"The Moslem Jet Fighter" Topic

"Burma is again looking for some new jet fighters and has decided that the Chinese JF-17 is the way to go, mainly because of low price ($20-25 million depending on version) and China has offered to set up an assembly operation in Burma to build the aircraft. That would enable Burma to more easily train maintenance personnel and at the same time create a more extensive and inexpensive maintenance capability. Burma is already familiar with the JF-17 because back in 2009 Burma bought 20 MiG-29 fighters from Russia, for $35 USD million each after also considering the JF-17. At the time China offered the similar JF-17 for less than half the price of the MiG-29. Yet Burma chose the more expensive aircraft. This may have been because the Russians offered higher bribes.

What was odd about this was that both aircraft have questionable reputations. After the 2009 sales Burma had 31 MiG-29s and, as expected, the MiG-29s proved difficult and expensive to maintain a keep operational. This time around China has promised to also supply smart bombs for use on the JF-17s.

This would be the first export sale for the JF-17, which is already used by Pakistan but only because Pakistan helped pay for development and produces some of the components. Although a Moslem country Pakistan is also eager to find the first export customer for the JF-17 and if Burma does buy then Pakistan would help reduce the hostility Burma is facing because of the violence Burmese nationalists have been inflicting on the Moslem minority in Burma…"
Full article here
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Amicalement
Armand

Bangladesh has Mig29s. Someone in the air force told me they have to ship them back to Russia for maintenance. When I fly in and out of the airport I only see the Chinese Mig-21 copy.

So why is this "The Moslem Jetfighter?"

Is China now Muslim? I thought they were "godless" Communist" with predominantly Buddhist/Taoist/folk religion past.

Is Myanmar now Muslim? I thought they were 89% Buddhist.

Pakistan connection is licence assembly and in this case licence assembly is planned in Burma.

So why the Moslem connection?

Also JF-17 was a J-7/MiG-21 replacement, not an F-16 replacement.

JF-17 isn't even close to a MiG-29 or F-16 in performance (even 80% of F-16 is based on spurious comments by some Pakistani analysts).

The JF-17 is a Mach 1.6 light fighter (MTOW: 12,383 kg).

F-16 is Mach 2.0 (MTOW: 19,000 kg) and MiG-29 is Mach 2.25 (MTOW: 20,000 kg).

Both F-16 and MiG-29 are available with avionics and weapons far more advanced than any JF-17.

Pakistan still prefers to buy upgraded ex-European/US F-16A/Bs than JF-17s – only 50 JF-17s have been delivered and delivery rates are far slower than anticipated. Indeed next batch of 50 Block IIs are only now starting to be devloped.

Also JF-17 doesn't really offer any greater reliability of MiG-29. After all it's engine is a variant of the MiG-29 emgine.

Only thing that might be better is Chinese provision of spares and reasonable supply contracts but then I don't know if this is the case.

Strategy Page is ok at announcing news items but their analysis is terrible and often quite racist too.

@Chortle

I am under the impression that most of the countries that have Russian jets have to at least return the engines for maintenance. For smaller countries I could even understand returning the whole jet.

I mean it isn't like numerous small countries that use Western gear don't rely on Western contractors to keep their jets flying (I have relatives that did this for the Saudis for many years).

"Pakistan still prefers to buy upgraded ex-European/US F-16A/Bs than JF-17s"

That may be true at the moment. But they are worried that the US can pull the plug on their strike capability by withholding encryption codes for the F16 data-bus. At least on the Pakistan defense web sites, they believe that a new code has to be supplied every few days or you can't launch weapons. Over there they say the US has a man on the ground who doles out codes when the Paks are good boys. They are also worried about back doors.

For sure the JF-17 is old tech. But even the Chinese have to import engines from Russia for advanced fighters (last time I looked). Defense manufacturing in India and Pakistan has been a disaster. So any advance is good for them. In Pakistan they can't even manufacture bicycle chains – they have to import them from China.

"I have relatives that did this for the Saudis for many years"

I bumped into some people who did this while I was transiting in the ME. There are all sorts of opportunities in the ME if you can stand the conditions. Back in the 1970s/80s my uncle worked in Iraq as an electrician. Once he and some colleagues were contracted to take down an installation prior to an Israeli attack. Saddam had word of the attack in advance and agreed not to shoot at the Israeli planes so long as he got his equipment out. So much for the bravery of the IAF. Although they do a fantastic job dropping white phosphorous on civilians.

Wow…just wow.

That may be true at the moment. But they are worried that the US can pull the plug on their strike capability by withholding encryption codes for the F16 data-bus.

Dunno about this – Pakistan kept its older F-16A/Bs flying when they were under a US arms embargo.

It's more the lack of spares and upgrades that's a killer. It's why Venezuela can only keep less than a dozen F-16s flying right now and have been reaching out for Russian and Chinese equipment. It's why Iran had to maintain an extensive illicit arms network and developed a whole aerospace industry dedicated mainly to keeping old US stuff flying.

I am under the impression that most of the countries that have Russian jets have to at least return the engines for maintenance. For smaller countries I could even understand returning the whole jet

Pretty much. Croatia recently sent 7 MiG-21s to Ukraine for restoration back to flight capability. Mozambique did same with 8 MiG-21s sent to Romania for overhaul.

Small countries generally don't maintain any significant maintenance capability.

Small countries generally don't maintain any significant maintenance capability.

And don't buy enough birds to make it worthwhile to develop any significant maintenance capability, either.