| ferg981 | 27 Nov 2013 4:05 p.m. PST |
All I am planning on refighting the Battle of Barossa in Autumn next year, and I am looking to gather sources (particuarly orders of battle and uniform plates) as well as general informative resources to put together a briefing for the Generals I will be using 28mm figures and Black Powder rules. Does anyone have any suggestions/ideas on re-fighting this battle? Thanks F |
| vtsaogames | 27 Nov 2013 4:15 p.m. PST |
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| Garde de Paris | 27 Nov 2013 5:51 p.m. PST |
I recall that the French 8th de ligne lost its eagle here. It was part of the Ist Corp, 2nd Division, and served with the 16th leger; the 45th line and the 54th line. These were all 3-battion formations for much of the war. The 16th leger wore long tailed coats with pointed blue lapels edged white, blue cuffs edged white red cuff flaps edged white, blue turnbacks edged white. The Carabinier and Voltigeur companies were unique in having scarlet edging to their blue vests, and their uniform coats. Voltigeurs with yellow collars edged red. Tradition Magazine #60 describes a voltigeur drummer in dark green coat, lapels, cuffs all edged scarlet, red flap but white turnbacks and white vest with no edging. Shako with yellow top and bottom bands and side "v"s. Braided shako cords yellow also. Tall solid green plume! Green epaulettes with red crescent. White metal crowned eagle plate, white metal buttons. They are all shown with baggy overalls of brown and tan. GdeP |
| Garde de Paris | 27 Nov 2013 8:20 p.m. PST |
The 8th de ligne had only one unique feature that I can recall, and that was that he grenadier bearskin had a brass plate on front, but a black leather visor below. It is also most often represented with having simple "slash" cuffs for all companies: red cuff edged white on top, but red edging to the cuff opening – no cuff flap. The fusiliers also had an unusual brass plate on their shakos that looked at a distance like the sunburst plate on the Vistula Legion infantry shakos. The 45th de ligne lost its eagle at Waterloo. I recall an illustration in the Otto manuscript, about 1807, of a grenadier with pale blue collar and cuffs, instead of scarlet. Rigo shows a sapeur with rich sky blue collar and lapels with NO scarlet edging. The 54th de ligne is sadly lacking in details, except for an unusual sapeur in the Otto manuscript, wearing what appears to be an early version of the Bardin regulation coat of the 18q1 |
| Garde de Paris | 27 Nov 2013 8:22 p.m. PST |
The 8th de ligne had only one unique feature that I can recall, and that was that he grenadier bearskin had a brass plate on front, but a black leather visor below. It is also most often represented with having simple "slash" cuffs for all companies: red cuff edged white on top, but red edging to the cuff opening – no cuff flap. The fusiliers also had an unusual brass plate on their shakos that looked at a distance like the sunburst plate on the Vistula Legion infantry shakos. The 45th de ligne lost its eagle at Waterloo. I recall an illustration in the Otto manuscript, about 1807, of a grenadier with pale blue collar and cuffs, instead of scarlet. Rigo shows a sapeur with rich sky blue collar and lapels with NO scarlet edging. The 54th de ligne is sadly lacking in details, except for an unusual sapeur in the Otto manuscript, wearing what appears to be an early version of the Bardin regulation coat of the 1812 period onward. It had a dark orange plastron or turned back lapels. He also wears a version of the fur colpak. Perry does a command 6-pack for the 1808-era French in metal, and the sapeur with colpak looks perfect for this regiment. GdeP |
| Garde de Paris | 27 Nov 2013 8:33 p.m. PST |
Here is a link showing illustrations of the 8th de ligne from the Otto manuscripts. Unfortunately, most of the Otto illustrations show red cuff and red flaps, which were much less frequent than red cuffs, blue flaps. Bucquoy shows the regiment with simple slash cuffs. link Note shako plate on the fusilier on the right illustration, but not on the officer. Not also the leather brim or peak on the bearskin on the left figures. GdeP |
| Sparker | 28 Nov 2013 12:53 a.m. PST |
Well this is how we did it for the 200th:
link |
| ferg981 | 28 Nov 2013 3:07 a.m. PST |
Thanks guys I'm going to rattle out an OOB this afternoon to see what troops I'll need to buy F |
| ferg981 | 28 Nov 2013 9:36 a.m. PST |
All I've found this – seems to be a useful resource for all Peninsular battles link F |
| Garde de Paris | 28 Nov 2013 12:23 p.m. PST |
