"A Word From The Assistant Editors" Topic

John,
I'm saddened that you would have thought less of your son if he were. I hope that you have evolved too.
You're not bad John, perhaps the twenty years ago John was.

Though isn't the dictionary definition of tolerance "the ability or willingness to tolerate something, in particular the existence of opinions or behavior that one does not necessarily agree with." ? That's what Webster tells me, at least.

-Will

The editors aren't "gay", They are transexual women.
How about not waiting for " the growing body of empirical evidence on the subject of human sexual orientation " and just accepting them for who they are?
Science is great, but don't use it as an excuse as to how you feel.

Wrong on all fronts about my intent, my meaning, my knowledge on the subject of human sexual orientation and gender identity, and my character.

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Explain

Making this about the editors' sexuality or asking everyone at TMP to own up to some standard regarding acceptance sexual orientations is counterproductive.

Really? On the evidence, that was indeed a self evident central component in this little witch hunt of the Frother posse, and certainly underscored by the oft-expressed misogyny and locker room disdain for Asians and those who are LGBT expressed by various Frother participants.

I personally prefer to err on the side of compassion and empirical facts over mere opinion and willful ignorance, and I have no use for the sort of rampant misogyny and abusive language that characterizes the Frothers fora discourse as a matter of routine. "Debate?" How 'bout I see you with an actual degree in Psychology with coursework in Human Sexuality, and raise your "middle ground" with the growing body of peer reviewed research?

If you want to try and deflect away from or gloss over the unpleasant fact of how more than a few of the Frothers membership carries on as a matter of course obvious to a dead blind man, that is your choice, yes, but I for one come to TMP to enjoy discussions on my hobby, and go to assorted political fora for discussions concerning such matters as how those who are LGBT should be treated both as human beings and under the rule of law.

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

John,
I'm saddened that you would have thought less of your son if he were. I hope that you have evolved too.
You're not bad John, perhaps the twenty years ago John was.

Has reading comprehension sunk so low?
Where did I say I would think less of my son? I said I wanted grandchildren.

And that is all I have to say. I am not going to get into a debate about levels of temporal acceptance. I do not believe that anything I have said is on need of any further clarification or explanation. Unless you want to buy me a few beers of course.

Only wondering how this would have played out two or three weeks ago but that we will never know. Other than that none of this bothers me. Keep up the good work.

Ah Winston/John…it's safer to get between a mother bear and her cub than to get between someone and their self-righteousness.

Oh and well played on the "Jones-ing for a beer" front.

The editors aren't "gay", They are transexual women.

You assume I don't know that. Here in the States we use the umbrella term LGBT to describe the orientation of those who are Lesbian-Gay-Bisexual-Transgender. I am not aware of what y'all over in the UK are currently using to describe those who are LGBT. American vs. British English translation error on your part, perhaps?

How about not waiting for " the growing body of empirical evidence on the subject of human sexual orientation " and just accepting them for who they are?

You're assuming that I don't?

Science is great, but don't use it as an excuse as to how you feel.

I respect facts over mere opinions, and I am not using it as an excuse.

Clear things up?

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

I am glad my son is not "it"

You missed the 'and' and the following clause in that sentence. ;)

-Will

Bandit has stated before that he has nothing to do with Frothers.

the and and clause make no differance.

Only wondering how this would have played out two or three weeks ago but that we will never know.

Or if the Frothers had stopped their persecution of the editors months ago, as I asked.

Winston Smith wrote:

> Has reading comprehension sunk so low?
> Where did I say I would think less of my son?
> I said I wanted grandchildren.

A gay son could adopt children. He could even obtain the services of a surrogate mother and adopt from her, if it's your genes you want passed onto your grandchildren.

Hey Crumple. Who used "it" first? My good friend Winston was ridiculing YOUR use of "it".

But, why are we kidding ourselves? You believe that TMP is full of rampant homophobia and sexism, and you are enlightened and can say whatever you want.

