"Hungarian Panther? Hungarian TAS Tank" Topic

Does anyone have a good source of information on the Hungarian TAS Medium tank in English ? If it had been produced I wonder how well it would have done. Robert

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I did find this though,
44M TAS Medium Tank

"The 44 M TAS is an attempt of the Hungarian industry, to provide the Honved (Hungarian army) with a medium tank powerfully armed and armored equivalent to the German Panther. The Hungarian had attempted to acquire the rights to produce under license the German tank but without success (However the Honved receive some Panthers originally intended for the Romania before its change of alliance). The Weiss firm inspired itself many of the German model to develop its prototype, including the inclined armour of it. However the Hungarian TAS weighed 10 tons less about than the Panther, was equipped with a strong forward-mounted turret and a suspension with bogie with 6 double-road wheels on each side.

Its main armament consisted of a German 75 mm KwK 42 L/70 gun and its defensive armament consisted of 2 machine guns of 8 mm Solothurn 34 / 40 M (one coaxial and one anti-aircraft). It was powered by two twin-engine Weiss Manfred V8 developing 520 HP, which allowed a maximum speed on road to 48 km/h. Its armor ranged from 20 mm to 120 mm. Weiss Manfred had completed its prototype in March 1944 but the tank was never put into production. The Hungarian firm worked on a tank destroyer version of armed with a 88 mm gun in casemate, an equivalent to the German Jagdpanther . This project will remain dead letter as to the TAS because of the destruction of a large part of the Weiss Manfred facilities during a US bomber raid on 27 July 1944."
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I like the Tas Rohamlöveg tank destroyer version better . Certainly a good couple of "What if?" AFVs IMO.And it looks like the 44M Tas was classified as a "Heavy" tank.Robert

"Tas Röhamloveg was a tank destroyer project, developed along with the 44M Tas tank, based on the same chassis. It was started in 1944, when some of the officers involved in the 44M Tas design came up with an idea that it wouldn't be actually bad to start a project of a heavy tank destroyer along with the tank development. They were influenced no doubt by the successes of such German vehicles, that were not only extremely deadly, but also cheaper to build than regular tanks. Their silhouette was also lower, they were harder to spot, easier to set an ambush with and generally suitable for the defensive warfare both the German and Hungarian armies found themselves in.

The project was (not very originally) named Tas Rohamlöveg ("Tas assault gun"). The turret was removed from the design and the (very low) chassis was built to somewhat resemble the dreaded Jagdpanther. While the lower frontal plate (usually covered by terrain) was 20mm, the massive frontal plate was 120mm thick and very well angled. The vehicle was planned with the German 88mm KwK 43 L/71, capable to knock out any allied tank – and two machineguns.

Just like the tank, this vehicle was supposed to be built by Weiss Manfréd. Two prototypes were ordered, but beyond that, little is known of the project. Some sources say that some parts were ordered and even manufactured, but no prototype was ever built due to the same air raid, that knocked out the Tas production."

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hmmm… nice looking, and capable, piece of kit…

The AG version looks a lot like the post war JP Kanone…

As for its effectiveness it all depends on how it would be used and integrated in the rest of the army. WWII is full of good tanks that performed very badly (Arracourt) and poor tanks that did very well if used correctly (see German tanks in France 1940).

With the 88mm KwK 43 L/71,low profile and armor I think the Tas Rohamlöveg tank destroyer version would have done just as well as some of the German tank destroyers. Robert

Tas Rohamlöveg tank destroyer version
"Characteristics:

(in the brackets: Jagdpanther statistics for comparison)
Crew: 5 (5)
Weight: 38 tons (45,5)
Lenght: 9,5 meters (9,87)
Width: 3,9 meters (3,8)
Height: 2,3 meters (2,72)
Engine: 2x Turán, 520hp in total (HL230, 700hp)
Armor
Frontal: 120mm (80)
Sides: 50mm (50)
Armament: 88mm PaK 43 (the same)
Speed: 45km/h (55km/h)"

I would say that they would have had trouble getting the gun from Germany. Supply and production was not propducing a lot of surplus over what was needed for German tanks. it would more probably have had the Kwk7.5cm L48 or some similar Hungarian gun.

Did the Hungarians have anything comparable to the 88mm KwK 43 L/71 or 75 mm KwK 42 L/70 guns? Robert

Could it perhaps been armed with a Hungarian 75mm 43M tank gun or perhaps the 105 mm 40/43 gun? Robert

"In April 1943 it was decided that a modern tank needed a 75mm long anti-tank gun. MÁVAG developed a special Hungarian version of the German 7.5cm KwK 40 tank gun which fired both standard German and special Hungarian ammunition. This gun, which allegedly differed considerably from the German model, became the 75mm 43M tank gun."
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