"What do you look for in terrain? Price, weight or design?" Topic

Dear TMP readers,

I ponder the idea of starting an online shop selling terrain pieces, but before I start doing so I would be very interested in some comments and opinions by fellow wargamers. Call it market research and I would assume this is also valuable information for other terrain producers.

Pricing is so far the most obscure topic for me and in the end it is not the question how long it took me, but how much a potential customer is happy to spent.

So, what do you look for in terrain?

Does it need to be cheap or would you invest a bit more in some nicely made terrain? If so what is nice terrain worth to you?

Given this question really depends on the terrain in question I'll post some sample pictures and would ask you how much you would pay.

Both pieces are made of styrofoam and bark, backed with styrne sheet for added durability. The most simple and most often encountered wargaming terrain piece is possibly hills:

What about more fancy pieces like this lake with an integrated tree base. The tree features MiniNatur foliage nets, the water is made using clear Epoxy Resin and even features some fish.

Secondly, which sizes for terrain pieces do you find handy?

Do you like stuff that can be used for a variety of rule systems and if so, which measurements are perfect?

Is there a too small or too big?

What about weight?

We are all getting older and having 5 kg of terrain on your back or in your arms might not be the idea of a good time for many people.

Often weight also relates to sturdiness. Styrofoam is lighter, but often less rigid than say a solid piece of resin. What do you prefer? A nice lightweight piece that is easy to carry around or a piece that can withstand a car driving over it?

Finally, which pieces do you think the market does not offer? What kind of designs and themes would you love to see?

How important is it that the models are absolutely stable on a given piece or can they be a bit less stable if the visual impact is stunning?

Should elements such as trees, big rocks, detailing etc. be removable?

A lot of questions, but I do hope that some are happy to chime in with their opinions and suggestions.

Usability, durability and price. And then, maybe, look.

Elements should be removable, and figures should be able stand safely when there is interior.

Good looks and usability…

For removable, things like trees and similar that can break easily are good for removability for transport. Larger rocks and similar add to that if it's a large cluster to make an ease of play option

Design/usability first and foremost (why spend on something I can't/won't use?), followed by a balance between price and durability (if it's something that will last for decades, I don't mind paying a bit more – if it's styrafoam…)

First, consistency across the line. Roads that go with the rivers that go with the hills that go with the trees that go with the matts.

It would be nice to say price vs. quality, but it ain't so. You need to find the balance.

That was the nice thing about the Terrain Guy. He made a range of items that looked good across the whole table at a reasonable price.

Oh, and put your name on each item. That way when one wants to order more of something he can easily find your website to order. Too often, after a few years, you'll pick up a piece of terrain and say, "I want more," but you can't remember who you bought it from.

My first, don't depend on doing this for a living. Gamers are an impossibly fickle lot. I recently spent almost $400 USD on some river pieces, about 16' + worth so sometimes we do spend significant amounts – I bought rather than did my own because of the time to create mattered. And while I make my own terrain now – because no one else makes anything commercially as durable as I do – I have bought terrain in the past. Price matters huge – but so does quality of product. People often wax poetic about how beautiful this or that piece of terrain is (and yours look very good) but what will sell a range and keep buyers coming back to it is the consistency mentioned above, yes, but even more so full playability.

And to address the sytrofoam issue – I no longer use any styrofoam for any terrain, mine is made from layered and chamfered plywood. I can literally toss a piece of my terrain 20' across a room with no fear of damaging it. If you must, use insulating foam but even it doesn't have the long term durability.

Whatever you decide, good luck with your efforts.

Looks first and foremost. The example above are very nice quality and would be something I would want and look for. Stability/durability are helpful as you don't want them falling apart but I take care of my terrain so I am not to hard on it.

The ability to do custom pieces is a huge plus to me. Good luck and let us know when you take the plunge. Like I said based on the pieces above I will be interested!

Price, followed by design.

Thank you very much for your comments so far. An interesting read indeed.

