"Austrian Jager: Rifles and Carbines" Topic

I've read in more than one place that the Austrian Jager battalions were 2/3rds carbine-armed and 1/3rd rifle armed. Often the sources say the rifles were used in the third rank. Although it's not stated presumably these deployed as skirmishers for most engagements.

What I'm interested in is not the rifle-armed skirmishers but the carbine-armed others. They seem to have been raised from the same classes as the skirmishers and given the same light infantry training. However what little I've seen points to them generally being used in close order, often as elite assault troops as at Dresden and Leipzig.

I'm trying to get beyond personal supposition from limited evidence. So does anyone have anything more on how the Jagers were used, whether the 'cabines' were rifled or not, and what the benefit of the carbines were over muskets or rifles?

the carabines were not rifled but smoothbore, they were shorter than a musket.
The idea was that they could cover and protect the Jäger with the rifle, while they were re – laoding, which took more time than to load a musket with a cartridge.

I did see somewhere a website which described the carbine – and my recollection is that it was similar to that carried by heavy cavalry (dragoons), except the requirement for a bayonet. Beyond that I have seen very little more than supposition, and have a few myself!

Presumably the carbines were quicker to load than muskets as well. However just protecting the riflemen doesn't seem to be reason enough to have a 2:1 mix carbine:rifle.

I wonder whether their role as independent or avant-garde troops had something to do with it. With a large number of trained skirmishers and the ability to pour out volleys more quickly than muskets they would be ideal for quickly occupying a position and forcing the enemy to deploy properly to take it, thus giving time for the rest of the Austrian forces to come up and relieve them.

The faster firing carbines would also have an advantage in close terrain like woods and BUA, where their limited range was not so great a factor. Does that make any sense or bear any resemblance to known reality?

Jäger – even with carabines – won't fire volleys, also wheh skirmishing and firing on mass targets the carabine was almost as effective as the rifle, this was different to indivdual targets, like officers or ennemy skirmishers.

Thanks von Winterfeldt. Are their any English language sources or is this all from your own research?

One more advantage is the lighter weight of the carbine as opposed to the musket. In modern cavalry units, the dismounts use carbines even though it will only save them a matter of 300 grams or so. But that makes one hell of a difference if you are hauling it across patrolling patterns that screen or guard a corps / army flank or front. Also, jaeger and other light troops started fulfilling the role that the greasers used to fill in the 7YW for Austria. Traditionally deployed into complex terrain such as dense vegetation or built up areas. A shorter barrel makes a large difference in ones manoueverability in such terrain.

Ha, auto correct. I obviously meant Grenzers there.

@Ravenfeeder

I am not aware of any english language sources covering that interesting topic.

One can see a Jägerkarabiner M 1807 in the work by Gabriel :
Gabriel, Erich : Die Hand- und Faustfeuerwaffen der habsburgischen Heere, Wien 1990, page 230

Its length 1.23 m versus the musket of 1.5 m (M1807)

Learn something new every day, thanks for the education.

Just for interest, in the French Revolutionary Wars, the Austrians combined their Grenz Scharfschützen, which were armed with the doubled barrled rifle (one smoothbore) the other rifeld, into two powerfull battalions

Probably important to add that how they were armed may actually have less importance in regard to their battlefield effectivness than the doctrine for, and actuality of their use. 1798 is not 1809 is not 1813 when it comes to Austrian 'light infantry', and Jaegers are not the same as Grenzers of course.

It's quite a muddle with these fellows. I've only recently been able to ascertain with some certanty that 2 of the Grenzer Regiments in the 1809 campaign wore white, rather than the blue/brown.

Of possible interest?

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Amicalement
Armand

Nice miniature here.

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Hope you enjoy!.

Amicalement
Armand

The Grenz Scharfschützen were still in existance during the 1809 conflict, but were deployed and used in companies rather than battalions.