"Prussian Standards - specific units" Topic

Hello folks, I know this is a big ask….. I'm trying to identify the standards carried by a few Prussian units during 1870 in order to finish these units and get them on the table with a flag. (They are units involved at the battle of Wissembourg 4th Aug 1870, and a couple of odd units).

Google is not helping, even searching in goole translated German!

I'm aware that some Prussian units standard were in tatters by 1870, however if I could identify what they were before being destroyed that would help.

80th Regiment (Füsilier-Regt. von Gerdsdorff (1.Kurhessisches) Nr.80)

82nd Regiment (2. Kurhessisches Infanterie-Regt. Nr.82)

87th Regiment (1. Nassauisches Infanterie-Regt. Nr.87)

108th Regiment (Kgl. Sächs. Schützen (Füsilier)-Regt. Prinz Georg Nr.108)

5th Jager Battalion

11th Jager Battalion

5th West Prussian Cuirassier Regiment

4th (1st Silesian) Dragoon Regiment

10th Posen Uhlan Regiment.

1st & 14th Hussar Regiments

Even a point to an online source would help.

many many thanks in advance

Andrew

Hi Andrew,

First points first. If you are looking for a good source on Prussian flags on line, go to North Star Miniatures website and their 1866 range. They have details of Prussian cavalry and infanrty regiments for the 1866 war including theiir condition at the time. Those regiments which entered service after 1866 (nos 80, 82, 87 in your sample) all have pristine new examples of the flag first issued in 1828. The Saxon Schutzen Regiment, which wore jäger uniform, did not have any standards. Nor, as I am sure you know, was it at Wissemburg. But in the 21st Division of XI Corps you seem to be modelling Grenadier Regt No 8 also served. Their ragged, early issue, flags, are shown on the North Star Site. Jäger Btn No5 had a model 1808 flag, much the same as the later ones, only tattier.. no 11 had a new one issued in 1867. Hope that is a good start.

Mollinary

Hi Mollinary,
thanks you for replying, it was very helpfull.
I have found most of what I was looking for with the exception of the difference between the 1828 standard and the 1867 standard issued to the 11th Jager Battalion, any idea what the differences are?

I'm aware the 108th were not at Wissembourg, I was looking for some additional units to fill the box with and I have a 'thing' about odd units!
It's a pity they were not issued with a standard, do you know if any of the other Saxon regiments (100-107th) were issued with a standard or did they also carry an 1828/1867 standard – or non at all?

How are you with Bavarian standards concerning the units at Wissembourg? ;-)

Thanks
Andrew

Hi Andrew,

Have most of the information you are looking for. The differences between the 1828 version and The1861 and 1867 versions are tiny. The 1861 versions are identical to 1828' and the 1867 one, which include your regiments in the 80 series, have slightly more rounded crowns on the top of the central wreath and the corner monograms. All of the Saxon regiments had their own unique models, as Saxony remains an independent kingdom within the North German confederation. each regiment has three flags. The 100th has a white Leibfahne for the first battalion, dating back to 1815. The other seven have a new model White flag dating to 1867-68. All the second and third battalions have the standard green flags carried by the sixteen battalions existing in 1866. The. Bavarians have a type, the general nature of which is shown on the war flag site, but which has different monograms depending on which king was on the throne when the flags were presented. There are a couple of exceptions carrying earlier flags, and the vast majority of surviving flags are still in the Bavaran army museum in Ingoldstadt. What scale are you looking at reproducing these flags? They are available in 6mm and 10mm, but I am not aware of good examples in the higher scales.

Mollinary

link

link

wiki-de.genealogy.net/IR_102

wiki-de.genealogy.net/IR_103

wiki-de.genealogy.net/IR_103

wiki-de.genealogy.net/IR_106

wiki-de.genealogy.net/IR_107

link
All you ever need…

Greetings and have fun

link

Ready to print

Rudi,

These are all great, but all these flags had distinct and different obverse and reverse sides, unfortunately!

Mollinary

Thank you very much gents, it is appreciated.

Rudi, the links are useful, but as Mollinary states they only show one side of the standard, I require (would like) both.

Andrew (if I may?) I'm looking to produce the standards in 15mm (Heretic I know). I've recently (last 12 months) become interested in the FPW, modelling the Prussians/German states for no other reason than a friend has French already.I'm now rather obsessed!

I do like units to be correct, with the correct standards and not just 'any flag will do' for them.

So your last reply has brought up a couple of new questions, I found a couple of further postings you made both here and elsewhere which lead me to historischer-bilderdienst.de. Would you be willing to reccommend any books/pdf files that cover the Prussian/Saxon/Bavarian, and smaller German states. I'm interested in good quality colour images of the standards, not too concerned about the text at this point.

There is a standard shown at the above link in the Saxon book/file of the 105th Regiment showing the white flag with green edging, is this the same standard for all regiments with only a change of the number in the corner (Why does the 105th have a No.6 in the corners?) Is there an image of the 'green flag' available, is the standard the same for all battalions?

Any reason why the 108th Regiment was not isued a standard?

I'm not looking to produce these commercially, however there are no good quality flags for the smaller German states that I'm aware of in 15mm/25/28mm. The quality of standard I would like is that of GMB Designs.

Thanks again gents.
Andrew

Andrew,

I would be happy to help, but perhaps e mail would be easier? To get an idea what the flags should look like, you could do worse than have a look at pendraken's site, whose 10mm versions were produced by a great graphic designer, are high quality, and were produced on the basis of the research I provided to the designer. They have sheets with all the Saxon and Bavarian flag types. Regis 101-107 are identical with the exception of the numbers. 101 has crowns in the corner (as a grenadier Regt) 102-107 have numbers reflecting their seniority in the Saxon Army. So 102 has 3, 103 has 4, and so on. The site you got this from also shows the Leibfahne of Regt 100. 108 has no flags because it is formed out of three existing jäger battalions which had no place in the new corps organisation on the Prussian model.

Andrew

Andrew,
If you can put an email address up here, or join the Pendraken forum and PM me, I have some good quality images I can forward to you.

Andrew

Hi Andrew,
my supporting membership has lapsed so I cn't email you through TMP, so try- atel at sky dot com

Cheers
Andrew

E mails sent.

Andrew

Now having e mail problems. Can you confirm they arrived on here?

Andrew

Andrew, got them, thank you very much.
I will be in touch.

Andrew

Great – my e mail is now back up!

Andrew