"Turbolasers vs Laser Cannons" Topic

I have recently been thinking of using some larger scale models in X wing. I have a Correlian Corvette and a Gunship and have an Imperial "Venator" class ship on order to stand in for an Imperial Patrol ship. Looking at these ships there seems to be basically 2 types of weapons: Turbolasers and Laser Cannons. Originally I thought these were interchangeable names for the same thing. Looking more closely it would seem they are primarily different in their roles: Turbolasers are longer ranged anti-capital ship weapons while Laser Cannons are more point defence weapons suitable for anti-fighter use.
So this brings me to find a way to represent these types of weapons in X wing. At the moment we have the standard laser cannon armament on all fighters (range 1-3 primary weapon) which must be basically how laser cannons would operate. We also have Heavy Laser Cannons (secondary weapon) but I do not think these are the best representative for turbolasers which AFAIK are even more powerful and longer ranged.
Turbolasers also feature on the Death Star and were shown to be pretty "useless" against small fighters. Here are some draft ideas for these weapons in X wing.
Turbolasers can be used against "small" targets but only hit on a critical. If fired at a "large" target then they hit on a "hit" or critical result but count all hits as criticals. So basically all Turbolaser hits are criticals against small and large targets. The normal 3 range band would seem to be best for these targets to represent their slow tracking. They can also be fired at "Capital" or "huge" targets at longer ranges (perhaps 2 to 3 range rulers?). These hit on focus, hit or critical results.

Anyway those are just some early ideas, feel free to share your views or ideas.

3 range rulers seems reasonable, and fits in with the old WEG stuff (turbolasers had 3 times the range of laser cannons.) I think you may be being too generous in their anti-fighter abilities though – they should definitely have a minimum range at least; their inability to track and engage fighters in close is a pretty crucial bit of Star Wars "fluff" as it were. (Indeed I'd be tempted to allow them to shoot fighters only at medium ranges – ie. more than 1 range ruler distant, but less than 2.)

Dom is spot on with my thinking and reading of the cantons. Turbo Lasers on the Death Star were designed for capital ships but had limited effectiveness against small fast attack craft such as the X-Wing. I also think that you should have to turn the Turbo Lasers and can only fire at ships in the arc. I recommend they must be set at the start of the game phase, and can only turn one 90 degree angle per turn.

VR
James Mattes

set them in the planning phase after all ships are commited.
allow them to turn 90 degrees in the movement phase at a cost of 1 attack die.

I've been thinking of these too (after the question of how to model a small orbitting space station was raised and I've been eyeballing model kits for the bashing….)

I was thinking maybe just 2 attack dice, only crits hit, but if a hit goes through, then roll X additional attack dice for hits and crits.

The triple range sounds good.

This was my take on the Turbolaser idea…

For our Full Thrust game we have 3 levels for direct fire weapons.

Turbo Lasers
Laser Cannons
Blasters

(Ion Cannons – totally separate weapon)

Only Blasters can target fighters and capital ships

Otherwise ships use point defense batteries.

I would think that making the Turbo Lasers less effective or non-effective at closer range would be very appropriate when shooting the fast moving fighters. Also like your idea of only hitting on a Critical (i.e. lucky shot). I mean it should be really hard to hit a fighter, but if they hit… the fighter should have little to no chance of surviving..

I always thought about maybe giving turbolasers a single attack die, but if they hit they did five points of damage or something. That way it is pretty easy to avoid them for the smaller fighters, but if you DID get hit you were in trouble. Balancing this with capital ships (which I assumed would have no agility dice at all) would be important.

Look at it from a WWII stand point (which the Star Wars combat is derived from).

Turbo Lasers are in effect, flak guns. Good against bombers, not so good against nimble fighters. Still, on a lucky shot, a flak gun would destroy a fighter no problem.

Laser cannon would be more like ground based machine gun/auto cannons. Much more limited range, and useless against bombers because of the range, but better against fighters and dive bombers.

I quite like the idea of Turbolasers only being effective at a minimum range, perhaps one range ruler so you can "get under their guns". I also like the idea of preplotting the fire arcs of these on the Death Star before ships movement is revealed.

Another idea is that a quad laser cannon battery could be treated like a "heavy laser cannon" in X wing: 4 Attack dice and treated as a secondary weapon making it useful at an intermediate range (well range 3 on a range ruler).
To follow the WW2 analogy:
Turbolasers are similar to 5" turrets
Quad Laser Batteries are like quad 40mm
Laser Cannons are 20mm/50cal

A possible issue is only rolling one Attack die per Turbolaser and needing a critical and then having a typical fighter roll 2 to 3 evade dice to cancel this. Chance of hitting goes from slim to remote. Using the "flak" analogy again then multiple Turbolasers could perhaps fire together at the same time and the fighter just gets one chance to evade the barrage. This would be faster to resolve too. So a Turbolaser battery can use concentrated fire. This also could mean they could get Target Locks, rerolling misses to represent fire control centres.

Turbolaser damage is also something to think about. Maybe this needs a roll to hit and roll to damage mechanic or each hit does X damage.

Proposed rules:

Turrets must be turned to the desired facing, before any fighter movement takes place.

Maximum turn is 90 degrees.

Turrets may only target fighters in their "turret" width arc, perpendicular to their front armor facing (or in direct alignment with their guns). Use a ruler, or yardstick to determine this (only fighters falling within the width of the measuring device may be targeted).

Range is unlimited for Turbolasers.

Not sure on the dice rolls, since a bit of playtesting needs to be done with the above rules, but suspect the rare chance to hit, especially at longer ranges, should be balanced with doing very heavy, if not catastrophic damage to the fighters.

Using that mechanic of a very narrow fire arc I would say that it could possibly attack everything along that line or at least if a friendly ship (ie: Imperial) was the closest target then this would be attacked to show "friendly fire" incidents could occur.

For damage possibly treat as a 5 Attack dice hit with focus, so only blanks do nothing and crits count as crits. This should typically cause between 2 to 4 hits.

… or simply count crit rolls as 2 damage.

Sounds good.

Yep, must shoot at the closest target, friendly or enemy.

Hence, the need to turn off the "flak" batteries, when Vader and his wingmen went in pursuit of the rebel scum.

Like the card

Thanks!