This is so stupid. I want my 30 minutes back. I have my own conservative beliefs and have not a care who or what the editors are. I think flaunting their pictures was a huge ill thought out mess. Others trying to make others confirm their own viewpoints on sexual orientation and gender identity… blah, blah, blah….name calling, account locking mess! And I thought the Tango mess was a pain. Argh! Good grief. I don't care what Bill's hobbies are or . I am not an advertiser or sponsor. I usually just refrain from reading non-wargaming threads, but I just had to see what the uproar was over.

I don't have the time to read all this right now, but would to add my support to the Editors.

Live and let live.

Dan.

After some happy years on here, there's just too much tosh & odd stuff on here now for me, please cancel my membership Bill. I'll stick to wargames fora in future. Bye :-)

I almost never post on TMP and have not posted in years. I am so happy to be able to ask the big Question. How does this get my figures painted faster and why does what someone does in their personal life get my figures painted faster? I'll hang up and wait for an answer.

Bore14: Only wondering how this would have played out two or three weeks ago but that we will never know.

There would be more members and advertisers and less locked accounts, otherwise who knows.

Bill: Or if the Frothers had stopped their persecution of the editors months ago, as I asked.

You can blame the things outside your control or you can influence the things inside your control. You had options inside your control – several different ones – that would have prevented all of this.

Cheers,

The Bandit

Arrrrghhh!!!

So the cat's out of the bag. While I can't say it came as a total surprise, I'm sorry the announcement had to be made in the first place due to the persistent actions of certain unscrupulous individuals.

The positive that comes out of this whole affair is that the people taking Frothers side and denying that privacies were infringed are now in an utterly indefensible position.

Way to go, boys!

I think it's good this is out in the open, for several reasons.

It's a horribly wrong society when people cannot be open about something that only concerns themselves.

It's good to be frank about it because it prevents the sneak atttacks by little minds, as the ones we've seen recently.

I'm not interested in the sexual orientation of anybody on this forum, I come here because of the little toy guys (and a few girls) with little toy guns and/or pointy sticks.

Now that this has come out it has now reached the point of Meh.

Those who have judgment and persecution of people who are transgendered or gay have an innate fear of their own sexuality.

"You believe that TMP is full of rampant homophobia and sexism,"

Well my posts complaining about the references to a medical condition as a disaaproved of 'lifestyle' were deleted. So yeah, there's supporting evidence there.

What a mess…….

Well this escalated quickly!

I think I'll go fishing.

Or , I might even paint some miniatures for the first time in several weeks.

There isn't a tea cup small enough to contain the nonsense that has roiled on this matter for too many weeks.

Where's my 0/0 brush?

I'm sad that the Assistant Editors have felt pressured to reveal personal information about themselves. I would have thought it obvious that the fact some one is willing to talk about being transgendered on a support site for trans people doesn't constitute a green light for all and sundry to go around shouting about it everywhere. I hope they have been re-assured by the fact that so many here support their right to be themselves and do their jobs. Best wishes to you all ladies.

Thank you Jha Jha for the courage to reveal our true identity!! Thumbs Up!

But we are not just ordinary ladyboys, we're decent. I know that ladyboys have a bad reputation because of scamming, cam shows, and sex work. However, you should not generalize about us ladyboys – we are all different.

We never did hide our identity because there is no reason to. We just want the work, want to help Bill and you TMP'ers. I would say there was a little pressure because maybe we might be the reason of Bill's problem here on TMP and were. Hehehehe.. But now that someone took the courage, did something change on TMP? Anyways, we don't know all the people who work with us, who always with us. It might be gay guy, a lesbian or transgender.

Once again, thanks to you Jha Jha!

I'm a straight white male from the UK. There you have it! I'm out at last :-)

I'm a straight white male from the UK. There you have it! I'm out at last :-)

Ahahahahaha.. it does not matter.

But you're happy for the original discrimination to stand?

It is his opinion, I am not offended.

I just want to know if someone has an awesome pancit recipe they can share. I. *LOVE*. Pancit.

Personally, I can't understand why or how any of this is of the least bit of importance to anyone other than the editors. Frankly it's no one's business but theirs. I understand the so-called "issue" but their privacy trumps anyone else's curiosity or attacks. Just goes to show what a bunch of *bleeps* some people are that they would push this issue to the point that the editors felt they needed to clear the air. I doubt their statement will actually settle anything. In fact, I'm willing to bet it will create more controversy and issues both here on TMP and at the other site that started all the trouble.

