"Ukrainian Independence Day" Topic

As Ukraine struggles to regain control of some areas in the east, it prepares to celebrate its independence from the Soviet Union.

I'm not in Kyiv, unfortunately, but (if this rain stops!) there is some celebrations down town so I will see if there is anything to photograph. I think anything military is in Kyiv (or fighting in the east).

Meanwhile "Pro-Russian rebels in the east say that they will stage alternative independence day celebrations featuring captured Ukrainian servicemen… In Donetsk, rebels put on display two destroyed armoured personnel carriers, and there are plans to parade prisoners of war through the streets."

Isn't that a breach of Geneva?

Are the 'pro-Russian rebels' signatories of the Geneva Conventions..?

Lol. Probably not, but I can't see that doing anything more than stirring up a stronger determination to remove them.

link

"Ukraine's president has announced that almost $3 USDbn will be spent on re-equipping the army after an "exhausting" campaign against pro-Russian rebels.

Well, I guess it's safe to assume they won't be buying Russian equipment…

(Mind you, $3 USDbn over 3 years isn't going to get you very much these days)

Never fear! NATO is prepared to supply Ukraine with MREs, replacement boot laces and bayonet polish!

Boot laces are an issue – many of them don't have boots, as you can see in this photo of Ukrainian prisoners of war paraded by bayonet point in Donetsk today:

Yes, it is a breach of the conventions and it matters not a jot whether or not they've signed up, as it is still international law as defined and ratified by the UN and constitutes a war crime. I'd love to see Barin try to deny this one.

They are POWs as defined by Article 4 of the Geneva Convention, assuming they are actually members of the armed forces or other militia units recognised by the Government.

Article 3(1)(c) protects them from
…"Outrages upon personal dignity, in particular, humiliating and degrading treatment"…

Being paraded along a "walk of shame" (their description) does seem to constitute humiliating and degrading, as defined under the 1929 Convention.

In addition they have already publicly declared the the use of executions to maintain control, in particular within their own ranks, and especially for anyone who surrenders or hands across weapons to equipment… that's a breach of Article 3(1)(d).

Of course these are all paraded as members of the Ukrainian armed forces captured in battle, whereas I suspect they are a mixed collection of anyone they could find who was objecting to their control. There are reports from Donetsk that they are not actually soldiers at all, and that most of the jeering crowd was rent-a-crowd (with suggestions that they came in on the aid convoy which, contrary to Russian claims, was not all checked in, nor all checked out – actually approx 37 trucks were checked going in and 40 checked going out. The other 160 or so passed through with no supervision). Apparently the locals stood by silently, either unaware of what was going on, or simply too afraid to say anything. The main purpose seems to have been to make a show for Russian media TV… they even managed to find another pretty blonde:

Jemima, Barin isn't the Russian representative. He does offer some very useful insights into how things are seen and reported from the Russian side. As such he is not really in any position to confirm or deny it, but his views are equally valid.

I am conscious that Ukrainian media (and one member of the Ukrainian government in particular) can be a bit quick to drop direct blame on Russia based of circumstantial evidence, some of it pretty flimsy. They are equally guilty of not telling the full story, as we know, especially in relation to some military losses.

Unfortunately really heavy storms with thunder and lightning here in Rivne all day, so not much happening, although we did just have some window-shaking fireworks!

Is putting a sack over a POW head ligit? Saw lots of that with the 'wars' in Iraq and Afgan-stan. From the coalition side.
Barin just lives there and agree he is not biased.

Interesting article from Moscow Times suggests they may not be soldiers at all, but merely 'arrested people'

link

"Are the 'pro-Russian rebels' signatories of the Geneva Conventions..?"

Since a good chunk of the 'pro-Russia rebels' are Russian military….yes it applies to them.

"Is putting a sack over a POW head ligit? Saw lots of that with the 'wars' in Iraq and Afgan-stan. From the coalition side."

Of course it is. Maintaining security by denying prisoners information about where they are, how many guards they have, security measures taken to make sure they don't escape, etc. is perfectly legit.

I have In-laws in Donetsk, and through Skype my Wife has been keeping very close tabs on events through both official media, and speaking with other friends/family.

The complete story is far from being told here in the US, and the ongoing catastrophe is much worse than I believe most people understand.

The Chechen mercenaries are evidently the worst, killing people on sight, and so busy looting they frequently leave their weapons behind in order to carry more away.

Putin has really let loose the dogs, and that's a crime in itself.

Weird world that allows us to watch our relatives and loved ones while being shelled in their own homes on Skype….

TVAG

Dn Jackson,

Escape? denying prisoners information??

I have seen situations of them in the pen trussed up and hooded with perimeter defence.
The only reason for that would be to put fear into the POW and pimping for info, so no cause to celebrate such actions.
But before you go camel about it, I understand the method is used to protect your unit and I would do the same but I would not be moralising about what others do to get the same results
(I stop at physical harm thought and think most civilised peoples would)
and that's that, I am also not condoning what is being done in the Ukraine by the separatists (it just flames the rift more)
Again its the civilians who get it in the neck and that's the sad part.