So far, from the very limited sample, I gather that removable features (if possible) and resulting from that usability are very important, followed by durability. There is no need that both would affect looks negatively. Consistency in the range is also good advise.

@Early Morning Writer: Thank you for your advise. While I would like it to be a proper buisness known for quality, reliabilty and good customer service, I also appreciate that it will at least for starters not provide a living wage. I do hope that it will make my hobby self sustained and also provide some source of income if times a dire, but naturally I would have a day job.

Your wood terrain sounds extremely durable and I would be interested to see some pictures of it. How does it compare weight wise? This is a main concern for me, as I would like to cater to a global market and need to keep shipping reasonable. Being (for now) based in New Zealand one kilo costs 33 Dollars shipping to any destination not Australia, thus I try to keep weight as low as possible, about 250 g per item. This makes mdf board or hardboard as a base problematic. I think of giving some polyurethane based foam covering systems a try. Styrospray 1000 seems to be a good product without adding much weight.

I identify three major kinds of damage a terrain piece needs to withstand:

1. Dropping it on the floor should not result in stuff chipping or the piece breaking apart. If it is light in construction that actually helps. Being properly based and the corners being reinforced also prevents cracking.

2. People leaning with their hands on it may not crush it. XPS is rather dense and with a resin coating it should withstand such situations.

3. Miniature damage. Pikes might get caught, swords might plunge in the material etc. Again the resin coat (or even the old sand and PVA) should protect the piece from this.

I also mislabeld the materials used for my stuff, as it is XPS not EPS I am using. I also cover everything in a mixture of acrylic medium and sand,so the surface is already quite durable.

@Slagneb: Thank you for your interest. I'll still deciding on product ranges etc., but might start soon. Commissions are definitely possible and in some cases the better way to go.

Please keep the comments coming. I am keen to read more opinions.

I think going the route of a custom terrain builder is probably a much better business model. Your great challenge is your location but if your production is good enough, people will buy it. But you also need to make structures as well as terrain, I suspect, to be viable. And be open to a wider market than wargamers. If you are not familiar, read up on Ian Weekly and his time in the business. Also, HG Walls – study them. Plus it is not enough to be good, you have to be fast.

I've always wanted a primo set of European and desert terrain for DBA and Hott. So offerings along those lines would suit me.

For this type of product I'd think postage is a big factor that could turn some off. Since I'm in Australia, however, this may be bearable.

It depends what segment of the wargaming market you are after. Yes, I think there are different segments in the terrainmarket ;-)

Over the years, i find myself buying fewer, but high-quality terrain pieces that I know will last another 20 years. I am willing to pay for them a higher price. The idea is that after 20+ years of wargaming i have a pretty good idea of what terrain pieces will be used a lot for the type of games I play. I am now much more interested in building up a small collection of high-quality terrain pieces that are versatile and match my desired look of the gaming table.

Otoh, I see many younger wargamers buying either lots of cheap even crappy terrain , or spend big money on a unique spectacular piece. The problem is, they don't realize yet that this unique piece looks spectacular, but you will probably only use it in one or 2 games ever. I think it only comes with wargaming age to realize that, and then you are willing to spend the money on basic rivers, hills, etc, because you know you will use these all the time.

Price then usabilty then durability.

Hi,

the idea of covering a variety of markets (diorama builders, wargamers, model railroaders, board gamers, scale modelers etc.) is indeed essential.

Thank you for pontign out the two masters, I will read more about them.

Speed is important, but I guess it is also about finding a balance between speed and quality. i guess it is also important to have the right tools. Carving ahill by hand takes ages, doing it with the help of a hot knife makes it much faster and acchives better results. I guess I have to try out stuff and see what works best, allows me to produce quality in a reasonable amount of time.

This also relates to the segment comment: I would enjoy providing very high quality products in terms of design and looks (obviously also material if a balance between weight and resilience can be found). I am not planing on competing with very cheap products as I do enjoy making highly detailed and realistic pieces.