My father,a 2 tour Vietnam Vet and who retired as a CW3 after 30 years from the Army,became a post-Op Transsexual.If I can accept that then I have no problem with anyone else.

I thank her for her service, Robert.

Thank you very much JP. The final operation was just before retirement from the National Guard. It kinda threw the Army off LOL.I have pictures of her in both male and female Class As LOL

I want the last hour of my life back. Please, God.

Earth is a screwy place. Anyone who doesn't agree with that observation is not even reading from the same book. And yes all of our perceptions about each other DO affect our ability and interest in war gaming, along with interest in everything else. It's called, "world view paradigm (shift)". That is also called, "people change as they grow older". It is the leading cause of divorce, and dumping hobbies and taking up new "hobbies", etc. and etc. and etc.

All you all who have asserted above, and elsewhere, that this is simply a war gaming site, are out of the loop or even disingenuous. Or fooling yourselves. Nothing said changes nothing. But something said changes everything.

Things on TMP will never be the same. You can't go back to "just a simple wargames-only-forum", because that is no longer (if it ever was) what TMP is….

Sundance --

This is an issue because we have some <BLEEP>wits who (a) desperately want to gay-bash (or TG-bash or whatever-bash) the editor; while (b) not being seen as bigoted.

They are, of course, too witless to understand that these two aims cannot be reconciled. Therefore, they drone on (and on) about tangential and utterly boring minutiae, asking pointless questions and generally acting like passive-aggressive sissies.

When their behavior is questioned, they bleat about "just wanting information", constantly reassuring us that their prurient interest is somehow benign and proclaiming how tolerant and open-minded they are. Twits, one and all. And cowards.

I posed this question in another thread --

What if the Editors were African-American and the Editor's charity devoted to African Americans?

Would it have taken more than about 10 minutes for everyone to [rightly] accuse the Editor's critics of obvious racism (despite their protestations to the contrary)?

Would everyone have any patience with folks who incessantly imply that there's something twisted and wrong with the Editor's interest in African Americans?

In this context, how would we react to folks repeatedly asking if the editors were African-American, without telling us what this has to do with wargaming (or anything else for that matter)? Would we be persuaded by vague assurances that they "just want to know" and that the information somehow needs to be disclosed?

Is there any principled reason to treat this situation any differently?

And I agree with you. This ridiculous ing match will never be resolved by responding, clarifying, etc. The Editor needs to DROP IT. Seriously… he should let it go. The rest of us should point and laugh at those who continue to pose "questions" about this.

By the way, what is the point of the dog smoking a pipe? It is doubtlessly witty, but I'm missing the point completely. Since I've always liked pictures of dogs playing poker, I really want to know what this means…

If you are a true Christian, then you believe that God loves all of his children equally.
While I may be the typical Fox watching conserative, I firmly belive that every human being has a right to privacy and an absolute right to live their life as they see fit.

It's nobody else's business how another person chooses to spend his/her time on this earth.

Fin.

Joao Grilo was a Frother and a previous banned member of TMP. Banned members are not allowed to post, so his post was removed.

And quite a poor attempt at sock puppetry as well.

If you are a true Christian, then you believe that God loves all of his children equally.

Bill, while that is true, it doesn't mean that Christians believe that God approves of all of his children's behavior.

It's nobody else's business how another person chooses to spend his/her time on this earth.

And if you make your personal life public, say like telling about your personal life in a story or interview on a website, expect to be the subject of comment.

+1 geoffb

Bill, while that is true, it doesn't mean that Christians believe that God approves of all of his children's behavior.

Yes, that's may be true, but it's not for us to decide, is it? There is only one judge and it's not you or any other human being.

And if you make your personal life public, say like telling about your personal life in a story or interview on a website, expect to be the subject of comment.

Perhaps. But it was not the persons giving the interview or telling their story that opened up this whole can of worms.
It was people with an axe to grind against the editor.
They thought by "exposing" his other site, that they could harm him on this site. Mean spirited, to say the least.

This is not directed at you personally, Bede.
If any of this nonsense bothers you, then