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"The Puma sci-fi tank in 15mm" Topic

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1,605 hits since 8 May 2013
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
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Tango0108 May 2013 11:49 a.m. PST

Nice concept.




Hope you enjoy!.


Personal logo javelin98 Supporting Member of TMP08 May 2013 12:00 p.m. PST

Sweet! I like the 6mm Dark Star minis, and it's nice to see these coming to the larger scale.

Mako11 Inactive Member08 May 2013 12:03 p.m. PST

Thanks for posting the article, Armand.

I hadn't seen the design pics before of it, but love the look of this vehicle. Glad to see they will be produced in the larger, 15mm scale, since the 6mm ones look so superb.

It is actually a Grav Infantry Fighting Vehicle, and I can't wait to see it, and a tank, for fire support, released for sale.

Earther Inactive Member08 May 2013 12:33 p.m. PST



That is superb.

(Jake Collins of NZ 2) Inactive Member08 May 2013 1:23 p.m. PST

So looking forward to the Darkest Star grav vehicles appearing in 15mm. They put everything else in the shade for me.

Splod89 Inactive Member08 May 2013 2:17 p.m. PST


(Major Disaster) Inactive Member08 May 2013 9:48 p.m. PST

Me likey! Me order many when available!

War Monkey08 May 2013 10:34 p.m. PST

Nice, can't wait for the others to come out!

Unrepentant Werewolf at work Inactive Member09 May 2013 2:12 a.m. PST

Bought them in 6mm, will buy in 15mm, would buy in 28mm as well.

Mako11 Inactive Member09 May 2013 2:44 a.m. PST

I hope the actual models are as crisp, and clean as the ones shown in the digital art.

Really looking forward to these, and as mentioned, could use some for 25mm/28mm as well.

Hopefully, sooner, rather than later.

Darkest Star Games Sponsoring Member of TMP09 May 2013 5:25 a.m. PST

Thank you gents! We can't wait to get them into production and onto the table tops.

You may be surprised to know that the orbitally dropped grav vehicles are very large beasts compared to their terrestrial counterparts. As they are meant to carry a full platoon of troops each they need lots of space, as well as needing to be robust. Think of them as the LVT5P of the future.

This means that in 15mm the Puma is slightly longer than a 28mm Stryker. I know that will bother some people, as it will dwarf the majority of the 15mm armor out there, but then again it is meant to. Same will got for the Lynx/Tiger and Zirhan and S'orhan. The rest of the series will be of appropriate sizes for their types and usages.

We have been looking into 28mm, but again, this the Puma will be HUGE in 28mm, and would take up a lot of table room, but would be dang imposing in a skirmish!

@splod: we'd love to cover all of the scales if it were cost-effective, but unless there are going to be 100 orders for 20mm sized variants you might just want to try and see how it sizes up for you in 15mm first. Would be nifty though…

Twoball Cane09 May 2013 5:32 a.m. PST

Oh wow. Looking forward to this in 15mm

wminsing Inactive Member09 May 2013 5:44 a.m. PST

Wow, this thing is going to be beast, but I appreciate the technological reasoning. Looking forward to seeing the actual model!


Eclipsing Binaries09 May 2013 7:52 a.m. PST

It's good to hear that these will be large, suiting their purpose. I'm just wondering how this will affect the final cost and postal cost to the UK?

Mako11 Inactive Member09 May 2013 11:26 a.m. PST

Sounds to me with your plans, that the 15mm may just work for 25mm/28mm scale, assuming people just want one squad per vehicle.

I was hoping for a squad level design, with a length of around 4" 5" long (possibly 6", depending upon how they scale out with the 15mm/18mm minis from various manufacturers), myself, in order to match up with other vehicles. Of course, in that size, I'd want multiples of each, for platoons, and companies, on the tabletop.

With a squad level design, I suspect you could sell more of them too.

They should be rather big, to carry 8 – 12 troops, plus room for engines, fuel, etc., but I'm not sure I'd want platoon-level sized vehicles.

Of course, I guess that will ultimately depend upon what final size you decide to produce them at.

Mako11 Inactive Member09 May 2013 11:39 a.m. PST

Assuming a scale of 5.5mms per foot, a Stryker comes in at around 5" long, in 28mm scale.

So, how long are you planning on making the Puma, in 3mm/foot scale, otherwise known as 15mm scale?

I can see a 5" long vehicle, working for me, in 15mm/18mm, since it is a long, and thin model. Looks like the height and width should be about 1", or just a little over that.