This order of battle shows that battalions of the 1st Division of the I Corp were present: 9th Leger; 24th de ligne; and 96th de ligne. Later these were joined by 3 battalions of sailors, who manned the guns of the siege lines at Cadiz. Missing are the 3rd Division: 27th leger; 63rd de ligne; 94th de ligne and 95th de ligne. Must have been holding the siege lines. Informaton later about the 1st Division uniforms. GdeP |
| Garde de Paris | 28 Nov 2013 1:41 p.m. PST |
link The third figure from the left, top, is a voltigeur drummer of the 96th de ligne. Very sombre compared to earlier times. Note the all-green epaulettes – booo – ing! |
| Garde de Paris | 28 Nov 2013 4:00 p.m. PST |
That's boring, not "boo-ing!" I found an example of the sapeur of the 24th de ligne with sky blue lapels edged red, so did a drummer with sky blue collar, lapels, cuffs, flaps and turnbacks, edged red. Also gave the Grenadiers bearskins with brass plate and white cording. GdeP |
| Garde de Paris | 28 Nov 2013 4:01 p.m. PST |
Hello, Sparker: Any chance to show some of your troops closer? I enjoy studying how other paint their troops, and what makers the prefer. Yours look really good. Are they 28's? |
| Sparker | 28 Nov 2013 11:29 p.m. PST |
Thanks mate. Yes these are all 28mms – mainly Perry plastic and Front Rank, with a few old Minifig 25mms from my youth that I can't bear to replace! 'Close ups'? I'm about as keen on close ups as an ageing tart – my painting philosophy is keep it simple and fast – I learnt my painting skills slapping battleship grey onto destroyers using a broom – so long as it kept the salt out and the rust down it would do!
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| ferg981 | 29 Nov 2013 5:29 a.m. PST |
Lovely figures! I'm currently re-doing all my British battalion's as my painting technique has improved considerably since I did them. F |
| Garde de Paris | 29 Nov 2013 6:56 a.m. PST |
Your painting is wonderful! I have a lot of old Stadden 30's, and they are hare to paint well. Their sculpting detail is accurate, thus requiring skills I have not developed to do "proper" shading and the like. The Victrix and other modern figures (I have not Perrys yet) have exaggerated detail, with cuff buttons and tapes that might be 1/2 thick inch in reality, allowing inking to work well – for those who know how! So I go with the old "toy soldier" look, but with flat paints (semi-gloss for boots, bullet pouches, shako brims and the like. Faces look great – two tones of flesh? and brown inking? I have been trying to do 3-4 shades of browns for hair. But little time. GdeP |
| Sparker | 29 Nov 2013 2:12 p.m. PST |
Yes the faces are easy, they have to be for my mass production painting technique: 1. The figures are first sprayed with a flat black undercoat 2. 4 patches of light brown/'tanned flesh' applied to the forehead, chin and each cheek in a diamond formation – obviously leaving a border of the originial black undercoat 3. 3 patches of flesh/'dwarf flesh' applied to each cheek and ridge of nose, again of course leaving a fair border of the brown – and you're done! Note I don't bother with the lips, I figure these would have been stained with gunpowder anyway! Close enough for government work! |
| ferg981 | 01 Dec 2013 1:37 p.m. PST |
Can someone please advise me Did Barnards Flank battalion have Portuguese infantry in it? They are mentioned in some sources and not others F |
| Garde de Paris | 01 Dec 2013 2:42 p.m. PST |
The 2-battalion 20th Portuguese Line regiment was part of the garrison of Cadiz. Yellow collar and cuffs, edging red. I do not know if they had a light company, but would have had a grenadier company. Arguments currently state that total of 10 companies for the two battalions, originally with one of each. Might be fun to do both! They would have been larger than British flank companies by a factor of 6 to 4. |
| Garde de Paris | 01 Dec 2013 5:52 p.m. PST |
I found some notes on these units, and add the fragments: 24th line: Bearskin, red plume and cords; brass front plate. Voltigeur with Yellow over green over red plume, into yellow ball. Green cords. Green epaulettes with yellow crescents. 96th line: Bearskin, red plume, white cords. brass plate. Otto Manuscript shows voltigeur with yellow top and bottom bands, and v's on side of shako. Green cords and pompom. green epaulettes, yellow crescent. I chose to use the Rousselot color scheme, as later in the war. 8th line: Voltigeurs with all-green epaulettes and plume. Green and yellow mixed cording and flounders. 45th line: Grenadiers with shako, top and bottom band, cords, and tall plume scarlet. GdeP |
paints brigs for the British fleet.
