"Tank games" Topic

Are there currently any good predominately Tank games, looking for 28mm, but may be willing to go lower scale? I am looking for something other then FOW.

NUTS has very good tank rules where one model equals one vehicle. We ran a demo game at a convention with 80+ tanks on the table handled by six newbies and it was fought to a conclusion in two hours.

Mechanics focus on if a tank is destroyed, disabled or the round doesn't do damage. NUTS has stats for over 70 vehicles for the British, Germans, Russians and US.

Doesn't use the traditional IGO UGO turn sequence. Instead its the Reaction System where you do something that cases a reaction from the enemy.

Crew is broken down in each tank by their roles. So a typical sequence could be you move into my sight, my Tank Commander reacts and orders to fire, the gunner fires and the loader tries to reload.

If I miss or the hit doesn't damage you react, maybe fire back or retire.

link

Yep, I'll second Nuts and also mention TooFatLardies new Chain of Command rules. To me, both give more "human" results than many rules that treat tanks like automatons that will always do precisely what a player wants.

Agreed!

28mm seems a strange choice of scale for a predominantly tank game. I'd go for BKC in a smaller scale if you want to get a lot of tanks on the table.

Chain of Command is great with tanks, even though it is marketed as a "tank" game. If you are looking for a higher level game with infantry squads as the base unit in addition to individual tanks then IABSM and Fireball Forward are good choices, both are card driven designs with good tank rules.

If you are looking for extra crunchy tank rules then take a look at Schwere Kompanie, although it is written for 6mm you can up the ground scale so that it works with larger vehicles. This game has a demo lite version available for free.

Finally – if looking for a platoon stand level of game look at FistFull of Tows, despite the name it has all the charts and rules for WWII included – I've used it to game out Panzer Leader and Panzer Blitz scenarios using miniatures. Once again a 6mm rule set but some have used the rules straight out with 15mm, perhaps using 2" = 1" would work for 28mm.

I use 28mm and it works great for tanks battles! A squad of tanks working through the hedgerows or advancing through a small village. Nuts is what I use and they are great for tank hunting!

Where can I get the Schwere Kompanie demo lite version?

thanks everyone for the ideas, I am going to take a look at all the systems. What is the system BKC?

> www3.telus.net/Ritterkrieg

Click on the picture of the tank on the right.

There are no good tanks games for 28mm.

This is new. I know little about it from ZVEZDA -- WWII: Tank Combat. There armor is 15mm and very nice. I have some of it.
link
link
link

There are no good tanks games for 28mm.

I would have to disagree with that. Have played several tank games with 28mm tanks and had great fun.

Try Mein Panzer

I would have to disagree with that. Have played several tank games with 28mm tanks and had great fun.

I had loads of fun playing with green army men and Remco bull dog tanks. Doesn't mean it's a good tank game.

I had loads of fun playing with green army men and Remco bull dog tanks. Doesn't mean it's a good tank game.

That rather depends on what your definition of a good tank game is. I've played games in smaller scales that weren't good tank games. In 28mm I've played games that I would consider good, plausible results, fun to play, easy to pick up. Your view may differ.

Years ago we heard that a good tank game needed to have manuever. To be able to flank an enemy. I don't see that happening with 28mm scale tanks on a 5' x 5' table.

Years ago we heard that a good tank game needed to have manuever. To be able to flank an enemy. I don't see that happening with 28mm scale tanks on a 5' x 5' table.

If that's your definition you won't find many good tank games in any scale. Wall to wall tanks, which I've seen a lot of in FoW (and other games, before the fanboys jump down my throat) doesn't allow for manoeuvre either. However with a bit of imagination and some terrain you can set it up so tanks can manoeuvre for flank shots with a 28mm game. Yes if you have a flat open steppe it is boring, but fight around a BUA or amongst Bocage and it becomes a lot more interesting.

If that's your definition you won't find many good tank games in any scale.

It's not my definition. But I bet, if this forum's archives go back far enough, we can find a whole lot of the people who posted years ago as their definition. That was before the terrain had to be a special way before the game would work.

You can make tanks in the desert (or open steppes) interesting/fun, but you need to model more terrain REGARDLESS OF WHAT RULES YOU USE!!

You need to model low ridges, shallow valleys, etc. Things that allow tanks to hide, but don't block line of sight beyond them.

Tank games. My experience is that few rules have what it takes.

Basic list of requirements, not needing pages of rules. (admittedly based on our game but this is why we wrote MG to get these considered).

– Need to diffrentiate between Unbuttoned and buttoned up. Many commanders were shot through the head. That means there were good reasons commanders chose to get their head out of the armour. You need to have rules that reflect this.

- Tanks go fast but can't stop instantly and cannot fire on the move, with any accuracy.

- Tanks can ram tanks if they are very close.

- Buttoned up tanks have little fear from indirect fire.

- Tanks skirmish from hull and turret down and you need to reflect this. They will fight if at all possible from pre-surveyed positions.

- Tanks with few radios are much less effective. Holbart showed that between the wars but many countries did not addopt it. It needs to be refelected.

- If you are inclned, some tanks had a slow rate of fire as the gunner had to reload the gun ( some French tanks had this problem).

- Tanks benefit from having smoke dischargers.

- Tanks cross country performance is not as good as folk think. The old post war LAW 72 was only calibrated for 12mph lead as it stated in the manual you would never see a tank on a battlefield going faster.

- A small tress will not stop a tank. A small slope may not stop a tank. A a small tree covered slope may well stop a tank. (source moderen US manuals).

- Tank turrets cannot traveres instantly 180 degrees.

