"D-day RAF ground attack aircraft" Topic

Any suggestions what would be used for daylight groound attack rocket missions apart from the Typhoon on D-day?

(Aeroplanes are not my strongpoint :) )

P47 Thunderbolt

Mosquitoes and Beaufighters, probably, but not in direct support of ground troops. Spitfires were air-superiority fighters, Tempests were used against V-1s and other raiders, Hurricanes and Kitty hawks were mostly retired (or sent on to Burma).

Aren't Typhoons sexy enough for you ?

No problem about Typhoons at all, just trying to get a cheap 1/100 one so looking for alternatives.

Sorry Muncehead, I was looking for RAF types, my Tommies would be safer with those Thunderbolts flying over someone else… lovely pics though, thanks.

For RAF rocket projectile ground attack during the Normady campaign I think your stuck with the Typhoon as the only platform used.

Mmm, I feared that. I tend to use 1/144 for my 15mm games but for a demo game I think they won't look so good so wanted a single 1/100 one- as it will be a one off I was hoping to find something cheap. I'll look behind the sofa cushions.

Spits were also used on ground attack, LF versions of Vs and IXs particularly but other Marks as well. While 2nd TAC was the primary ground attack pretty much everything, RAF as well as USAAF was turned loose in Normandy. Most Spits would have probably been carrying 100 lb bombs but a few rocket armed may have been available.

Hurricanes very nearly saw a much more active role – this is from: 'Flying Guns – World War 2: Development of Aircraft Guns, Ammunition and Installations 1933-45' by Emmanuel Gustin and Tony Williams:

"The IID was not the only Hurricane to carry the 40 mm S gun. The Hurricane IV, of which over five hundred were built, was introduced in 1943 as a specialised ground attack variant. A more powerful engine enabled more armour to be fitted and it had a "universal wing", designed to take various armament options including the S gun or rocket projectiles (RPs); the changeover could be made by five men in about forty minutes. Most saw service overseas but three squadrons based in England (Nos. 137, 164 and 184) were equipped with this aircraft.

Official British reports during 1943 concerning the effectiveness of the armament options for the Hurricane IV make interesting reading. The 40 mm gun was seen as the precision weapon, usable against smaller targets such as locomotives and tanks, while the RPs were thought to be more effective against shipping. It was recommended that all Hurricane IVs should normally be issued fitted with the S gun, with conversion kits for RPs provided, and that squadrons should employ both variants, with different flights being equipped with RPs or S guns. Operations were conducted by 11 Group over France and against coastal shipping, and both guns and RPs were evidently considered satisfactory.

In June 1943 the RAF's order of preference in weapons for use against tanks was given as: 1st 40 mm S gun; 2nd 20 mm cannon with Mk III AP ammunition; 3rd RP with 25 lb AP head; 4th RP with 60 lb HE head; 5th .50" Browning HMG; 6th 9 lb AT bomb. Only the first three of these were considered to be serious anti-tank weapons. Some comment on these preferences is necessary. The 20 mm AP Mk III, as mentioned in Chapter 1, was a tungsten-cored round of considerable performance which was, in the end, not adopted. The RP with 25 lb AP head could penetrate 70-80 mm, which compensated to some extent for its lack of accuracy. The RP with 60 lb HE head was discounted against tanks as it could only penetrate 25 mm, but this assessment rather underestimated the cataclysmic effect of detonating such a large charge against a tank.

The 9 lb AT bomb, jovially known as "Puffball", used a squash-head rather than a HEAT design and a fighter-bomber was expected to carry twenty-four of them, to be released in one diving pass at low altitude. Despite the success of similar (but smaller) Soviet and German weapons, Puffball proved unsatisfactory due to sympathetic detonations in mid-air (the explosion of the first hits setting off the others) and significant damage from blast and debris being suffered by the carrying aircraft. The 40 mm S gun, 20 mm AP Mk III and 25 lb AP were all considered capable of dealing with the German Mk IV tank and it seemed that the S gun-equipped Hurricane Mk IV would have a part to play in the forthcoming invasion of Europe. Despite this, all Hurricanes were withdrawn from European service in March 1944, just three months before D-day."

Spitfire IX, 74 Squadron.

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'The Squadron itself was withdrawn to North Africa and continued to fly offensive sweeps and convoy patrols before returning to England and North Weald and Lympne in April 1944, flying new Spitfire IXs, attacking enemy railway yards and transport and escorting bombing raids on V1 sites in France prior to D Day. On that day itself 74 flew patrols over the invasion fleet and after the landings attacked German positions. In July it moved to Tangmere as part of 134 Wing and then moved to France as a component of the 2nd TAF with 145 Wing. Flying in support of the advancing Allied armies 74 was credited by the Canadian 4th Armoured Brigade as providing the ‘closest air support to date!' The Squadron advanced as the Allies advanced and it was based fleetingly at Lille, Courtrai, Duerne and Schijndel. In March 1945 it received Spitfire XVIs which it flew alongside its LFIXs. By April it was at Droppe in Germany and that is where, on May 2nd, it received news of the German surrender. Its last wartime operation was an armed reconnaissance in the Wilhelmshaven area.'

Very interesting stuff. And which firms up in my mind that when World of Warplanes gets around to adding Hurricanes, they'll form part of a British Ground Attack line.

P-47 for sure. . There is some really nice videos out there of their strafing missions. Perhaps these may be helpful. Robert

2nd TAF and the Normandy Campaign
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D-Day 1944: Air Power Over the Normandy Beaches and Beyond
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Tactical Air Power in Normandy
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Third Army and XIX Tactical Air Command
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XIX Tactical Air Command and ULTRA
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Air Force Tactical Operations: WWII and Korean War
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Armaments in Miniature make a 1/100 scale Typhoon. I have two for my British forces in RCAF markings, which are also available from AiM. Dave Schmid is a great guy to do business with.
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BWW

Sorry Muncehead, I was looking for RAF types, my Tommies would be safer with those Thunderbolts flying over someone else…

Yeah, I'm considering using 9thAF aircraft for my German Air support.

Without defining cheap , OG do a 1/100 typhoon, easier if you are in the uk than AIM (and getting hit with import duty)

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Thanks
Simon

I second AIM, no problems, lovely models and a quick turnaround

You might want to check Ebay for a Model Power Typhoon. They had a really super one, have one myself, in 1/100th all compete but for some reason it is now discontinued.
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Air Lines: Anglo-American Tactical Air Operations in World War II Dr Thomas Alexander Hughes
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The Long Gestation and Difficult Birth of the 2nd Tactical Air Force (RAF) Dr David Ian Hall
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There was an operational role for the Hurricane during Overlord, though sadly not one really relevant to a tactical wargame! A couple were used as high-speed couriers bringing war correspondents' dispatches back from the beach-head, straight to London for onward transmission to Allied countries' newspapers. Operated out of the Advanced Landing Grounds, alongside the Typhoons. The Hurricane had a useful stowage hatch behind and below the pilot on the starboard side, in which the dispatches were placed.

At least, unlike Gustav the heroic homing pigeon awarded the "animal VC" for bringing back the first D-Day dispatch, getting crushed to death by a clumsy Flight Sergeant wasn't an issue.