Am I close?

(Jake Collins of NZ 2) Inactive Member09 May 2013 1:05 p.m. PST

As Eclipsing Binaries said, you need to consider that the bigger you make them the more costly they will be to ship and the more potential customers you will lose.

Its a business call really, and over to you Darkest Star. But I won't be buying if I'm paying the same cost again in shipping.

Darkest Star Games Sponsoring Member of TMP10 May 2013 7:36 a.m. PST

Ok, so it's a little bigger than a 28mm Styker… The ones I have are around 12cm long, and the Puma is about 14.5cm long. Beast!

I know shipping is the monkey on everyone's back. It's really gone bonkers recently. A 1.5 lb package we recently sent to Australia cost almost $200 USD due to the very remote location in which the gent lived. Just crazy cost! We plan on having these made in Urethane Plastic, rather than resin, which in our experience holds detail better, bubble much much much less, and is both lighter and more durable (no shattering). This will hopefully help keep shipping costs down.

The thought of making them smaller did occur, and we gave it a swing, but the proportions just look too weird. It ended up looking like only 1/144 scale figures would fit inside. Now, I understand that this is to be a gaming piece, and thus is "representational" and can be fudged, but we see our minis as not just tokens but scale models. So whether we're working in true 1/100, or "15mm sized" or whatever scaling is being applied, making it look right in its environment and next to its "supporting cast" is important to us. Suspension of disbelief is one thing, but having a model that is supposed to carry a squad but only has a passenger area the size of a suitcase just won't do it for what we want the models to portray.

Ok, I'll be stepping off my soapbox now… :D
As we reveal other models, I think you'll really be able to see both the different sizes between the LODAVs and the NOE type grav vehicles, and how higher tech can make some things smaller when compared to the mid-tech wheeled and tracked vehicles.

Of course, seeing is believing, but we'll need to keep y'all in suspense just a bit longer….

Stuuuh Inactive Member10 May 2013 7:51 a.m. PST

Any chance that you will be making the 6mm grav jeeps in 15mm?

Light vehicles like those are a bit of a gap in the market these days.

Darkest Star Games Sponsoring Member of TMP10 May 2013 10:08 a.m. PST

Indeed we will, probably in wave 3. Have to have the figures first.

Mako11 Inactive Member10 May 2013 2:14 p.m. PST

Hmmm, shall await developments, but am a bit concerned about how these will match up with existing other ranges.

Granted, since you have multiple factions, that is less of a concern for your company, but suspect some gamers would prefer them to match up better with their ranges from other manufacturers as well.

For me, given the current ranges owned, and on sale by others, I think tanks and IFVs/APCs in the 5" range are at about the upper limit, at least for me, since most vehicles from other manufacturers tend to run in the 3" 4" range, with the occasional super-heavy vehicles running at 5" long.

Anything larger than that on the table is usually a dropship, shuttle, or other type of large spacecraft.

Assuming, based upon your photo, that I've got the relative proportions about right, e.g. roughly a 5:1 length to height ratio, at roughly 150mms long, the hull height will be about 30mm tall, or 10 feet, in 1/100th scale. A 5" long vehicle would scale out to roughly 8'4" in height, assuming a 125mm long vehicle, and 3mms per foot, which is the scale I generally use for 1/100th vehicles.

I think a 5" long vehicle would look fine, as a squad level orbital insertion craft, and for grav combat on the tabletop, in multiple units per platoon.

It'll be interesting to see how long the Tiger grav tank scales out to be, in 1/100th scale, in your vision of the future.

Thanks for taking the time to respond on the above issue(s). That is appreciated.

wminsing Inactive Member10 May 2013 3:13 p.m. PST

I think a 5" long vehicle would look fine, as a squad level orbital insertion craft, and for grav combat on the tabletop, in multiple units per platoon.

Except it's apparently a platoon transport, not a squad transport. I'd prefer the large size actually; something big enough to look like it could actually have landed from orbit would be appreciated.


Mako11 Inactive Member10 May 2013 4:23 p.m. PST

Ah, well, if it comes in at the planned 6" size, I may be able to use it for a squad of true 25mm troops.

Would make a great Ventauran IFV in that scale.

Darkest Star Games Sponsoring Member of TMP10 May 2013 4:53 p.m. PST

There are Ventauran vehicles coming. I love that they look like something the Zhodani would use!

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