Feel free to add more if you think they are key. I have left out guns and ammo as they are often done to death by most rules. (appart from crossing rate which is too hard for a simple game).

Check your game see which ones it ticks and then decide what you actually want.

Even then Lion in the stars is correct. Only with credible terrain will you get a credible game.

Or you could use 1/285 tanks and sit on the edges of your table and pick each other off…now that is as real as it gets…fun I dont think so. If you use good terrain with good tactics…is what makes the games interesting and fun.

Fulb3546,
Not quite got the comment aim. At 1mm to 1m tank ranges would be about 750mm for early wat tanks (750 m). That would not appear to be the edge of the table. Even in modern battles range is typically 500 to 1500m for a tank engagement. 1800m if you are a German 88mm in good form in the desert and shooting at Brits who have yet to learn. What intent were you intending to convey?

Fulb3546,
A 5'x 5' table would be 1500m in a 1mm to 1m scale. Or 3000m in a 1mm to 2 m scale. So you do have room to maneuver. So you could choose make the battle anywhere rather than always making the fight from the ends of Mrs. Jenkin's garden.

LOL… I stand corrected…I was just trying to make a point about terrain being necessary along with good tactics regardless of scale used. True the smaller the scale more room but that doesnt limit the fun to be had if you choose to game in a larger scale if you do it right.

well i gotta put my vote in for Jagdpanzer 2nd Edition.
it's a straight forward armored game, with very good infantry rules if you want to use infantary.
it plays very quickly if you are playing an armored only game. adding infantry will of course add more game time, as will any game. but it plays really fast with just armor alone. and you can use as few or as many tanks as you want. from one section to a battalion.

It's not my definition. But I bet, if this forum's archives go back far enough, we can find a whole lot of the people who posted years ago as their definition. That was before the terrain had to be a special way before the game would work.

Not that fussed about what others think makes a good tank game. I'm happy with the games I play. The terrain doesn't have to be a special way, just realistic.

Way back in the 70s our club used to have double blind games pretty much every week. ww2 in 20mm.
These would be on duplicated tables.
At least 6 by 4 and often larger.
They usually involved tanks but also infantry.
They worked pretty well.
You might see a company of t34/76 on the table.
In fact I recall a game with just that but no infantry attacking a prepared position with about a section of german infantry in defence.
The germans of course had all sorts of toys and the close terrain meant it was imbalanced in favour of them.
I wouldn't call them tank games really but this is the best sort of way to game ww2 skirmish generally.
The rules used are rather less important than the suspense of not knowing what you face, let alone where it is.
If you can do it, then this is the way to go.
I would say that 20mm would be the largest scale I would use with this approach and if you have a bunch of 15mm figures then that's kind of the obvious scale.
We used 20mm because that and micro were the scales you could get stuff in back then.

Another fun variation was "crazy tanks".
This was double blind and each player randomly picked a tank. You could get a pz3 or a pershing. One option was a motor bike and side car carrying panzerfausts.
When your tank was knocked out you got another.
The winning player was worked out on the basis of least tanks lost, most enemy KO.
I suppose that's a tank game.
Fun.
Fantasy rather than realistic.

When I think of the term "tank games", I think of more than a company of tanks a side.
I think in terms of micro tanks and my many games using wrg. These rules were pretty simplistic but that allowed a lot of 1:1 tank action.

Tanks go fast but can't stop instantly and cannot fire on the move, with any accuracy.

That is one aspect that I emphasize in my home-made rules for my online games, but it's hard to get some players to get their heads around it. Basically, you can shoot or you can move, but you can't do both at once. Also you can't stop on a dime or make jack-rabbit starts.

Ditto The abominable Snowman. It is not that hard. That's why Manoeuvre Group exists. That was more or less our tick list and why we wrote them. It is simple rules but challenging to play. There are no typical rules about formations but other effects mean that tanks are best rolling down a road as a squadron with tail end Charlie watching your back in some cases.

I think we used to use 1mm = 1 metre with micro tanks.
And big tables.
I played in a version of the battle of the bulge which was over 5 tables. The one I was on was at least 15 foot long. I think 6 foot across.
Long time since 77.

Honestly, I'd run either Flames of War Tank Aces or Gearkrieg to play.

GK is a bit better, since there is actually a 'sensor' penalty for being buttoned up and the rules have damage to movement, auxiliary systems and weapon, plus light/medium/heavy/overkilled (brewed up) damage levels. Works pretty well for up to 8-12 models per player.

I played in a version of the battle of the bulge which was over 5 tables. The one I was on was at least 15 foot long. I think 6 foot across.

Yeah, back in the day we had some pretty long table games. One end was Arnhem and the other was XXX Corps some 6 scale kilometers away.

Updated link for Schwere Kompanie:

link

Cheers,

Troy

My new rules, Skirmish Action, are "Tank Friendly" for large battles in 28mm as well as 15 and 20mm. First, data for over 400 AFVs for all major countries is included with no need to buy additional briefings or supplements. Second, a variety of features such as Overwatch reward real WWII tactics. Third, the D6 combat system is simple yet reflects differences in tank armor and armament in a meaningful way. Tanks can be Forced Back, Suppressed, Damaged or Knocked Out. Finally, the turn sequence is not I GO U GO, but based on a modified card activation system that can be influenced by troop quality. At conventions new players could play on their own after the first turn. Games last about 2 hours. You can learn more at skirmishaction.com Cheers! Lee

Just a heads up Ritter your Buy it Now link doesn't work properly. Just takes you to PayPal sign in and doesn't generate an order.

"Another fun variation was "crazy tanks"." ….. Now played as a MMP game on the web under the name "World of Tanks".

;-)

B