleonic Russians?….

However, to the topic at hand. No mention has been made of the excellent publication "Unknown Armies" Volume 2 Persia/Iran by Peter Abbott published in 1989 by Raider Books, a division of Raider Games,119 Elmete Way, Leeds, LS8 2ND.

And how does one go about finding a copy of this Raider title, since Raider is kaput, yes?

Sorry for resurrecting this thread, but is there any movement on these guys?

I'll assume that'll be a no then?

I don't think Khurasan is allowed on TMP anymore.

TMP link

In any event – Khurasan seems to preview a lot of ranges, some get released, some don't.

Evilgong, would it be poss you could let me have details of The Battle of Toprah Kaleh

You can reach me at

sacredcarp@hotmail.com

Hi there,

Still flogging away at the booklet, making good progress, it will probably land at 100 – 120 pages, which I guess is closer to a book than booklet.

I'm up to a section on allies and enemies (which will neeed to be kept from growing too big) and then a section rounding up army compositions, and then a section with an attempt at reconstructing 6 battles, 1 vs Georgia, 2 vs Ruskies, 2 v Turks, and 1 v Brits. (Maybe also an account of an action in Afghanistan).

Toprah Kaleh will be one of them but I haven't started on it other than to roughly sketch the possible phases of the battle a while back – I'll do this one first. No idea yet if there are Turk versions of it available.

Finding a regional map with enough info, but not too much, is proving tricky, I'll probably have to knock one up myself but was hoping to include a near contemporary 19thc European map for colour.

Regards

David F Brown

Looks like they have been released and look really good
link

Looking forward to the booklet/book David! How are things going with it? You had mentioned an enemies and allies section. Besides the Russians, British, and Ottoman Empire as adversaries, who else will be covered in this section?

If anyone buys the Khurasan Qajars I would really appreciate knowing how they scale up with 15mm.

Depends on whose 15mm minis you're talking about.

Khurasan has consistently made his Napoleonic troops mix well with AB (which is great for me, may not be so good for others).