"Huron and Iroquois " Topic

From War Miniatures.
They look good!

From here.
link

Hope you enjoy!.

Amicalement
Armand

These look really good, would be a nice addition to the collection

Oh. My. Let me know when these go on sale, please.

Right up your alley, zippy.

Would these fit in with King William's War or for the earlier Beaver Wars?
Mark

I see no muskets, I see clubs, bows, armor and shields.
I would certainly use them for KPW.

Those are seriously nice.

If he makes more he will probably have some with muskets.Timing is right for a project I have in mind.
Mark

Not that KPW Indians would not have muskets. In fact the Indians' muskets were superior to those of the settlers!
It's just nice to see nice Indians not carrying Magua Muskets.

I HOPE they are 28mm, because the middle guy in the second row is AWESOME.

Happy you enjoyed them John and friends!! (smile).

Amicalement
Armand

Oh, these are Bob Murch's work, the guy who sculpted the original RAFM Flint & Feather Indians that I'm still collecting after 30 years. Yes, these will be nice.

Please sir, may we have a portrait figure of the evil witch chief Adodaho, with the live rattlesnakes in his hair? There's a very helpful color plate in the Osprey Iroquois volume. Possibly a pack of Flying Head Maneaters?

One thing I notice is that these guys are all wearing cloth breech-clouts, with nice square corners. I won't say that's impossible pre-contact, because I've been persuaded that the natives wove small amounts of cloth from such materials as dog hair and bark fiber. But I do think that hide was rarely tailored, and that a hide breech-clout usually kept the shape of the critter who originally wore it. Dangly bits like head, legs and tail were usually kept as decoration or sliced into fringe, since it was difficult to trim them cleanly off with a flint knife.

The Iroquois' big advantage in the Beaver Wars was that the Dutch were trading them muskets, when their opponents couldn't get any. Still there must have been many Iroquois warriors who had only traditional weapons, while their Erie, Susquehanna and Huron foes had few muskets if any.

The Iroquois had only a small role in King Phillip's War, assisting the colonists in mopping up Wampanoag fugitives. As John points out, by the time of KPW, Massachusetts warriors were strongly influenced by contact with British colonists, wearing shirts, blankets and other trade cloth items and often owning muskets. Their weakness was that they couldn't make their own ammunition, so tended to run out during a war with the colonists who ordinarily supplied that article, and so be reduced to shooting arrows instead of lead balls. They'd still wear their shirts and blankets, though.

Thank you once more Armand. I definetly want them.

No mention my friend.
Good luck with them!. (smile).

Amicalement
Armand

Weapons are way too huge.

The project is intended to rep the pre-contact wars of legend with some of the supernatural elements included. They won't be historical per-say and there won't be muskets (initially anyway).

The weapons may be somewhat exaggerated to suggest the heroic nature of the motif. Though, Huron bows tended to be quite long according to my research.

For great historical, musket armed minis I recommend Conquest minis.

Here is a poor shot of my first painted figs in the line.

Nice work Bob!

The weapons don't look too oversized to me. Man, those are some fantastic paint jobs!

Hot sauce. Almost enough to make me think about going 28mm.

FMB

Excellent job Bob Murch!
Congrats!.

Amicalement
Armand

A few more painted.

You just made me cry.

I may download that snap for reference.

I want those figures.

"In fact the Indians' muskets were superior to those of the settlers!"

Really? Can you expand on that a bit?

Excellent painting job Bob!. (smile).
Congrats!.

Amicalement
Armand

"In fact the Indians' muskets were superior to those of the settlers!"

Really? Can you expand on that a bit?

In Patrick Malone's influential book The Skulking Way of War, Malone points out that the New England Indians rejected matchlock firearms and insisted on trading only for flintlocks, which were much handier weapons. During King Phillip's War, many New England militiamen used matchlock muskets, while their Indian foes used superior flintlocks – as long as their gunpowder held out.

Have no idea about that war, so will defer to you both on that. Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

These are awesome. Where/when can I get some?

Lovely paint jobs. Excellent work.

Regarding muskets: as Zippy noted the natives preferred the flintlocks for two reasons, one being the convenience of not having to worry about a slow match, the other being the smell of the burning match could give away an ambush.

According to Skulking Way of War. Neat book, do read it.

This Huron warrior will be a free convention giveaway at Fall Inn. Please check back on the web page for future details:

link

More Iroquoian Warriors

Main page
pulpfigures.com

Amicalement
Armand

Dang. Those Indians must work out! :-)

zippyfusenet wrote:

In Patrick Malone's influential book The Skulking Way of War, Malone points out that the New England Indians rejected matchlock firearms and insisted on trading only for flintlocks, which were much handier weapons. During King Phillip's War, many New England militiamen used matchlock muskets, while their Indian foes used superior flintlocks – as long as their gunpowder held out.

FatherOfAllLogic agreed:

Regarding muskets: as Zippy noted the natives preferred the flintlocks for two reasons, one being the convenience of not having to worry about a slow match, the other being the smell of the burning match could give away an ambush.

According to Skulking Way of War. Neat book, do read it.

In Carl P. Russel's Guns on the Early Frontiers (1957), he discusses this, as well as the Native Americans' initial preference for the shortest, lightest weapons, even after others had adopted the long musket (fowling piece), and what he calls the Pennsylvania-Kentucky long rifle. IIRC, he says they even chopped down some light fuzees. He provides some documentary evidence as to their rejecting both matchlocks, and the clunkier and heavier of the flintlock muskets, preferring the shorter, lighter guns. See the initial chapter, "Arming the American Indian".

link

I have SWoW in the giant To-Read pile.

Bob Murch:

Great figures! Hoping to buy some as soon as they're available.

What end of the 28mm continuum would you say these tend toward: "true" 25s, "standard" 28mm, or "heroic" 30mm?

These are standard 28s.

When will these be available and will they be available in the states?
Mark